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[Poll] How would you rate episode 804?

How would you rate episode 804?   

376 members have voted

  1. 1. What's your rating from 1-10, with 10 being the highest/best?

    • 1
      74
    • 2
      24
    • 3
      33
    • 4
      29
    • 5
      30
    • 6
      33
    • 7
      52
    • 8
      48
    • 9
      31
    • 10
      22


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MODIFIED MCSHANE SCORING SYSTEM PRESENTS

GAME OF THRONES, SEASON 8 EPISODE 4, "Last of the Starks" aka "Who left the fucking Starbucks cup on Dany's table?"

Were there tits?  ALMOST but not quite.  Were there Dragons?  Yes, although it appears we'll have to change this category to "was there a dragon" going forward.  Starting Baseline:  5 out of 10

The funeral was some good shit.  Dany crying and whispering to Jorah's corpse one last time.  SANSA CRYING AND PINNING A DIREWOLF PIN ON THEON look if you didn't get at least a trickle of tear over that then you need to sense a raven to your therapist.  Similar shots of Sam at Edd, Arya at Beric, and Jon at little lady Mormont.  Jon gives a solid and dare I say kingly sounding modification of The Night's Watch eulogy.  Then they torch everyone which I'm not sure is absolutely imperative now that the Walkers are gone for good (and Theon in particular should've gotten buried at sea?) but whatever, it looks cool and it is too many people to bury and there's the whole contaminated ground thing not that toxic air is that much better and the dead do deserve a bit more respect than to be dragon chow I GUESS.  Anyway, +1.5 for Jon sounding like a king and Sansa making Theon an honorary Stark.  [6.5]

Now it's fuckin PARTY TIME!  Leave no character interaction box unticked.  Gendry, with a little needling from Sandor, goes off to find Arya but walks into a lordship instead as Dany catches him, cuts him off, declares him legitimate and makes him Lord Gendry Baratheon of Storm's End.  Saw it coming because it makes all the sense in the world. Would've been a good time to throw out a few more titles, actually:  Tyrion being anointed Lord Lannister of Casterly Rock + Lord Paramount of the West with Ser Jaime as Warden would've been a nice move.  Officially giving Sam the Tarly holdings (which now would also presumably include L.P. of the reach and Warden of The South) would make sense too, as Dany continues to shore up every section of the kingdom outside the actual capital [it would also be interesting to watch her conspicuously leave Sam out because he's Jon's Guy, more on that later] Tyrion talks to Davos about being unhappy because there's still more shit to deal with after all this.  Tyrion tries to talk to Bran but Bran's more interested in being weird, as usual.  Tormund affirms both his crushes, talking about what a maniac and cool guy Jon Snow is for coming back from the dead all other assorted awesome shit.  GREAT shot of Dany getting insecure and jelly because everybody LOVES Jon and nobody at the party is really talking to her.  Too bad there's a fucking Starbucks cup on screen.  No, seriously.  Fuck, man.

Tormund makes another bid at his other crush, Brienne, who we are seeing DRUNK and SMILING for basically the first time ever and it's fantastic (because Gwen Christie is in serious running for Best Actor On The Show especially now that Iain Glen and Alfie Allen have finished up.   More on this later) because she's playing a drinking game with Pod and The Brothers Lannister.  Brienne eventually excuses herself to take a piss on the Blackfish Memorial Tree.  Jaime follows.  Tormund is adorably heartbroken for a few seconds before consoling himself with an implied whore because after all this IS still Game Of Thrones on HBO.  She's no Ros.  Neither is her teammate who Sandor roughly gives the brushoff too.  We get a Sandor/Sansa moment that FORTUNATELY does not end in 'shipping but they do have a nice chat.  Sansa is at last in proper Shake Hands & Kiss Babies mode.  UNFORTUNATELY her clunker of an end line, "everything I've been through has made me who I am" is in context a little too close to ITS GOOD THAT RAMSAY RAPED ME BECAUSE IT MADE ME STRONGER and any time I have to be reminded of perhaps the worst Adaptation Change in the history of the show specifically, or Poochie in general, I'm going to be a tad cranky.

I'm keeping an eye out to see if Alys Karstark actually survived or not but all I see is that damn Starbucks cup.

Dany quietly ducking out due to Harshed Vibe and Varys reading the room and following was a fun touch.

Back on the 'shipping front, Gendry, freshly minted as a lord, proposes to Arya complete with anachronistic kneeling.  Arya rebuffs him as she is No Lady [and she's still got A LIST to work through].  Gendry, who admits to not knowing anything about being a lord, is appropriately sad.  Lesson #1 In Lordship, Gendry:  marrying for love ain't a thing that happens.  Poor guy.  I'd hope Ser Davos takes it upon himself to help Gendry out.

Still on the shipping front, Brienne and Jaime.  I don't HATE this and it's well done for what it is but I don't think it's even necessary for them to hook up, kinda pales in comparison to the emotion of him knighting her a couple episodes back.  But it's good for what it was.

That was some party, wasn't it?  +1 for Gendry getting legitimized and Storm's End.  +1 for Sansa/Sandor interaction that does not end in 'shipping.  -1 for that interaction calling up the Ramsay shit and feeling a bit like another defense of the dumbest thing the show's ever done. a big MINUS THREE (-3) for the fucking Starbucks cup:  -1 for missing it when filming, -1 for missing it again in editing/post production, and -1 for viral product placement advertising for a corporation that doesn't need the damn advertising.  Seriously fuck this bullshit.  Dolorous Edd did not die and briefly come back as a wight (Cadaverous Deadd?) in defense of the realms of men to let shit like this threaten it.  God.  Damn It.  +1 for great acting from Gwen Christie.  +.5 for Arya kinda letting Gendry down easy.  +1 for Dany being jealous of Jon's charisma and being followed out of love & admiration.  -.5 for I still can't tell if Karstark is dead or not. [6.5]

Jon and Dany try a little 'shipping of their own but Jon's not into banging his aunt and, really, who can fault a guy for that.  Dany, who now seems to believe Jon's lineage claim [why?] wants him to swear to secrecy, even from his family, because that's the only way for it not to become an issue.  Jon swears he doesn't want the crown.  Dany astutely points out that it's going to be a headache whether he wants it or not, because other people are going to want him to want it.  She hints at marriage as a solution as she leaves. -.5 for Dany suddenly believing Jon's claim now when she was skeptical about it before.  +1 for Dany's [justified] paranoia about Jon's lineage coming to bear.  Jon has repeatedly chosen to give up his crown for his realm.  Cersei has repeatedly chosen her crown at the expense of her realm (and basically doesn't have the latter anymore). Jon's true lineage causes Dany to face that dilemma.  Just wish the show had more time to watch her struggle with that dilemma more slowly and believably (and in a better written fashion), unfortunately I'm remembering the rushed hatchet job that was Stannis' path to burning Shireen for all the wrong reasons. [7]


Strategy session is pretty straightforward, Alys Karstark was in the previous episodes and it doesn't look like she's there now so I'm back to thinking she Died Off Camera but it's hard to tell because the camera is naturally focused on the characters who matter more.  We tick the "Sansa and Dany disagree" box and the "Jon tries to smooth it over and appease Dany" box and as far as military plans go its decent enough, if you accept the hastily adopted premise that Dany needs the throne specifically and that she cannot abide Cersei being on the chair and thus "being able to call herself king of the seven kingdoms" when Dany's advisors should be pointing out to her that it's actually the other way around; Cersei has the throne but almost nothing else, ergo Dany has effectively already won.  It's announced that Yara has retaken the Iron Islands off camera and a generic "New Prince Of Dorne" has pledged fealty as well.  Dany's got the whole ball of wax outside the capital.  Or at least she will once she names Tyrion Lord Paramount Lannister Warden Of The West from Casterly Rock and makes Sam likewise in the South/Reach from Horn Hill.  Or, again, have her hesitate to give Sam that because Sam is Jon's Guy and she doesn't quite trust Sam.  That'd do a good job of driving the wedge between Dany & Jon and selling Dany's paranoia if they really are going the Mad Queen Reborn route with her like it looks like they are doing.  But smart tactics in this case don't make for good TV so strap yourself in for some Dumb For The Sake Of Plot as Dany decides to have Jon march on KL while Dany sails from White Harbor to Dragonstone to blockade the capital, expecting to handle Euron's fleet.  Why is Dany in such a hurry?  Does she only have 4 seconds left on the shot clock or something?  Oh, yeah, there's just 2 episodes.  Eh.  It'd be nice if they did a better job of selling the idea that Dany's need to take the capital immediately is rash, that she is queen of 6.75 of the 7 kingdoms and could get that last .25 in due time by starving Cersei out and having all the taxes and levies from everything else coming to her instead of Cersei, and at least wait until Cersei can't afford to pay the Golden Company anymore.  But no, everyone thinks the plan is fine.  Oh well.


-1 for a missed opportunity to do what I think they're trying to do with Dany more artfully and instead just letting the bolts and nuts of the plot rail shine through. -1 for Continued Alys Karstark Ambiguity.  +1 for continuing to play with the Warhammer miniatures.  +1 for the battle plan being competent.  -1 for the battle plan being an unnecessary rush.  +.5 for Sansa trying to stem the tide of video game battle logic by pointing out the Northern Army could use a little time to recoup from the whole surviving Ragnarok thing. [6.5]

"We need to talk" Sansa says at the end of the above scene, and the surviving Stark kids have a pow wow in which Arya is actually the voice of reason rather than Sansa, acknowledging that Jon did what he had to do to get Dany here to beat the WW, but that doesn't mean you have to keep blindly trusting her now.  Jon makes the sisters pinky swear to keep a secret, which Sansa balks at initially but she's finally on board, then we cut away as Jon tells Bran to tell them.  HAHA.


The actors have good chemistry with each other but that's the only good thing about the Bronn scene.  How did an enemy knight sneak through a castle full of people with a loaded crossbow?  Why are crossbow bolts reloading as fast as bullets in a clip?  Why is Bronn faffing about with warning shots?  Why does he believe Cersei will give him Riverrun?  Does this mean Edmure Tully is canonically alive or not?  Why does he believe Tyrion will give him Highgarden?  Why did this scene even happen when it didn't advance anything?  We already knew Tyrion would make a counter-offer if Bronn was ever paid to kill him.  -1 point for wasting everyone's time. [5.5]


Sansa immediately reveals she had her fingers crossed behind her back when pinky swearing to Jon and drops a "what if there were another option?" on Tyrion, to let him do with as he will.  I actually really like this.  From Sansa's perspective, Jon is walking south into a deathtrap like Ned, and he doesn't see it coming because he's dick-blind like Robb.  And like any good Tully daughter knows [not that this is mentioned], it's Family Duty Honor.  In that order.  Family, then Duty, then Honor.  So it's Sansa's job to do what she can to keep Jon alive despite himself, and in this case it's trying to erode Dany's coalition of brain trust.  Either Tyrion gets on board with helping Jon or just giving him something else to think about will lead to erosion of trust between Dany and Tyrion and Dany will take it out on Tyrion instead of Jon.  Jon helped, and one less ex-husband for Sansa to have to worry about.  Littlefinger would be proud if he wasn't so busy being dead.  +1 [6.5]


Tyrion immediately tells Varys.  Sansa's plan is working and Dany's dire prediction that Jon's lineage wouldn't stay secret for long is accurate.  Varys reminds us He Serves The Realm and seems all in on switching horses to Jon.  Tyrion has reservations.  Gotta figure he officially flips and dies for it next week now.  +1 [7.5]


Sandor rides away.  Arya joins him.  They both have unfinished business in the capital.  There's a fine line between being a badass and simply being an ass and who ever is in charge of writing lines for Arya lost sight of that line a long time ago.  But they're off to King's Landing for Unfinished Business and, pointedly, neither expects to come back.  Hmmm.


Tormund says he will take the Free Folk back north as soon as the land thaws back out and invites Jon to come back up to The Real North with him to be bros forever.  Adorable.  Jon of course refuses because he's got business.  JON TELLS TORMUND TO TAKE GHOST WITH HIM WHAT THE EVERLOVING FUCK.  Ghost, looking all the world like they forgot to include him until post production, is clumsily and lazily written out with some mealy mouthed bullshit excuse.  Remember how The Stark boys separating from or ignoring their direwolves used to be a big fucking deal and a huge warning sign that shit was about to go wrong?  What could be a great way to hint at Jon walking into PERIL goes down as a massive wasted opportunity because D&D hate the direwolves and have given them depressingly short shrift for the entire series.  Instead of "oh shit Jon's separating from Ghost this is bad" it's "filming the Direwolves is TOO HARD waaah waaah waaah so we're just getting rid of them."  Jon doesn't even pet Ghost goodbye what is this horseshit.  Jon Snow further cements his claim to the Dickhead Crown by hugging Gilly goodbye and telling her he hopes she has a girl in reaction to her telling him she wants to name the baby Jon if it's a boy.  Dude, come on.  At least the brohug and teary goodbye between Jon and Sam is nice.  Presumably Sam is off to Horn Hill to become Lord Tarly but who knows, really.  WE'RE SLASHING THE CAST.  EVERYONE MUST GO.  You get a write out and you get a write out and you get a write out.  A big -2 for doing the direwolves dirty one last time.  +.5 for the good teary goodbyes from Tormund and Sam. [6]


Dany chillin in the air with her dwaggins as her fleet sails to Dragonstone when suddenly Klingon Greyjoy de-powers his Cloaking Device and just like that Rhaegal is shot out of the sky.  The "scorpions" hit like cannons for some reason as the flagship carrying our named characters is blasted to bits and we get a fun shot of a mast (not of the fat pink variety) dropping down on Tyrion.  Cut to a beach where our named characters wash ashore.  Varys is secretly a Merman so of course he's fine.  Tyrion and Grey Worm survive as well, but Missandei is nowhere to be seen.  +1 for catching me off guard with Rhaegal's quick demise. [7]


So Missandei is of course captured and Team Dany shows up for a parlay on the premise that Dany wants the PR of giving Cersei one last chance to surrender/avoid bloodshed so it's not Dany's fault when she has Drogon burninate the peasants hiding inside the walls of King's Landing.  In fairness, I don't think any of them, certainly not Dany, expected negotiating with Cersei to actually work.  They do trust Cersei to observe the rules of parlay, however, and that's a bit of a stretch, especially given the recurring theme in Game Of Thrones/ASOIAF about how the old system of honor and chivalry is breaking.  But as D&D have repeatedly told us themes are for children and the Red Wedding was just about filming as much blood and guts as possible, nothing more.  So the parlay starts.  Never mind CleganeBowl, give me HAND-OFF!  Tyrion and Qyburn exchange terms and talk about  the screams of dying children ["it's not a pleasant sound" LOL Qyburn is fantastic as the face of Banal Evil] and it goes about as well as you'd expect, i.e. not at all.  Tyrion walks past Qyburn and appeals to Cersei and her maternal instincts directly.  But Cersei, and this show, have choosen violence.  Cersei gives Missandei a chance for last words, Missandei says "DRACARYS" and the only black woman on the show promptly gets stuffed in the fridge courtesy of Frankengregor's big ass claymore.  Whatever, I'm sure it'll make Grey Worm stronger and it'll all be worth it.  Dany is MAD.  I'm sure next week she'll "go overboard" but the problem is if they're trying to sell Dany going off the rails it doesn't work that well when the people she's going off the rails against Pretty Much Have It Coming.  When people pull your punk card you have to check them.  Besides, remember when Arya poisoned every male Frey and it was framed as KICKIN' RAD instead of Arya going overboard?  Anyway, +.5 for HAND-OFF~! -1 for Cersei, the woman who blew up The Vactican to wipe out her rivals and most of her family in one swoop, suddenly caring about the rules of engagement, and another -1 for the unimaginative route to fridging Missandei. [5.5]


Jaime bails on Brienne.  Brienne is distraught.  I'm mostly okay with this scene, though it suggests they had Jaime and Brienne bang just to make this more "sad" and I think this could've worked anyway without that.  Might even have been stronger to have Jaime remain a near miss for Brienne and THEN bail, taking her one chance at action with him.  Anyway, I think it's pretty clear Jaime is off to kill Cersei, doesn't expect to come back from the mission, and doesn't want Brienne to follow him into death nor does he want her to miss him when he's gone.  So he's being a dick to chase her away.  Like Arya throwing rocks at Nymeria way back when.  But this seems to have been less clear to the audience at large?  Lotta folks think Jaime is falling off the wagon and going back to her?  I guess it's an effective enough cliffhanger then.  I still think Jaime and Brienne banging is almost a step down after Jaime knighted her and this scene could've worked without it but this is by far the best bit of the last half of the episode. +.5


FINAL SCORE:  6 out of 10


First half of the episode was much more enjoyable than the second.  Props and costumes department are still bringing their A-game, music is fantastic, and there's good acting to be found, but the plot writing is leaving money on the table left and right and the dialogue is, to paraphrase the late Melisandre, The Script Is Dumb and Full Of Clunkers.  The end is in sight and the producers seem content to limp to the finish line so they can move on to some dumb show about What If The South Won The Civil War or whatever the fuck garbage they've got in the can.  Strong start, underwhelming finish, much like the entire run of the show itself.  I keep ending up saying what I've said about a dozen times before, because nothing's changed much lately.  We all know what the show was and what it is now, and what it could have been.  And whether the little nuggets of gold it still manages to drop are enough to keep you around is pretty much up to you.

But seriously, the fucking Starbucks cup.  God.

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For me it was much too noticable that plot and character behaviour were designed to reach a desired result. It went from 'that's a stretch' to 'impossible.'

When it becomes so obvious how a script is bending in-world rules to reach a certain outcome then that kills the suspense for me. Because I'm not immersed in the story world anymore.

I have to rate the episode as completely lacking any suspense. Having a forced storyline. But as usual great effort with costumes, buildings and cgi. Also the actors are good as usual. Wasted effort sadly.

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Posted (edited)

I have never given any episode of GOT a rating of less than 6.  Until now.  I gave it a 1 in protest.  I feel like I just wasted years of my life reading the books and watching this show. I have been holding out hope that in the end, all would be okay.  I see now that DD's really don't have a fucking clue. Very disappointed.

Edited by SunSpearViper

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9 hours ago, Talking Hodor said:

It's entirely possible she's faked the entire pregnancy to secure her power. Each person she told eventually granted her concessions or felt more obligated to protect her. If they specifically mentioned three children on the show, they might not have made a mistake. Or she could miscarry. Either way, no fourth child.

 

1. A black haired beauty who died of fever, unamed on the show.  Unborn in the books.

2. Jofferey Lego Head

3. Myrcella the Meaningless

4. Tommen the Matyr

 

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7 hours ago, lakin1013 said:

Last season, Tyrion went in to talk to Cersei while everyone else waited outside.  We never saw all of that 'talk'.  I think Tyrion made a deal for himself with his sister.  He is not above that, Tyrion is a survivor and a Lannister.   So, even if Cersei is a monster (and there is little doubt there) Tyrion might not be above saving her life too.

Personally, I think Tyrion told Varys because he, Tyrion, is worried about Dany too.  Not enough to do anything about it yet, but he does have his doubts.  It was interesting to hear Varys say that a Targaryen/Stark might actually be a great combination to rule (or something like that).

That's quite possible. Although it is difficult to imagine what kind of deal he could make that Dany would not consider treason. Even though Tyrion didn't have any problem killing his father, I can't shake the feeling that deep down he doesn't want Cersei dead. Just off the throne and out of the way.

Tyrion would be stupid to not have his doubts, but as long as he does have some faith in Dany, it seems he would keep the secret to himself. There's the potential for a lot of trouble there. On the other hand, considering the source, the further it gets from the source, I expect the fewer people there will be who actually believe it.

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5 hours ago, divica said:

In this season we have stories and arcs build for years and they aren t having resolutions. And then things are happening in a blink without any previous support.

Examples? Because I don't agree with your assessment, but it's quite possible I missed something.

5 hours ago, divica said:

Having problems because of the way danny handles justice has been foreshadowed for years. However having everybody love her for years, give her a romantic interest, making her someone you like and then in 2 eps take all those things away is just frustating the fans. It is awful writting...

Or, are they showing us the true nature of a Targaryen? That's how I'm reading it. Everybody loved her for years when she was in Essos. I, for one, have not liked her for quite a while. Everytime I start to think maybe, she shows what I think are her true colors.

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2 hours ago, SunSpearViper said:

I have never given any episode of GOT a rating of less than 6.  Until now.  I gave it a 1 in protest.  I feel like I just wasted years of my life reading the books and watching this show. I have been holding out hope that in the end, all would be okay.  I see now that DD's really don't have a fucking clue. Very disappointed.

Welcome to the party, bruh!

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18 hours ago, dbunting said:

That was Joffrey not Cersei, confirmed the following season by Cersei herself. She did give the order after Joffreys death and I think again after Tywins. I assume she sent Qyburn to do her dirty work since it is beneath her status to meet with a cut throat about killing her brothers. It includes Jaime because he betrayed her and went North. 

Oh yeah, that's right. I totally forgot about that. And I just watched the whole series AGAIN in December!

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19 hours ago, YoungGriff89 said:

The actual flashback was the very first scene of season five, the word valonqar is never uttered.

Thanks!

 

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19 hours ago, TyrionFan82 said:

Oh yea if he goes back and just falls under Cersei's thrall AGAIN it'll be like well what a waste.

 

I'm sooooo anticipating to have Euron taken by surprise and defeated. He's awful.

Well, ever since she took the throne, he seemed to be falling less and less under her thrall. Love is a strange thing though. It often defies all reason.

Just the sight of Euron makes my skin crawl, even more than seeing Ramsey did. I don't know how I'll ever be able to watch him in another show. But that really is a credit to the actor's skill.

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On 5/5/2019 at 10:21 PM, Clan O'Raghallaigh said:

Decent standalone episode again if we just ignore everything that has gone before and a certain degree of logic, so loses a few marks for that, so a 6. 

this is actually a good point. if i had never seen got nor read the books before, i would have been impressed. with context, it's a dumpster fire.

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Even the common folk can see the hand-waving and the hands of Dumb and Dumber pulling the strings of the puppets that behave with no consistency or character. Exactly like a mummers show for kids.

 

This time I have never seen online such a negative reaction to an episode of GOT. They are catching on. It is just too much and too blatant.

Even they could not see it going on much longer.

 

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On 5/6/2019 at 11:27 PM, legba11 said:

I forgot to say.  

W T F... Jon having a better claim has NOTHING to do with his genitalia.   Why are they trying to make this some sort of relevance to current social issues?  Jon has a better claim because his father was next in line.  Jon's penis-challenged sister would have a better claim the Viserys (Dany's penis equipped brother).  Why was that a point in the discussion?

The only right Dany has to the throne is by right of conquest.  There is no gray area at this point...

The gray area is getting the Lords of Westeros to actually (wanting to) believe that Jon is a Targ and even a legitimate one. As pointed out in the show, all his proof comes from his brother and his best friend, which is rather weak.

So Jon being a man is certainly a selling point in this society, especially when it comes to the Iron Throne where inheritance is even more unfavorable towards women after the Dance of Dragons.

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3 hours ago, Rhollo said:

The gray area is getting the Lords of Westeros to actually (wanting to) believe that Jon is a Targ and even a legitimate one. As pointed out in the show, all his proof comes from his brother and his best friend, which is rather weak.

To be fair, it would be fairly easy for Bran to prove his abilities by revealing things he shouldn't know to anyone who doubted him.  And the document from the Citadel could be retrieved (albeit with more effort).

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6 minutes ago, Rhienne said:

To be fair, it would be fairly easy for Bran to prove his abilities by revealing things he shouldn't know to anyone who doubted him.  And the document from the Citadel could be retrieved (albeit with more effort).

Good points but even if Bran proved his abilities beyond a doubt, people who just don't want Jon as king could still make a pretty good case that Bran is simply lying about Jons parentage to put his brother on the throne. And iirc the diary from the citadel only mentions a wedding (which should also be heavily questioned as illegal) between Rhaegar and Lyanna, not that they had a child.

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22 hours ago, dannyk65 said:

Welcome to the party, bruh!

To quote a great man: "It's a big shit sandwich..and we're all going to have to take a bite."

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22 hours ago, Sir Hedge of Hog said:

yep its all going to shit and if the spoilers are to believed then I cant watch any more!

I thought of that.  Pulling a GRRM and just shutting it down before the end. But I'm pot committed at this point. We're drawing dead and there's nothing left but to make the crying call.

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Jon's funeral oration was actually decent. I think Kit Harrington's acting was a bit better than usual.

A lot of chitchat, but I'm glad to get some actual dialogue!

I like Dany's move here. First she frightens Gendry by remarking on their history, then shows herself magnanimous. Further, now anyone who denies her queenship is also dissing Gendry and is therefore a meanie. Deft. It's been pointed out she could have done a bit more of this. Supposedly she's going nutters next episode; but we haven't seen any of that this season so far, barring a weird face she makes on Drogon later on. (I did wonder: who's at SE now?)
Also: maybe Gandry is an object lesson for Sansa? "See, I'm nice to those who acknowledge me." Who knows.

I also like the Sansa-Hound bit, even if they have rather underplayed that relationship generally. I wondered that Arya wasn't more feted; she did just save humanity, yes?

Speaking of Arya, I think she's a bit confused. Being a lady in the sense of the wife of a lord isn't necessarily the same as being a lady in the sense of needlework and courtesy armour and whatnot -- especially when the lord is Gendry who has been raised as a pleb.

Decent scene w/ Jon/Dany.

Dorne exists! And it's headed by Prince Random Chap.

OK, the battle tactics/strategy bit. I don't get this sort of thing very well. But: Is Tyrion really the kind of chap whose advice on the subject you'd want to follow after last season. Anyway, you can surely beat Cersei without destroying KL. Also, I'd have let Sansa talk to the officers. Wouldn't the chief officers be at the meeting already? I thought I saw GW. Apparently a decent number of kamikaze Dothraki survived?

Brienne-Jaime: I guess in Hollywood one hops into bed right away. Then Jaime drops her equally right away. Westeros is feeling very twenty-first-century-U.S.A. these days.

Hound/Arya for a ride is kind of cute. Just, please: no Arya-Hound sex scenes! Does this mean Arya kills both NK *and* Cersei? Sweetrobin points out assassinating Cersei is a better plan than what the Top Brass came up with. Not going back to Winterfell: why not?

And keeping up Sansa's antipathy to Dany does make for some tension, although one can't help noting that Dany did a good deal more in the war than did Sansa.

The scene w/ Jon, Sam, and Gilly is nice, but .... What did you say, Sam? "Not much to do in the Citadel"? Well, besides instant cure of greyscale and discovering the truth about Rhaegar and Lyanna and ...

Noot to be outdone in the incomprehensible department, Jon claims Ghost "belongs in the North". Dude. He belongs with *you*. And Jon is so offhanded about giving up Ghost, too. Weren't the direwolves kind of a big deal when they turned up *in the first episode*? Jeesh.

Jon apparently has charisma and Dany doesn't. And all that Mhysa business a few seasons back? Maybe she only has charisma in Valyrian.

Rhaegal's death is nasty. Why no "dracarys"? Burn that fleet, don't just make weird faces, khaleesi. It's dracarys time!

Missandei's death was pretty nasty, too. That's pretty powerful stuff. I did raise an eyebrow at Tyrion telling Cersei she's not a monster. And the Sept? That's so two seasons ago.

Final score: 6 or 7. I felt nice and went with 7.

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