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Game of Star Wars: The Final Hope

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I will just say that for me personally I have liked this trilogy much better than the prequel crap. With this trilogy I am not embarrassed to watch it. I went to see the Phantom Menace with my wife, who is somewhat of a Star Wars fan, and when we left I felt like I needed to apologize to her for taking her there. It was utter shit and aimed at 8 year old children.

With the current films I feel much better, are they perfect, of course not, and the original trilogy wasn't either.  Give me a film similar to Rogue One every year and I am one very happy fella. 

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1 minute ago, dbunting said:

I will just say that for me personally I have liked this trilogy much better than the prequel crap. With this trilogy I am not embarrassed to watch it. I went to see the Phantom Menace with my wife, who is somewhat of a Star Wars fan, and when we left I felt like I needed to apologize to her for taking her there. It was utter shit and aimed at 8 year old children.

With the current films I feel much better, are they perfect, of course not, and the original trilogy wasn't either.  Give me a film similar to Rogue One every year and I am one very happy fella. 

You know a lot of 8 year olds that are interested in interplanetary trade disputes? 

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12 minutes ago, Nictarion said:

You know a lot of 8 year olds that are interested in interplanetary trade disputes? 

I know a lot of people who saw the prequels as kids and lone them to death.  Really makes you wonder about the nostalgia factor sometimes.

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40 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

I know a lot of people who saw the prequels as kids and lone them to death.  Really makes you wonder about the nostalgia factor sometimes.

On the flip side, my kids saw both when they were kids, and they'll happily rewatch the OT and have maybe watched a little bit of the prequels on and off, and often get bored during it. Especially ep 2. 

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I wonder if anyone's doing a PhD thesis or something on "Ep III was pretty good" guy and whether it was just them dealing with the trauma of the first two and wanting a good Star Wars movie just so badly.  

Edited by Triskele

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1 hour ago, Darth Richard II said:

Eh, Marvel didn;t really start planning things til late phase 2 and even then a lot was thrown out when the story group was broken up post ultron. They're just much better at looking like they had a plan all along.

Gonna need a source on that, dawg. 'Cause watching the MCU movies as of last year, it's really obvious they had a pretty basic plan & sense of escalating continuity in place from Iron Man on -- establish each of the Avengers, tie them in through SHIELD, then make an Avengers film. Thanos emerged as a future villain at the tail of The Avengers, but the Infinity Stones had already been referenced in Cap America and were included in Thor 2--> onward. It became more intricate as we moved through phase 2 to phase 3, but the building blocks were set up and the foundation was strong enough for more interesting stuff to emerge.

As opposed to this billion dollar sequel trilogy, which is so hilariously slap-dash and tonally inconsistent that it comes as absolutely no surprise that Rian threw away the treatment and did his own thing and no one was even looking over his shoulder or demanding polished drafts.

Anyway. I'll admit, I was excited about this trailer, even though I know all the spoilers thrown up on reddit and this trailer pretty much matches the basics of what's been written. What I wasn't expecting was how cold I felt to all of it. When TFA's trailer dropped, with the synth-Williams and Han Solo talking about the Jedi, I was giddy and watched it ten times in a row. When TLJ's trailer came out, I was cautiously excited. 

Problem was, both films had good trailers, and both films were pretty bad in their own ways (TFA being a shallow copy, TLJ trying "something" different but basically shitting the bed on a fundamental screenwriting, plotting, and philosophical implementation). And it's JJ Abrams, the epitome of popcorn hustler, great at establishing copycat visuals and pacing and pretty much awful at the meat of filmmaking. 

This trailer has a couple of intriguing moments. But they dropped the ball so hard on character development, world building, stakes, and narrative escalation in the last one, it really just feels like yet another go around, rather than the big, final film of the entire saga. So I'll be seeing it, but it'll be the first time where it really feels like an obligation.

Just as a note, it's a really sad state of affairs for Star Wars fandom where pre-sales ticket revenue is touted as a justification for this series's existence and supposed quality. Aside from the fact that Solo crushed Black Panther's presales--to say nothing of the facile mo' money, mo' quality argument-- there's the underlying fact that true critical conversation about these new films has been totally poisoned by the clumsy ideological window-dressing of TLJ, to the point that it's Grievance Goons on one side propping up an entire Youtube clickbait subculture, and on the flip side, the "you must be one of them" arising from the hardcore Rian/TLJ fans whenever the enormous issues of that film are brought up. Disney scrambling like crazy to distance themselves from the fallout has been interesting and ultimately depressing -- as much as I didn't like TLJ, it would have been better for them to bite the bullet than dance about in a pandering flopsweat.

Edited by kuenjato

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Eh, the infinity stones aren't mentioned til Thor 2, Thanos was a last minute thing thrown in by Whedon, and the whole SHIELD tie in thing was dropped when the people in charge of the story were kind of all fired. None of this is a secret

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4 minutes ago, kuenjato said:

 

As opposed to this billion dollar sequel trilogy, which is so hilariously slap-dash and tonally inconsistent that it comes as absolutely no surprise that Rian threw away the treatment and did his own thing and no one was even looking over his shoulder or demanding polished drafts.

 

This is such hilariously incorrect bullshit I don't know where to start.

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I will put out a very controversial opinion. I liked The Force Awakens. I also liked The Last Jedi. Both had flaws but were enjoyable movies. I am looking forward to the Rise of Skywalker, which I'm sure will also be flawed but enjoyable.

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6 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

I did this as a kid too, despite (i think anyway) the generational differences between you and i. Can’t and won’t defend the quality of the prequels but they kept Star Wars relevant to my generation. (i was a fan anyway, due to my mam’s continued watching of the OT on VHS and later DVD...same reason lots of golden oldies were always on my favourites)

Could be. How could you know they call me Old Balls McGinty. 

 

6 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Same. Seen various ideas floated. One that its a “space iceberg” (with an ‘above’ and ‘below’) another that it is an ice city in a similar way to Bespin has Cloud City. Speaking of which, i almost thought Rey and Ren were fighting in Cloud City when they smashed the statue on first watch. Since changed my mind but still!

I got the trailer paused right here in front of me and the lower structure is quite incongruent compared to the top. So, not a reflection. Whether the entire thing is actually in space or for some nonsense reason similar to those small, ridiculous floating islands with the never ending waterfalls a la Avatar, I don't know. Although, along the mid line there's infrequent developed areas, with the largest [or most visible] on the left. With that swarm of Ties buzzing in, money's on some kind of rebel base.

Maybe that's all that was left of Hoth after Vader was done with it. Dude had to be pissed. :p 

Edited by JEORDHl

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Yeah, I totally skipped over the Canto Bight part, but I got to this part in TLJ and HOLY FUCK it's good. The whole compositing of Snoke's body falling and the saber flying to the foreground with Rey reaching up, and then them both going full on wuxia - it's fucking awesome.

 

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12 minutes ago, Caligula_K3 said:

I will put out a very controversial opinion. I liked The Force Awakens. I also liked The Last Jedi. Both had flaws but were enjoyable movies. I am looking forward to the Rise of Skywalker, which I'm sure will also be flawed but enjoyable.

Pretty much my take on every SW movie after New Hope and Empire...

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18 minutes ago, Caligula_K3 said:

I will put out a very controversial opinion. I liked The Force Awakens. I also liked The Last Jedi. Both had flaws but were enjoyable movies. I am looking forward to the Rise of Skywalker, which I'm sure will also be flawed but enjoyable.

I enjoyed TFA a lot, but I accepted it being so much of a retread on the basis of it needing to reestablish "this is a star wars movie" with fans after the long term dissatisfaction with the prequels. I loved TLJ without thinking its perfect and think it had some truly amazing moments, albeit one with immediately apparent "this is going to cause nitpicking online" consequences. If 9 is as much of a retread as TFA was, I wouldn't be anywhere near as forgiving of that as I was for TFA though.

I'll still go into it looking to enjoy it though, because fuck looking to be miserable. At the very least its clearly going to be a visually outstanding movie on the basis of these shots. And its the absolute last we're getting of Carrie Fisher.

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22 minutes ago, Caligula_K3 said:

I will put out a very controversial opinion. I liked The Force Awakens. I also liked The Last Jedi. Both had flaws but were enjoyable movies. I am looking forward to the Rise of Skywalker, which I'm sure will also be flawed but enjoyable.

I loved both and R1 and Solo. It's honestly not THAT controversial, it's just the haters yell the loudest.

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Just now, Darth Richard II said:

I loved both and R1 and Solo. It's honestly not THAT controversial, it's just the haters yell the loudest.

I didn't mind Solo but I definitely didn't love it. I only watched it on streaming and think the fundamental problem with it was that it was telling a story I just wasn't that interested in.

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Also this weird notion that RJ somehow made TLJ without anyone knowing anything about it til it premiered is just ludicrous. There are numerous interview where RJ talks about how he talked things over with JJ and the actors and the script for TLJ was locked down before TFA even premiered.

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Just now, karaddin said:

I didn't mind Solo but I definitely didn't love it. I only watched it on streaming and think the fundamental problem with it was that it was telling a story I just wasn't that interested in.

Love it is perhaps to strong, but I do kind of want to marry Emilia Clarke so that colors my perception a bit. :P

Also Glover's Lando needs his own film.

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3 minutes ago, Kalbear said:

Yeah, I totally skipped over the Canto Bight part, but I got to this part in TLJ and HOLY FUCK it's good. The whole compositing of Snoke's body falling and the saber flying to the foreground with Rey reaching up, and then them both going full on wuxia - it's fucking awesome.

 

I enjoyed that too. 

One thing that kinda bugs me about the Jedi, as portrayed in film anyway, is their inability to walk and chew gum at the same time.

It's such a spectacular failure of imagination to not have a Jedi wielding the Force as well as a lightsaber. I'd have like a belt bag full of shrapnel to let loose and spin around me in a red flensing whirlwind and just saber throw for days. Or they could get a little John Wick with it with force trips and snares into close and personal saber work.

The possibilities are endless, but no.

swoosh, vurrrrrrr, beyeeeersh, vruuuuum [pause] force push/pull, maybe another [pause] vshieu, vearorw, shooooom 

 

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Also fuck it, triple post, but while I'm remembering and to comment on something earlier, there are interviews you can find where the high ups at Marvel were surprised by Thanos inclusion in the original Avengers, plus a recent interview with Feige were he mentioned they had no concrete plan til Civil War went into production. Yeah they plotted the fuck out of Phase 3 but saying they had a plan since Iron Man is just complete and utter bullshit. Feige even says the post credits seen in Incredible Hulk almost torpedoed the whole thing.

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1 minute ago, Darth Richard II said:

Love it is perhaps to strong, but I do kind of want to marry Emilia Clarke so that colors my perception a bit. :P

Also Glover's Lando needs his own film.

I think I would have happily watched a story centered on literally everyone else in the movie except Han & Chewie. I'm normally quite open to prequels, so its really something specific to Han that makes me uninterested in his back story - I guess its knowing that any character growth is going to stagnate up until ANH. This kinda went with trying to explain why he was cold and cynical, but I don't really need that explained for anyone growing up in a galaxy ruled by the Empire and with the Hutts as well - a lot of people are going to become that way.

3 minutes ago, JEORDHl said:

I enjoyed that too. 

One thing that kinda bugs me about the Jedi, as portrayed in film anyway, is their inability to walk and chew gum at the same time.

It's such a spectacular failure of imagination to not have a Jedi wielding the Force as well as a lightsaber. I'd have like a belt bag full of shrapnel to let loose and spin around me in a red flensing whirlwind and just saber throw for days. Or they could get a little John Wick with it with force trips and snares into close and personal saber work.

The possibilities are endless, but no.

swoosh, vurrrrrrr, beyeeeersh, vruuuuum [pause] force push/pull, maybe another [pause] vshieu, vearorw, shooooom 

 

I think this in part comes down to Jedi not being meant to use the Force as a weapon. Enhancing themselves is one thing, and the shrapnel cloud could maybe be OK, but directly using it against others is meant to be something of a no no. Of course then they go and use Force push and it goes out the window anyway so *shrug*

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