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Beardy the Wildling

Who's hyped for Episode 6 for unintended reasons?

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19 minutes ago, Nightwish said:

Oh I came here for the reactions and to see that I am not the only one here who finds the way the show has gone downhill.  

This is the end of the journey, your argument would stand if it had any life left. But its finishing and people should be able to tell their opinion either they like it or not as these are their final impressions of the show. You can't really judge something unless it is finished. 

And as for the books, reaching the end, I decided that I don't want to invest any more time as I find the end unfulfiling for my taste. I will let other people read it and if they are different and far more intelligent than what I am watching I will get them. If the ratings are low, no I won't. 

I'm sorry if I misjudged. I just can't figure out why people who hate something keep watching it and talking about it. For example there are people who have been complaining about how they hate game of thrones and have since season six and yet they still watch it and still talk about it. You might not be one of those people but alot of people do that and I just don't get it unless they are trolling.  In my opinion those people are sick

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4 hours ago, Ser Gareth said:

I'm not surprised by this, but it's not for the reasons that so many seem think.  It's because people have invested in certain characters who are not turning out to be like they imagined.

Or the negative critical reviews could be for the very reasons the critics say they gave them - the writing hasn't held up. You certainly wouldn't be the first person to disagree with critical opinion, of course, but at least take them at their word. It's their job, after all.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Ser Gareth said:

Burning Mirri,

Who tricked her and ultimately caused the death of both her husband and her unborn child as well as made her barren.

From Daenerys perspective, there's nothing evil or even cruel about executing Mirri Maz Duur.
Heck, Robb Stark have executed people for less. (Rickard Karstark)

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locking her ex handmaiden in a vault,

Doreah literally betrayed Daenerys for greed, by scheming with XXD which lead to several members of her remaining khalasar being murdered (including Irri, her other handmaiden and only friend at the time) and where they planned on having Daenerys forever caged in the House of the Undying.

Was the punishment harsh? Sure, but not unjustified. 

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reneging instantly on a deal with the Unsullied and killing hundreds,

Not a "lawful" action for sure, but ultimately she killed slavers and she did it not only for the Unsullied, but also to free all the slaves in Astapor.

You can see in her scenes where she meets with Kraznys that it's ultimately seeing the slaves suffer that around the city that causes her to act.

Classic case of the end justifies the means. Or are you saying that it would've been somehow better if she had left the slaves to suffer and let the right out horrific Unsullied-factory continue?

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nailing a load of people to posts,

The mereneesi noblemen practically goaded her into this by themselves crucifying slave children as a warning to her.
Classic case of an eye for an eye.

Ultimately this did backfire on her, because collective punishment is never good and some "innocent" masters where punished,, but in the end, we're still talking about slavers, something that even Westeros has banned. Was it stupid? Yes, but not intentionally evil.

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having to be persuaded (twice!) not to burn down the Red Keep,

Now we're finally getting morally grey.

Ultimately, the Red Keep is a perfectly viable military target, and if she had aimed for that back in S7 instead of listening to Tyrion, she would've won the war against Cersei in 5 minutes and a lot of innocent lives would've been spared, because by this time, Daenerys wasn't totally wrecked with sorrow and anger, and whatever caused her to burn KL to the ground last episode would've never have happened.

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not caring when her brother is executed before her,

The same brother who just before had threatened to kill her and cut her unborn child from her womb?
The same brother who had abused and oppressed her for 17 fucking years?

Are you seriously trying to paint Daenerys in a bad light for not caring when Viserys ultimately committed suicide by stupidity?

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dragging someone behind her horse etc.

1) Wasn't her horse.
2) Wasn't her idea.

That was the punishment of the Dothraki (probably Drogo) have for trying to kill the Khaleesi.
Daenerys even asks Jorah what they're planning to do with him, so she's literally clueless and this is clearly not something she made up.

Ultimately, she might have been able to stop it, but... why would she sacrifice her own standing in the eyes of her people and Drogo for the sake of an assassin that tried to kill her just prior? It makes no sense.

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She's always had it in her to be cruel in her punishments.  And there has always been the waking the dragon etc.  It's been obvious to many for some time.  I even know Unsullied who spotted it long ago.

If you just tried to convince me that the show has telegraphed how she would flip from 71 episodes of delivering harsh (but almost always justified) punishments to people who where her actual enemies, into destroying a city that has just surrendered to her and killing all the innocent men, women and children in it in the second to last episode of the entire story, then you failed - hard.

There is buildup for her being impulsive, arrogant, rash, callous and on rare occasions, cruel. 
There is also (even more) buildup for her being compassionate, loving, caring, empathetic and kind. 

There is however no buildup for her becoming a psychopathic mass-murderer completely void of empathy and reason.

Edited by MinscS2

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Thanks @Beardy the Wildling for making this thread. I'll stay around till the death (heh) for catharsis, schadenfreude, and other such unbecoming feelings. I'll watch the last one, most likely loving the visuals & roaring with laughter at the story elements. Then come here and commiserate with my fellow mourners. Once that's out of my system, I'll go back to wishing that (a) the books will be published in a timely manner, and (b) they won't be as awful as the show has been!

 

11 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

[many accurate observations about Dany's character, as shown on GoT]

If you just tried to convince me that the show has telegraphed how she would flip from 71 episodes of delivering harsh (but almost always justified) punishments to people who where her actual enemies, into destroying a city that has just surrendered to her and killing all the innocent men, women and children in it in the second to last episode of the entire story, then you failed - hard.

There is buildup for her being impulsive, arrogant, rash, callous and on rare occasions, cruel. 
There is also (even more) buildup for her being compassionate, loving, caring, empathetic and kind. 

There is however no buildup for her becoming a psychopathic mass-murderer completely void of empathy and reason.

YES!! Such a disservice to a complicated, fascinating character. (Not the only character ill-served by the show's decline, of course.)

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I'll be looking forward to seeing explanations of why Bran became a king in the end and how was this supposedly foreshadowed in the past.

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23 hours ago, Ser Gareth said:

I'm especially hyped to see book fanatics reach a new level of denial about how the show has departed from the books and there is no way events like Dany burning King's Landing is going to happen in the books!

Haha huge mood. 

Im also wondering if the leaks are true. I kept hearing that there were decoy leaks for the finale so :dunno:

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23 hours ago, Beardy the Wildling said:

Well it's been confirmed that the scene D&D are aping is Jon Connington burning KL due to a combination of going insane from greyscale and PTSD from the Battle of the Bells. I've said this a thousand times before, but I'm very down for mad queen Dany, just not... random copy-paste JonCon Dany. Give me a mad queen Dany with actual build-up. I don't think anyone sane gives a fuck about how close the show is to the books when the applicable books haven't been written. They just want a story that makes sense and doesn't rely on random character assassinations/plot-induced idiocy, but I guess that's too much to ask.

Where has this been confirmed?  This is the first that I have heard about it.

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Spoiler

 

I'm looking forward to it. Am I as psyched as other seasons? No, but I just want to see how it ends.

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On 5/17/2019 at 9:02 AM, Beardy the Wildling said:

Who else is hyped for the collapse of this show's reputation?

I am. Crash and burn, worse than Rhaegal and King's Landing, respectively. :lmao:

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7 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

I wonder how many of these show apologists are being paid to vouch for the show.

They aren't. And that, of course, only makes their diehard defence even worse. 

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Even if the previous episodes were liked more no one would be really satisfied with any ending at this point, so really the main drive to watch the final episode is to see how mad everyone gets.  Plus as mentioned above the meme's are always hilarious.

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I am immeasurably more excited for the show to just be over than I am just to watch the final episode. Last band-aid pull is tomorrow. 

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8 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

I wonder how many of these show apologists are being paid to vouch for the show.

Oy. I can’t even count how many showpologists have quietly disappeared. It started in earnest during season 7, but now I barely see any of them here, if at all. 

Weird :idea:

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, The Fattest Leech said:

Oy. I can’t even count how many showpologists have quietly disappeared. It started in earnest during season 7, but now I barely see any of them here, if at all. 

Weird :idea:

I remember one showpologist, Megarova, I think her name was? Had a massive argument with me about how I was 'missing the point' on season 7, that everything would be proven to be a master stroke of genius writing. Ignore the 'Inside the Circlejerk' videos, they were just misdirection.

Of course, now she's disappeared off the face of the earth and apparently deleted all her comments. Turns out that if she'd have just watched the 'inside the episode' videos, all her half-baked, desperate honeypots would be shot down in second, but she kinda forgot those existed.

I mean jeez, on an already bad show, Inside the Episode just serves to ruin any potential clever excuse these remaining poor, deluded souls have. If there was ever a case for 'Death of the Author', it'd be D&D. Fan interpretations of their 'work' exceed their own rationale by far.

Edited by Beardy the Wildling

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There nothing funny how this show didn't set up dany turn right a nd cersei not dying by arya. things is made tv dany way more likable then book dany.

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10 hours ago, Jabar of House Titan said:

I wonder how many of these show apologists are being paid to vouch for the show.

The only worse thing then show apologists at this point, are Dany apologists.:commie:

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Sheiraseastar23 said:

The only worse thing then show apologists at this point, are Dany apologists.:commie:

Guess that depends on your definition of Dany apologist: Is it someone who a) Dislikes how they portrayed her going all mass psycho-murderer in the spawn of one episode, right before she show ends or b) Someone who tries to justify her killing potentially hundreds of thousands of innocents?

Because I'm most definitely a Dany apologist in the a)-sense. I won't defend what she did, but I most certainly think that her portrayal of going from "Mhysa, protector of the downtrodden" to "Queen of Ashes, slaughterer of the downtrodden" is very poorly written, forced, contrived and lacks proper buildup. Especially since it happened a mere 2 episodes after she had just helped the other characters on the show to save the world. 
To quote the sentence of the week: Foreshadowing is not character development. 

Edited by MinscS2

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1 hour ago, MinscS2 said:

Guess that depends on your definition of Dany apologist: Is it someone who a) Dislikes how they portrayed her going all mass psycho-murderer in the spawn of one episode, right before she show ends or b) Someone who tries to justify her killing potentially hundreds of thousands of innocents?

Because I'm most definitely a Dany apologist in the a)-sense. I won't defend what she did, but I most certainly think that her portrayal of going from "Mhysa, protector of the downtrodden" to "Queen of Ashes, slaughterer of the downtrodden" is very poorly written, forced, contrived and lacks proper buildup. Especially since it happened a mere 2 episodes after she had just helped the other characters on the show to save the world. 
To quote the sentence of the week: Foreshadowing is not character development. 

I mean the latter of' course. The writers have obviously fucked up a lot of things since season 4, Dany's decent into madness among them. But after it's all said and done, after episode 5, there is no excusing  her actions in said episode, with or without buildup, yet we have a topic on this very forum of somewhat 20 pages, apologists trying to blame other characters of the show for Dany murdering hundreds of thousands of people. 

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