Jump to content

Daenerys: Analysis of psychology and foreshadowing


Kajjo

Recommended Posts

4 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Sorry, I haven't see you asking that. Of course I try to answer all questions directed at me.

This is NOT the end. Wait for the final episode. 

 

I don't mean to be aggressive. 

I just hate this new tendency that people have "Huh, we aren't kid's, no Disney shit here, this is REAL fantasy" Same people who would still cry to Bamby's mother death. 

We might end up with Jon and night queen together.

Indirect incest is wincest!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Targaryen Peas said:

Same people who would still cry to Bamby's mother death. 

I would probably.To have emotions is fine. 

In this particular case of E5 I can honestly say, I like the development. But I can understand if some people don't like the development.

However, I despise people moaning, whining, hating the storyline and putting in into a bad light, just because it's different from what they hoped for. Yes, it might be a pity if someone favored Daenerys and didn't see all the foreshadowing, but this is not a shortcoming of GRRM's storyline and not even of the show. 

Daenerys' arc is believable and well portrayed in E5.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Nudu said:

Yup. I hate the maniac who genocided the biggest city in the continent for literally no reason. 

That's what conquest is. I don't know where you are from, but your country probably did something similar. And you'd find a way to defend it. 

That's just how human nature is. We find reasons to our acts, not to others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, Forlong the Fat said:

You didn’t notice the psychotic features part, eh?

Sorry but you clearly don't understand how mental disorders work, manifest and their criteria. Or you haven't paid attention to the criteria that determine a major depressive episode:  

The nine possible symptoms of major depressive episodes are:

  • Depressed mood. A feeling of depression, sadness, and hopelessness that is intense and persistent. This may seem more like irritability in children, teens, and men.
  • Loss of interest. A significant loss of interest or pleasure in doing normal activities, including daily activities like chores but also hobbies, work, or school.
  • Weight changes. Significant loss of weight or weight gain that is not intentional but is triggered byovereating or loss of appetite.
  • Sleep changes. Either excessive sleep or insomnia and difficulty sleeping.
  • Agitation or retardation. Agitated and restless expression or slowed down affect that is notable to anyone observing.
  • Fatigue. Fatigue and loss of energy that is more than normal and can’t be explained simply by lack of sleep or low quality sleep.
  • Excessive guilt. Feelings of deep guilt and shame, a feeling of being worthless.
  • Impaired thinking. Difficulty concentrating, making decisions, and focusing on anything, even just watching television.
  • Suicidal thoughts. Thoughts of death, suicide, and suicidal planning or suicidal attempts.

To be diagnosed, a person must experience at least five of these symptoms and significant impairment as a result of those symptoms. The symptoms must last for at least two weeks. 

And in your quote you said: 

Quote

Since you asked about her specific diagnosis, why don’t we discuss the two I identified? BTW, I think it would be better to say Major Depressive Episode rather than Disorder. And let’s talk about whether those disorders must be manifested “long ago.”

So no that's not the case. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

When she arrived at Kings Landing she had already made her mind up about Torching the place, When the bells chimed it only delayed her for a split second. Had they not chimed and she torched the place she wouldn't have been looked upon as much of a monster as they refused to surrender however as they did chime in that instant she realised that if she goes through with it there was no going back for her and I truly believe she had no intentions of letting anyone in Kings Landing walk out of there.

As for her reasoning... amongst all the grief she had suffered recently I still believe the fire that fuelled her was due to her childhood... I don't think she saw the people of kingslanding as innocent but rather the people that stood by while her father was overthrown and they were torn from their home and sent to Essos.

I also think the chimes may have set off a deep memory of that day when everything was crumbling... when Robert took the throne there would no doubt had been chimes and when she heard them it took her back to that dark place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

I would probably.To have emotions is fine. 

In this particular case of E5 I can honestly say, I like the development. But I can understand if some people don't like the development.

However, I despise people moaning, whining, hating the storyline and putting in into a bad light, just because it's different from what they hoped for. Yes, it might be a pity if someone favored Daenerys and didn't see all the foreshadowing, but this is not a shortcoming of GRRM's storyline and not even of the show. 

Daenerys' arc is believable and well portrayed in E5.

I almost agree.

E5 as a standalone would have been believable and probably good. 

Not in the show, not for me at least. 

People might prefer schemes and plotting, but I prefer someone like Daenerys who wouldn't plot behind you, but just burn you if you try to. 

As she said to Varys.

Any other person would have killed Varys before giving him a chance. She believed in him, for some time. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

major depressive

Come, get a grip. That is nonsense. Forget depressions and other real-world mental disorders. 

She snapped because in the Targaryan bloodline it is a known feature to be instabile. There are so many good, clear reasons what led up to this point, we don't have to get ridiculous to discuss depressions as trigger for rampages. 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

Sorry but you clearly don't understand how mental disorders work, manifest and their criteria. Or you haven't paid attention to the criteria that determine a major depressive episode:  

The nine possible symptoms of major depressive episodes are:

  • Depressed mood. A feeling of depression, sadness, and hopelessness that is intense and persistent. This may seem more like irritability in children, teens, and men.
  • Loss of interest. A significant loss of interest or pleasure in doing normal activities, including daily activities like chores but also hobbies, work, or school.
  • Weight changes. Significant loss of weight or weight gain that is not intentional but is triggered byovereating or loss of appetite.
  • Sleep changes. Either excessive sleep or insomnia and difficulty sleeping.
  • Agitation or retardation. Agitated and restless expression or slowed down affect that is notable to anyone observing.
  • Fatigue. Fatigue and loss of energy that is more than normal and can’t be explained simply by lack of sleep or low quality sleep.
  • Excessive guilt. Feelings of deep guilt and shame, a feeling of being worthless.
  • Impaired thinking. Difficulty concentrating, making decisions, and focusing on anything, even just watching television.
  • Suicidal thoughts. Thoughts of death, suicide, and suicidal planning or suicidal attempts.

To be diagnosed, a person must experience at least five of these symptoms and significant impairment as a result of those symptoms. The symptoms must last for at least two weeks. 

And in your quote you said: 

So no that's not the case. 

 

Is your issue that they didn’t run down all her symptoms or that it hasn’t been two weeks? She wouldn’t leave her room, speak to anyone, or eat for whatever period they were on dragonstone. We don’t have a psychiatric exam of her, but it’s not much of a leap to say she has anhedonia, depressed mood, weight change due to not eating for days, and sleep disturbance at least  

gods but this is a stupid discussion

and before you say again that I don’t know what I’m talking about, you might consider that I’m not the one posting the first thing that comes up when I google 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Targaryen Peas said:

That's what conquest is. I don't know where you are from, but your country probably did something similar. And you'd find a way to defend it. 

That's just how human nature is. We find reasons to our acts, not to others.

Conquest isn't genociding people who are already surrendered. At this point she probably murdered more innocent people than the night king. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Come, get a grip. That is nonsense. Forget depressions and other real-world mental disorders. 

She snapped because in the Targaryan bloodline it is a known feature to be instabile. There are so many good, clear reasons what led up to this point, we don't have to get ridiculous to discuss depressions as trigger for rampages. 

 

Why are you directing this question to me? You should say this to person who suggested it, if you follow the conversation and don't just reply back, just in order to reply. 

I didn't identify with any disorder in the first place. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

Why are you directing this question to me?

Because you list symptoms and real-world analysis of a certain mental problem. There is not indication for depressive disorder at all here. Do feed the troll.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't know if you catched this during the episode.

"Varys was writing some shit, and then the girl enters... bla bla...

She's not eating.

Ok, we will try again at supper"

So basically he was trying to poison her.

But she was smart enough to realize that Sansa was a snitch, that told Tyrion who himself...

To me it shows that Daenerys was in full control of her mind, even though she was sad. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Targaryen Peas said:

To me it shows that Daenerys was in full control of her mind, even though she was sad. 

I agree. She was.

She snapped when sitting with Drogon on the wall and listens to the bell ringing. Having achieved it, even more frustrated then about it all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Because you list symptoms and real-world analysis of a certain mental problem. There is not indication for depressive disorder at all here. Do feed the troll.

 

oh please, I didn't identify her with any disorder to start with. But you don't mind to quote the person that identified her with a disorder but me who responded that even in this case she doesn't qualify? 

I rest my case.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Hippocras said:

To me it is not so much "madness" as Otherness that drove Dany, and Grey Worm too. They suffered horrible losses recently, yes and were in deep grief which is a kind of temporary mental illness, yes. But more importantly they saw this as coming at the hands of people they did not love or relate to in any way on a human level. They felt it was ok to take revenge in this way (spear in the back of soldiers who surrendered by Grey Worm, and Dragonfire from Dany) because they could not humanize the people they were doing this too. For Dany the people of KL refused to recognize her rule and so were in the wrong, and they did not love her so she did not care about them. For Grey Worm, he is a soldier who went through dehumanizing training and is facing foreign people in a very foreign land. He doesn't care the least bit about them.

I was a little confused by Greyworm's choice. He looked up and saw Dany burning recklessly and went for it. There definitely seemed to be something personal in it, but how much of it is that the Unsullied, free or not, are trained from birth to follow their leader without question? In the books they murder babies to prove their ruthlessness. Greyworm seems very compassionate and kind in other circumstances, but how much is he a reflection of his leader? 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

But you don't mind to quote the person that identified her with a disorder but me who responded that even in this case she doesn't qualify? 

Sorry for that. I felt it to be too much real-world medicine copied from somewhere. I agree that she does not qualifiy. I would have preferred not to feed the troll with lenghty medical descriptions. 

Again, sorry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...