Jump to content
AlaerysTargaryen

Mad Queen Dany is a misdirection, just like Talissa was a spy and the Sansa/Arya antagonism last season.

Recommended Posts

D&D have done it before. Dont believe the leaks floating around. A beloved character and the face of the show wont go down as an evil, mad woman just like Cersei. The third Holy shit moment will probably be about Tyrion. They have said it will be almost in the end of the show.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I would go so far as to say most of the people reading these forums would certainly like that to be true. However, I would have said that about how and when the White Walkers were defeated, but here we are. At any rate, nothing I've guessed so far about how this show will end has come to pass, so I'm hardly an expert.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The fundamental problem is whatever they do, they always fuck up the “how” part. So there’s really no chance for this show to end well, regardless of what that ending is. Which is a shame because the audience can and will accept almost anything as long as it makes sense and is done right (Red Wedding and stuff).

They are just unable to do anything properly, because the story at this point is driven by two things: what d&d feel like works for television, what d&d think fans expect. And they even get twisted up in that second thing. They try to satisfy fan expectations by subverting the fan expectations, in other words, the twists are completely self-serving. There are twists because they know fans expect twists, not because the story justifies them. And they even refuse to write these twists in a way that makes sense. Now as soon as a twist doesn’t make sense, the audience won’t accept it and it doesn’t become it a twist, it just ends up being bullshit. /ramble, ramble, ramble 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Very possible. What makes me think it is a fairly strong possibility is that Tyrion flirted with going along with Varys, but ultimately didn't make up his mind.

If Tyrion goes against her, then the conflict between major characters (read Starks & Tyrion vs Daenerys) is on. So long as he stays on her side, we will get a better resolution than has been hinted at and hopefully one where all the major characters are at least at peace with one another.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

D&D have done it before. Dont believe the leaks floating around. A beloved character and the face of the show wont go down as an evil, mad woman just like Cersei. The third Holy shit moment will probably be about Tyrion. They have said it will be almost in the end of the show.

genuinely hope you're right.

I'm toying with the idea myself that the leaks are an intentional misdirection from the showrunners, including all the actors going "yeh the ending sucks" (genuinely, what is the point in filming multiple endings to avoid leaks when one asshole VFX-guy is ultimately all it takes?), because by lowering our expectations and making us expect the worst, most tragic, nonsensical ending, they will make us appreciate the real ending that much more than we normally would've if not for the fake leaks lowering our expectations in the first place.

It's actually pretty clever, and would actually be the first time in a long while where D&D "subverting our expectations" would actually be a good thing.

Sadly however, at the same time, D&D have shown us that they are not clever enough to pull of this sort of ruse (or they simply don't care enough anymore), so I'm not really having high hopes about this being the case. We'll get a shit ending that 99% of the fanbase hates, and we're just currently doing our best to keep our hopes up in some sort of common catharsis, before the final disappointment strikes.

And while the Sansa/Arya antagonism last season ultimately was a ruse, it was a very unsatisfying one at that, because in the end very little of it made sense. Stuff happened, people Baelish died. 

Edit:

Quote

The third Holy shit moment will probably be about Tyrion. They have said it will be almost in the end of the show.

My theory about an alleged leak:

 

I'm more and more convinced that this ultimate WTF-moment will be Jon killing Daenerys in the latter part of episode 6. It would be considered a WTF-moment during S1-S6 because their arcs happened different sides of the world, and it would be considered a WTF-moment during S7 which ended with them as fookin lovebirds.

At the same time however, it really wouldn't really be that WTF that he kills her, since people have been theorizing about Jon/AA having to kill Daenerys/Nissa Nissa for almost two years now. Ultimately it's more why he kills her that will be the final WTF, and not so much that he kills her.

I hope I'm wrong though, it's happened before.

Edited by MinscS2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Hodor's Dragon said:

If Tyrion goes against her, then the conflict between major characters (read Starks & Tyrion vs Daenerys) is on. So long as he stays on her side, we will get a better resolution than has been hinted at and hopefully one where all the major characters are at least at peace with one another.

Agreed. I'm still waiting for Tyrion to actually come trough for Daenerys.

She has done everything for him since they met (including yelling at him); elevated him, defended him against people like Ellaria Sand, trusted and listened to him (mostly), ultimately forgiven his many many mistakes (that in hindsight may have cost her the war) and given him the position of power he's always deserved and yearned for as Hand of the Queen - stuff his real family never have or would even consider. 

Jorah's dying words to Daenerys (essentially) was "Tyrion is a smart man, have faith in him". I'm waiting for a payoff, but then maybe that scene was more about Jorah coming to terms with himself and his relation to Daenerys, than it was foreshadowing Tyrion actually doing something really smart before the show ends.
...or it was simply another red herring or hint/foreshadowing that will never get some sort of resolution.

Edited by MinscS2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As much as I hope this is true, GRRM has always had Jon as the center of this story. As much as I would LOVE a happy ending for Dany, I don't see it coming. 

 

I'm hoping that Dany at least is reunited with her dragons, Drogo, and her baby when she gets offed. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

D&D have done it before. Dont believe the leaks floating around. A beloved character and the face of the show wont go down as an evil, mad woman just like Cersei. The third Holy shit moment will probably be about Tyrion. They have said it will be almost in the end of the show.

If it's misdirection how do you expect the show to end?  The woman who has believed it was her birthright to rule Westeros since the first season, is going to rule Westeros? That would be a little too conventional for GOT, wouldn't it?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

If it's misdirection how do you expect the show to end?  The woman who has believed it was her birthright to rule Westeros since the first season, is going to rule Westeros? That would be a little too conventional for GOT, wouldn't it?

Always pictured her dying but for a greater cause or even in childbirth, la me as it sounds. Not a villain, not a mad woman who followed into her father and borther path of insanity

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

..or it was simply another red herring

I think it is a red herring. They are painting Tyrion extragood this season, as to he seems the only one defending her right now. Book Tyrion has descended into a very changed man, after murderinfg his father and lover. after practically raping a slave. He drinks a lot more. His transformation is going slowly. What else could "subvert expectations" if at the very end Tyrion sides with his family. I never bet against my family. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

Always pictured her dying but for a greater cause or even in childbirth, la me as it sounds. Not a villain, not a mad woman who followed into her father and borther path of insanity

Dying in childbirth to me is worse than if she goes crazy/evil.  I don't know about misdirection, when has the show ever done anything this elaborate?  The "Talisa" stuff was the fans seeing things that weren't there, like the idea that the waif really killed Arya.  It's true they allegedly filmed different endings so it could be that one of the not chosen endings has leaked, but it seems too late for misdirection like with Sansa/Arya, which in itself was awful and stupid.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think that either of those examples were "misdirection," particularly Talisa. I think that's giving D&D far more credit than they deserve. It was just pointless, time-wasting writing which made so little sense that we contrived these fantastical interpretations just make some sense of it.

On a side note, even if their intentions were "misdirection," that's still not how you do it. You don't lead your audience down a path that goes nowhere and then shout, "Surprise! Shocked?"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At the moment I'm of the idea that Dany will prove (to the audience) that she is not going mad, and that she would actually make a good queen who cares about the plight of the smallfolk.  And she is killed anyway, because of the schemes to get Jon on the throne instead.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Kit Harrington I think it was called the final season Shakespearean, so something bad is definitely still yet to happen, we haven't hit anything close to Shakespearean tragedy yet/

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm thinking/hoping that Dany will teeter on the edge and express her wrath almost completely, but ultimately will withhold and show mercy. However, it will be too late. Cersei in a final demonstration of her evil and cunning, will have succeeded in making the people believe that Dany is like her father. Deceiving not only the people of KL but also the main characters about Dany.

We the audience will know that Dany is an anti-hero, the true prince that was promised and the actual hero of the story. She will break the wheel but at great personal cost. She will die because people are stupid and they don't deserve her/misunderstood her.

Because of this I hope the rest of the characters suffer tragedies of their own.

Sansa becomes a monster and her siblings Arya/Jon hate her for betraying her promise.

Arya and Jamie are probably the only characters that will know that Cersei is the one behind Dany's bad rep but they will not be able to stop the inevitable. Arya will die or disappear or get taken by the Faceless Men. Jamie will share Cersei's fate whatever it is.

Tyrion will live with the reality that he got Dany killed by not being there for her when she needed him the most.

Jon won't die, but I hope he never finds happiness after what he will do/not do or allow to happen to Dany.

Varys will burn.

Just kill everyone really. Fuck this show.


 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But Arya and Sansa last season were exactly what it looked like; Littlefinger manipulated them into distrusting each other until Bran stepped in to reveal the truth about Petyr's hand in the destruction of their family.

All ideas that it was just play acting to trick Littlefinger were nothing more but fans trying to salvage the horseshit plot the show served us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Daemos said:

I'm thinking/hoping that Dany will teeter on the edge and express her wrath almost completely, but ultimately will withhold and show mercy. However, it will be too late. Cersei in a final demonstration of her evil and cunning, will have succeeded in making the people believe that Dany is like her father. Deceiving not only the people of KL but also the main characters about Dany.

We the audience will know that Dany is an anti-hero, the true prince that was promised and the actual hero of the story. She will break the wheel but at great personal cost. She will die because people are stupid and they don't deserve her/misunderstood her.

Because of this I hope the rest of the characters suffer tragedies of their own.

Sansa becomes a monster and her siblings Arya/Jon hate her for betraying her promise.

Arya and Jamie are probably the only characters that will know that Cersei is the one behind Dany's bad rep but they will not be able to stop the inevitable. Arya will die or disappear or get taken by the Faceless Men. Jamie will share Cersei's fate whatever it is.

Tyrion will live with the reality that he got Dany killed by not being there for her when she needed him the most.

Jon won't die, but I hope he never finds happiness after what he will do/not do or allow to happen to Dany.

Varys will burn.

Just kill everyone really. Fuck this show.


 

Dany doesn’t even need Cersei to help her grow her negative reputation. She’s doing a fine job of that on her own. All Cersei needs to do is keep letting it spread.

By now, everyone will know that’s she’s just as willing to utilize fire to her advantage as Aerys was. It’s not good for her.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cersei could easily set the city on fire herself or create set ups like the meat shields at the Red Keep for easy civilian casualties. It would also explain why Cersei and friends spared Dany in that god awful execution scene from last episode. Killing Dany is not enough, she has to destroy her myth and paint herself as the true savior of the city or at the very least, a victim.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, madhikun said:

As much as I hope this is true, GRRM has always had Jon as the center of this story. As much as I would LOVE a happy ending for Dany, I don't see it coming. 

 

I'm hoping that Dany at least is reunited with her dragons, Drogo, and her baby when she gets offed. 

You can have Jon as the center of the story and still have a good ending for Dany, or at least not as bad as the leaks are sayin (as for the sayings of those of you who've read the leaks, I didn't). 

If she has to go, let her go in a good, meaningful, decent way. What was the point of her whole storyline? I jut don't get it.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, AlaerysTargaryen said:

D&D have done it before. Dont believe the leaks floating around. A beloved character and the face of the show wont go down as an evil, mad woman just like Cersei. The third Holy shit moment will probably be about Tyrion. They have said it will be almost in the end of the show. 

You say this but D&D have managed to ruin the series already so it would be refreshing if the next episode can offer some compensates for the constant disappointment we've had to watch. It won't make up for it but it will be something to be glad about before it all ends.

Spoiler

A bitter sweet ending could be the death of Tyrion and the survival of Dany and Jon

Many of us are discussing ways in which this show could end on a high, finding a way to convince ourselves that the next episode will deliver exactly what's needed. I just don't think D&D are equipped with the skills to give that to us and they've proven that on many different occasions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×