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Rant & Rave Without Repercussion [book and show spoilers]

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Can I get some feedback here?

 

Am I alone in this, or do some of you guys also not notice the insane amount of things wrong with this show until reading other people’s posts. Sure I notice plenty of things wrong. But there is so much stupidity I don’t even think about when I really should be. Part of that is because I have forgotten a lot of the lore, but some of it is just me not noticing stuff. 

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9 minutes ago, The Scabbard Of the Morning said:

The idea that somebody can be given the Reach because you point a crossbow at the Hand, even though said person has no army, no bannerman, and no ability to maintain control, and furthermore can be basically captured and killed the moment he steps out of the room, is just so absurd that D&D have no basic understanding of the feudal system that is at work in Westeros.   

This is why they can't write any political intrigue plot for shit on this show without GRRM.  It's like somebody who's has no basic understanding of the parliamentary system trying to write a British political drama about a Prime Minister, and in it he has the Prime Minister trying to win an election based on the electoral college. 

https://i.imgflip.com/30blia.jpg

 

How would bronn survive 1 hour as lord of highgarden? The people of the reach would just kill him… 

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19 hours ago, FeastForCrows said:

Someone said Sansa was the only true Stark left. Was that what I was supposed to take from her this episode? Based on that premise, I feel like I should have been rooting for her. But, for me she just came off as jealous and overly vengeful. The drama was really forced. 

Arya must be a Stark, unless and until she ever gets married. Remember the whole "a girl is no one," "I'm Arya Stark?"

Okay, Bran is a tree, Jon never was a Stark, and Honorary Stark Theon Reekjoy sacrificed himself for no good reason. That at least leaves Sansa and Arya. 

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Just now, Snormund said:

Can I get some feedback here?

 

Am I alone in this, or do some of you guys also not notice the insane amount of things wrong with this show until reading other people’s posts. Sure I notice plenty of things wrong. But there is so much stupidity I don’t even think about when I really should be. Part of that is because I have forgotten a lot of the lore, but some of it is just me not noticing stuff. 

There is too much stupidity for a single person to notice.

When I watched the ep I thought it had the best dialogue of the season. Like people actually have smart conversations most of the ep. So despite the ridiculous fighting scenes I thought it was the best ep of the season.

Then I had time to think about the actions of several characters and read some coments and realized that it had much more stupid than what I realized at first...

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The Stark's haven't learnt a thing.

If we take a look at 3 major Stark things.

Ned in regards to the incest between Cersei and Jaime.

Rob breaking his vows to the Frey's

Jon letting Bran tell Arya and Sansa about his secret.

If there's one thing they should have learnt is to handle situations a lot better and not be so trusting.

Maybe the manner in which the Stark deaths happened was terrible but they've been acting ridiculously since the beginning.

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1 minute ago, darmody said:

Arya must be a Stark, unless and until she ever gets married. Remember the whole "a girl is no one," "I'm Arya Stark?"

Okay, Bran is a tree, Jon never was a Stark, and Honorary Stark Theon Reekjoy sacrificed himself for no good reason. That at least leaves Sansa and Arya. 

The only one that acts like a stark is jon. I think the title is probably related to that?

All his cousins are ready to kick danny's but to KL while jon is the one that wants to act honorably and keep his word. Starks don t behave like sansa or bran… arya I am not certain...

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1 minute ago, divica said:

The only one that acts like a stark is jon. I think the title is probably related to that?

All his cousins are ready to kick danny's but to KL while jon is the one that wants to act honorably and keep his word. Starks don t behave like sansa or bran… arya I am not certain...

Bran doesn’t want anything. He said it himself didn’t he?

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19 hours ago, Visenya Stark said:

I still can't believe D&D had Sansa justify all the abuse she suffered by saying it changed her for the better. 

I can believe it, though I don't like it. 

This post-Ramsay Sansa is better in the sense that she's not a brat and apparently has the abilities to be a Lady of a Great House in time of peril. But she's also playing tiddly-winks with Jon's secrets with the highest possible political stakes.

A little rape-growth is a dangerous thing. 

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19 hours ago, dannyk65 said:

Hey, they at least phrased  it tenderly with the "broken in hard" line.

/s

Marginally excusable because it was said by the pissy Hound, who later called her little bird again. Sansa knows he saved her from gang rape and potential death. He's trying to make her feel bad for not going with him and/or regretting not having been able to protect her. But he's also mean an rubbing it in. 

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10 minutes ago, darmody said:

I don know what show you've been watching, but when Sansa wanted to talk to Jon before the Battle of the Bastards, Jon said okay what, and she responded, "Uh...I dunno. Something." Jon made a point to listen, and she had nothing to say.

Lets conveniently forget the part where she made it a point to say that Ramsey likes playing games and Jon is totally out of his element. He asked her about military moves which she rightly pointed out she had no idea about. But she knew Ramsey would set a mind game trap for Jon, and Jon fell for it hook, line and sinker.

12 minutes ago, darmody said:

Later, they have differences of opinion. Maybe Jon could do a better job hashing things out behind the scenes, but she is constantly ambushing him with divergent opinion in front of the whole court. It would help for your interpretation if Sansa was the clever schemer the show wants us to believe she is, especially since Jon knows nothing. But there's not much evidence of that

'How should I be smarter? By listening to you?' said completely dismissively to Sansa. And maybe Sansa wouldn't engage Jon during public meetings if Jon did what every other ruler in Westeros does. Build a council, hold council meetings and agree on decisions there to present them to the public later. And even then, when what accounts for 'council meetings' with him, Sansa and Davos, Jon suddenly changes his mind without informing anyone of his decisions. He agreed with Sansa and Davos to not to go to Dragonstone only to later announce to everyone that he was going, completely blindsiding Sansa and Davos.

18 minutes ago, darmody said:

The dumb little girl who doesn't know anything? Well, Jon claims authority in matters of military command and as regards the Army of the Dead. I don't think he treats Sansa like a little girl in any other respect. He does things over her head and against her advice, but he is king.

He was never really a King. Maybe for a week or two in the first 2 episodes of S7. Sansa was the one up in the North taking care of it for months. Jon was nowhere near his Kingdom. A Kingdom he also didn't keep in contact with. So not much of a King in the strictest terms. And he absolutely treats Sansa like shit. He tried to bond with Arya over their shared Sansa hate in episode 1 while completely dismissing Sansa. He again questioned her about what seems to be lack of faith in him, just like in S7. And Sansa has to stroke his fragile male ego and tell him, again, that she does. He told Dany Sansa didn't like him much when they were children (while also not being the least bit rattled when Dany threatened Sansa to his face). He completely dismissed Sansa in this episode despite Sansa's valid concern over the state of the Northern troops. Then Dany of all people has to remind Jon that Sansa is not that little girl anymore.

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17 minutes ago, Snormund said:

Can I get some feedback here?

 

Am I alone in this, or do some of you guys also not notice the insane amount of things wrong with this show until reading other people’s posts. Sure I notice plenty of things wrong. But there is so much stupidity I don’t even think about when I really should be. Part of that is because I have forgotten a lot of the lore, but some of it is just me not noticing stuff. 

I just found out from Game of Thrones| Season 8 Episode 4| Game Revealed (HBO) there is a guy named Dave Hill that acts as an executive story editor:o This guy either can't read or is just a patsy for David Benioff and Dan weiss to hide behind when all the fans start calling for their heads.

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19 hours ago, StarkofWinterfell said:

Easy. She’s jealous and has a hard-on for Jon obviously. 

Please, no. 

I was going to say Sansa has no chemistry with Jon, but that's true of Danny as well. Egret was the only one he popped with. 

Maybe there was a little something with Mel, but I chalk that up to superior acting on her part. 

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44 minutes ago, Simon Steele said:

Well, they did write the screenplays for Troy and X-Men Origins: Wolverine. They had some legit cred coming into GOT. Did you see Origins? No? Me neither.did see Troy, and now that I think about it, my thought leaving that was, "Did the people who made that even read the Iliad?" So...

Really ? You're lucky then. It's arguably one of the worst things ever. Like it almost ruined Wolverine and Deadpool as characters. He had the brilliant idea of sewing his mouth shut haha. A bit off topic but...did you watch Logan ? It's the last Wolverine movie. Awesome movie. Probably my favorite superhero movie. Very different from all the other superhero movies, which I'm not a big fan of.

 

1 hour ago, divica said:

Wtf

This ep is rated 59 on rotten tomatoes and 7.3 on imdb. 

Last week's wasn t much worse? 

Do you guys follow youtube/social media/reviews ? How did this episode do ? People were really defensive about episode 3 despite the issues being so obvious. Never thought people would defend it but they did. And it got high ratings as well. And now this one is rated really badly ? Or are the youtubers/social media still blindly sucking up to the show and this episode.

To me, the last 2 episodes have been the worst. It's hard to say which is worse but I was more mad at 3 cause I had high expectations, I had none for 4 and still was disappointed. But not angry or anything. Just a big meh.

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19 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

someone please explain to me why Sansa has such a problem with Daenerys?

The only thing I can think of, besides her coming from foreign lands with overwhelming force and no allies in common, is that the Targaryens killed her uncle and grandfather. 

No one in Danny's retinue is worthy of Sansa's trust, either. Tyrion didn't bed her, okay, and they giggled together once. But that doesn't  make her trust the queen he only recently met as well.

She doesn't even trust Davos. She knows Jon is dumb and too trusting and doesn't want him taken advantage of. 

 

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1 minute ago, darmody said:

The only thing I can think of, besides her coming from foreign lands with overwhelming force and no allies in common, is that the Targaryens killed her uncle and grandfather. 

No one in Danny's retinue is worthy of Sansa's trust, either. Tyrion didn't bed her, okay, and they giggled together once. But that doesn't  make her trust the queen he only recently met as well.

She doesn't even trust Davos. She knows Jon is dumb and too trusting and doesn't want him taken advantage of. 

 

Because they’ve ruined her entire arc of learning and growing into a capable leader by turning her into a pissy, shrill annoyance who has forgotten how to quietly observe.  

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Posted (edited)
57 minutes ago, Snormund said:

Can I get some feedback here?

 

Am I alone in this, or do some of you guys also not notice the insane amount of things wrong with this show until reading other people’s posts. Sure I notice plenty of things wrong. But there is so much stupidity I don’t even think about when I really should be. Part of that is because I have forgotten a lot of the lore, but some of it is just me not noticing stuff. 

Brother (Sister?), For years, I have watched each episode and found so much dumb shit that goes on that it comes out of my mouth as it happens. But then I find myself hard-pressed afterwards to put things into words that makes sense because it becomes a total mush in my mind. I even told my wife last night after she told me for the 10th time to shut up that I should just "write down the shit I'm seeing so I can remember it later" and she was cool with that. I was too drunk to bother getting up and get paper and pen, so I just continued my usual live heckling as if I was watching a hockey game. It's just the way I do things. 

However, coming to threads like this with like-minded people is awesome. That is because you folks can eloquently put into words what I can't even remember as I have given up so long ago. I feel like nothing even needs to be said anymore other than just sitting back and laughing at the train wreck that my favorite story has become. Why convince anyone anymore? "Read the books instead" has been my battle cry for a long time. I can't even say that anymore.

Edited by Ninerings
grammar

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, Mystical said:

Lets conveniently forget the part where she made it a point to say that Ramsey likes playing games and Jon is totally out of his element. He asked her about military moves which she rightly pointed out she had no idea about. But she knew Ramsey would set a mind game trap for Jon, and Jon fell for it hook, line, and seeker

Well, yeah, but Jon's an idiot. No amount of intelligent advice from Sansa on the character and methods of one Ramsay Bolton was going to change that. In any case, she didn't tell him how to avoid Ramsay's trap.

She just said he likes to play games. Okay. How do you plan for games? Tell yourself not to charge alone at an entire army after your cousin loses a game of Dodge the Arrow? I know not to charge an army by myself without knowing much else about Medieval warfare. (Though I seem to know more than whoever plans battles in the show.) 

You're talking about the exact exchange I paraphrased above. Sansa wanted to warn Jon about Ramsay. She is presented as possessing some sort of insight, but the show never tells us what. She experienced Ramsay's cruelty firsthand and was free to draw conclusions from what she saw, but how much did she see, really? She was locked up tight.

Sansa implores Jon to listen, Jon finally says what, speak. I'm all ears. And Sansa comes up blank. She doesn't know. She only knows it's not enough. Well, okay, Sansa. 

This all takes place in a dark context. Sansa has deliberately withheld the information that she's been in contact with a friendly nearby superior force. She tells Jon to forget about Rickon, her brother and Robb's presumptive heir, despite the fact that the Vale army could be used to pressure Ramsay. Which is treasonous and foolish, but anyway explains the pretense of her not feeling heard. 

Despite the fact that she has no military experience, doesn't actually know Ramsay's psychology well enough to deduce his modus operandi, and is mid-treason, Jon gives her the floor. She falls on it, because she has nothing to say except the giant secret she's keeping. 

Edited by darmody

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I can't say anything that hasn't been said here already. All I can add is that at this point, the only character I don't actively dislike at the moment is Qyburn, and running second would be that harlot who threw herself at Tormund.

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1 hour ago, Snormund said:

Can I get some feedback here?

 

Am I alone in this, or do some of you guys also not notice the insane amount of things wrong with this show until reading other people’s posts. Sure I notice plenty of things wrong. But there is so much stupidity I don’t even think about when I really should be. Part of that is because I have forgotten a lot of the lore, but some of it is just me not noticing stuff. 

You are definitely not alone. Sometimes I watch an episode (not necessarily recently) & think it's a decent episode until I come here & someone is all "So & so would never have done that!" Or they explain something that just didn't make sense in the show & I'm like damn... 

I usually try to post my rating before reading anyone elses for this reason & often would have rated much lower than what I did if I had read first. This episode though I was so mad I didn't need to worry about rating any lower than I already was! 

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