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Winter prince

This Is How It Was Supposed To Be [Spoilers]

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This is how Dany's arc was always meant to play out.  All the pieces just fell into place in a rushed manner.

Case and points:

In season 1 she believed that the common people were wishing for the return of the Targaryens.  While Ser Jorah told her the common people could not care at all who sits on the Iron Throne she was led to believe differently by her successes in Slaver's Bay.  She had support of a lot of the common people there but still saw some resistance from slaves who liked their previous lives.  Even though she rightfully viewed Cersei as a tyrant she would have to know there were people completely content with her rule.  She also saw that she was viewed as a foreign Queen who did not belong with the commoners flocking to their heroes such as Jon Snow.

In the House of the Undying she had the vision of a destroyed Kingslanding: this was her destiny.  I think many thought this would happen with Cersei pulling an Aerys "Burn Them All" with wildfire like the Sept of Baelor but that was never the case.  She was meant to take her right with Fire and Blood as she repeated season after season.

She had no trust in Tyrion anymore.  His constant reminder of hearing the bells meant surrender probably seemed like a trap.  So instead she heeded the counsel of Olenna Tyrell: be a dragon.

Dany was always meant to be a conqueror.  Season 8 just provided all the motivation. 

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23 minutes ago, Winter prince said:

She had no trust in Tyrion anymore.  His constant reminder of hearing the bells meant surrender probably seemed like a trap.  So instead she heeded the counsel of Olenna Tyrell: be a dragon.

That's a great point, and the point of the Tyrion scene at the bell.   He knew his betrayal lead to the destruction.

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53 minutes ago, Winter prince said:

This is how Dany's arc was always meant to play out.  All the pieces just fell into place in a rushed manner.

Case and points:

In season 1 she believed that the common people were wishing for the return of the Targaryens.  While Ser Jorah told her the common people could not care at all who sits on the Iron Throne she was led to believe differently by her successes in Slaver's Bay.  She had support of a lot of the common people there but still saw some resistance from slaves who liked their previous lives.  Even though she rightfully viewed Cersei as a tyrant she would have to know there were people completely content with her rule.  She also saw that she was viewed as a foreign Queen who did not belong with the commoners flocking to their heroes such as Jon Snow.

In the House of the Undying she had the vision of a destroyed Kingslanding: this was her destiny.  I think many thought this would happen with Cersei pulling an Aerys "Burn Them All" with wildfire like the Sept of Baelor but that was never the case.  She was meant to take her right with Fire and Blood as she repeated season after season.

She had no trust in Tyrion anymore.  His constant reminder of hearing the bells meant surrender probably seemed like a trap.  So instead she heeded the counsel of Olenna Tyrell: be a dragon.

Dany was always meant to be a conqueror.  Season 8 just provided all the motivation. 

Good explanation.

But the whole story is a jigsaw puzzle. It must all fit.

This general idea you explained is probably what GRRM gave to D&D. You have to be skilled to weave a beautiful and coherent story. Sadly not the case here.

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1 hour ago, Winter prince said:

She had no trust in Tyrion anymore.  His constant reminder of hearing the bells meant surrender probably seemed like a trap.  So instead she heeded the counsel of Olenna Tyrell: be a dragon.

Did she trust her ground commanders? The ones she might have rained fire down upon? Wasn't there any means of communication set up between her and Jon/Greyworm? 

Lannister soldiers surrendering wasn't a trick, bells or no bells. Why on earth would she not wait to see what was happening with her troops? 

Edited by darmody

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5 minutes ago, darmody said:

Did she trust her ground commanders? The ones she might have rained fire down upon? Wasn't there any means of communication set up between her and Jon/Greyworm? 

Lannister soldiers surrendering wasn't a trick, bells or no bells. Why on earth would she not wait to see what was happening with her troops? 

You have definitely noted a flaw in my logic.  I have already made assumptions regarding Dany's beliefs in the moment but she never looked to her ground troops; her eyes were fixed on the red keep.  Perhaps this was her plan all along and that's why Greyworm attacked, but he seemed motivated by revenge to attack.

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24 minutes ago, robasp2 said:

Good explanation.

But the whole story is a jigsaw puzzle. It must all fit.

This general idea you explained is probably what GRRM gave to D&D. You have to be skilled to weave a beautiful and coherent story. Sadly not the case here.

The destination is easy, the actual travel has been difficult.  The show is like when your GPS is rerouting and you get lost.  Sure, you reach the destination but it's not the path you wanted to take.

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19 minutes ago, darmody said:

Wasn't there any means of communication set up between her and Jon/Greyworm? 

No, there obviously wasn't. They were both surprised by Daenerys continuing the attack. Greyworm was full of grief and fury and took to opportunity, while Jon Snow was disappointed or irritated and tried to stop unnecessary killing. 

Daenerys obviously made a frustrated, purely emotional decision while she sat with Drogon and considered the situation. Daenerys snapped and turned into the Queen of Ashes foreshadowed so long ago.

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25 minutes ago, darmody said:

Did she trust her ground commanders? The ones she might have rained fire down upon? Wasn't there any means of communication set up between her and Jon/Greyworm? 

Lannister soldiers surrendering wasn't a trick, bells or no bells. Why on earth would she not wait to see what was happening with her troops? 

Your flaw is in looking for a rational or strategic explanation for her actions.  There was none, she snapped, she flew into a rage.  Remember Viserys in s1: "now you have awoken the dragon!" - that's exactly what she did here.

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8 minutes ago, 21st Century Moose said:

Your flaw is in looking for a rational or strategic explanation for her actions.  There was none, she snapped, she flew into a rage.  Remember Viserys in s1: "now you have awoken the dragon!" - that's exactly what she did here.

I was only responding to the idea that she thought Tyrion tricked her. 

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1 hour ago, Kajjo said:

No, there obviously wasn't. They were both surprised by Daenerys continuing the attack. Greyworm was full of grief and fury and took to opportunity, while Jon Snow was disappointed or irritated and tried to stop unnecessary killing. 

Daenerys obviously made a frustrated, purely emotional decision while she sat with Drogon and considered the situation. Daenerys snapped and turned into the Queen of Ashes foreshadowed so long ago.

Of course, with the army having laid down its arms and the scorpions all destroyed, she knew the city was defenceless and could easily have made a beeline for the Red Keep and burned Cercei. The wanton frying of the people and buildings was entirely gratuitous, and gave Cercei time to escape, should she have been more inclined.

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1 hour ago, 21st Century Moose said:

Your flaw is in looking for a rational or strategic explanation for her actions.  There was none, she snapped, she flew into a rage.

Exactly. This is extremely clear and well played by the actress.

1 hour ago, 21st Century Moose said:

Remember Viserys in s1: "now you have awoken the dragon!" - that's exactly what she did here.

Yes. So much foreshadowing.

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I hope we get to hear the candid opinions of the actors once the n.d.a.s expire after next week. I wonder how many of them feel their characters were ill served. Lena Heady had been practically invisible as far as shilling for the season.

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3 hours ago, Winter prince said:

This is how Dany's arc was always meant to play out.  All the pieces just fell into place in a rushed manner.

Absolutely. Thank you.

3 hours ago, Winter prince said:

In season 1 she believed that the common people were wishing for the return of the Targaryens

Yes, she was delusional and she dreamed all the time of being a good queen, of loving her people and being loved back by the people. That's what she really wanted. She wanted to be a good queen. 

If the people had loved her, she would not have snapped.

But the Winterfell wake scene made it clear that she is alone and lonely and the people don't love her. Don't wait for her to rule them. 

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If she is going to burn a city in the books it is meereen... And probably because of the plague. 

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1 hour ago, divica said:

If she is going to burn a city in the books it is meereen... And probably because of the plague. 

I partially agree.  I think she burns both in the books with some heavy foreshadowing with Mereen.

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3 hours ago, the tower of albion said:

I hope we get to hear the candid opinions of the actors once the n.d.a.s expire after next week. I wonder how many of them feel their characters were ill served. Lena Heady had been practically invisible as far as shilling for the season.

Can you blame her? I think she was hoping this was her chance for an Emmy, and they gave her about 5 lines of dialogue all season. Not a chance for an Emmy for her. Lena was the only main character not to show up for the premiere.

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2 hours ago, Winter prince said:

I partially agree.  I think she burns both in the books with some heavy foreshadowing with Mereen.

Or she only burns meereen and they changed meereen for kl.. 

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15 minutes ago, SuperMario said:

Can you blame her? I think she was hoping this was her chance for an Emmy, and they gave her about 5 lines of dialogue all season. Not a chance for an Emmy for her. Lena was the only main character not to show up for the premiere.

The show has a bad habit of keeping actors they like around for 1 too many seasons while never finding anything for them to do.  Same with Littlefinger, he spent his last season chilling at WF with no more important plot than Mean Girling the Stark sisters.  Cersei hasn't done anything of note beyond stare into space since she burned down the Sept.  I was hoping maybe we would get something other than the same stoic stare when everything was destroyed, but nope.  

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33 minutes ago, divica said:

Or she only burns meereen and they changed meereen for kl.. 

I hope we get the books to resolve this impasse we're at ;)

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