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SansaJonRule

Best and worst TV series finales, and where does GoT rank? *Spoilers*

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Gotta say, I found the GoT ending toothless and lazy. But I don't  hate it. 

I've viewed GoT much like Fullmetal Alchemist for a while now.  FMA is good, but it's divergence from source material watered it down and lessened it's impact, in my opinion. But then Fullmetal Alchemy Brotherhood, sticking much closer to the original source was vastly more satisfying.  That's how I approach the book material vs. the show.  I can still enjoy both, but know that the original source is superior (IMO). So the finale last night doesn't bother me overly much.

The HIMYM however, that still rankles.  

The Americans is the most recent show to stick the landing in a superior position. 

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I will spoiler tag this in case, but regards to HIMYM,

Spoiler

the reason I hated it so much wasn't that the mother died, that was telegraphed from the opening season, but that we spent AN ENTIRE GODDAMN SEASON on Barney and Robins WEDDING, and then in the final episode they're like, oh well they got divorced like a year later, lol, plus, you know, the entire show was about how Ted and Robin shoudn't end up together, then they do? I know they say they shot that ending a while ago and that was their intent, but, well, if that was their intent, they dun royally fucked it up. More like, How I settled For Your Mother

 

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Yes, Blackadder, well said lads.  Father Ted was decent as well, going down the road of classic British sitcoms.  Ashes to Ashes, I thought had a good ending too.  It was nonsense, in a similar way to Lost, but in their case it absolutely fit with what came before and was satisfying in that way.

American stuff - Mad Men is my favourite, followed the characters right to the end in a fitting way and even left a bit of ambiguity, the best kind of ending.  I like Six Feet Under as well.

GoT was kind of bad, but the worst ending are unsatisfying and/or frustrating and GoT didn’t really put you in that position, it just wasn’t cool, wasn’t interesting and some bits were cringeworthy.

Spoiler

Ah, you’ve made a book with the series name on it?  The worst TV trope around. Ok.

 

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The americans had me worried that they hadn't left enough time to wrap up in the final episode. I should have had more faith.

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11 hours ago, Relic said:

I'd say that GoT would have one of the worst along with BSG but GoT has been such utter trash for years now that it's hard to even get worked up about it anymore. 

The thing with the Thrones ending is that I went into it with such low expectations that it actually ended up being better than expected.  It wasn't good, although the first 20 minutes or so were pretty good.  The main problem is that the writing has been so bad to get to this point that they couldn't possibly have made the necessary narrative leaps for the endings of the prominent characters to feel earned and not out of nowhere.  Like, the end montage could have been great had the previous two seasons properly built up to it, but none of it felt deserved because the last two seasons were so ridiculously rushed and bereft of logic.

And the middle third of the finale was basically more of that illogical, rushed writing that got them into this mess in the first place.  

But still, it wasn't as bad as I thought it was going to be, so I guess bonus points?  

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Posted (edited)

Aye, I think with GoT the expectations game changes everyone's perspective.  With LOST, it seemed the internet expected, even demanded, answers to some questions that are probably best left unanswered anyway (most importantly, what exactly is the island).  With GoT, the immediately preceding episodes were so universally hated and disappointing that it was hard for the finale to fall any further.  And indeed, they did what they've been doing for the past four seasons - fan service, big moments with swelling music, and little to no logic.  So, in that way the finale was "fine," and will likely continue to be viewed as such, and the focus of fans' disappointment will likely rest on the final season as a whole, not the last episode.

Edited by DMC
past FOUR seasons

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4 minutes ago, DMC said:

Aye, I think with GoT the expectations game changes everyone's perspective.  With LOST, it seemed the internet expected, even demanded, answers to some questions that are probably best left unanswered anyway (most importantly, what exactly is the island).

With Lost they spent a lot of time asking that question in the writers' room and came up for 4-5 possibilities. But once they went past a certain point, they realised that answering that question would be a stupid idea, as it would just alienate a chunk of the viewers and whichever answer they went for, it'd be hokey as hell (I get the impression the options were things like an alien spacecraft, a protrusion into our reality of another dimension or possibly a remnant of the Biblical Eden), so the answer was just not to go there and say the Island was exactly what it appeared to be: an island with really weird properties and that was kind of it.

The only other issue Lost I think really had was explaining what the Numbers were in spin-off media that 99% of the viewers had no knowledge of. Beyond that, I've never really seen what massive unanswered mysteries there were. I got into a discussion with this with someone at my last job and they angrily said, "They never explained where the polar bears came from!", which is where I think I lost my last vestiges of faith in humanity.

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2 minutes ago, Werthead said:

But once they went past a certain point, they realised that answering that question would be a stupid idea, as it would just alienate a chunk of the viewers and whichever answer they went for, it'd be hokey as hell (I get the impression the options were things like an alien spacecraft, a protrusion into our reality of another dimension or possibly a remnant of the Biblical Eden)

Yep, regarding the bolded they were exactly right.  I don't think there is - or at least I can't conceive of - a satisfying answer to that question, so just leave it as a mystery.

7 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Beyond that, I've never really seen what massive unanswered mysteries there were. I got into a discussion with this with someone at my last job and they angrily said, "They never explained where the polar bears came from!", which is where I think I lost my last vestiges of faith in humanity.

LOL.

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2 hours ago, john said:

the worst ending are unsatisfying and/or frustrating and GoT didn’t really put you in that position, it just wasn’t cool, wasn’t interesting and some bits were cringeworthy.

I felt it was quite fulfilling and interesting. I loved Tyrion and Jon's conversation in Tyrion's cell, and his explanation of how Dany got to where she was and why she needed to be stopped. Best part of the episode. That and Tyrion facing Dany and throwing away his hand pin.

A few things I would have changed, like having Jon tell Dany he loved her and was sorry as she died. Even though she brought it on herself, I felt very sorry for her. Imagine dying knowing that the man/(woman) you love is the one who killed you.

I would NOT have put Bronn on the small council, and I would left out all the small council banter. It was out of place in this episode. I would have just had them begin the meeting so we knew who was what (although except for Bronn it was obvious), and cut away.

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, red snow said:

I think if "lost" had ended with season 5, I'd have no complaints. I'd probably encourage people who have never seen lost to stop there, or if they have to watch a fan edit of season 6 that doesn't include any sideways segments (i think they exist)

Season 6 was the one I skipped and just read the episode summaries online (I watched it on Netflix). I hated the flash sideways crap.

So, I've seen at least 3 people list Black Sails as a favorite. It's a show I've considered watching. Is the whole series really good?

Edited by SansaJonRule

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21 hours ago, briantw said:

The first four seasons were fine.  It fell apart after that and the ending was outright insulting. 

If the fourth season finale had been the final episode I think it'd be remembered as one of TV's all time great endings.

One of the great accomplishments I've had in TV viewing is to not have a seen a single episode of Dexter after the Season 4 finale. Perfect ending as far as I'm concerned.

21 hours ago, briantw said:

The Shield is my personal favorite.  Just a perfect ending to a great series.

I also like the end of The Wire.  It's not as fantastic as The Shield's end but I think the final montage was about as good as it gets.

The Shield is definitely at the top for me and I'm amazed how well it's held up over time. There was a GRRM post several years ago after the BSG & Lost finale where he commented how Hollywood needs to learn how to write an ending. Still seems true today.

Also, while I have the The Wire high on my list for series finale, I don't actually think it's really that great. It doesn't seem different from the other season finales.. it's just knowing that it's the last episode is what hits you with nostalgia. It's not really about the episode itself. 

 

13 hours ago, Relic said:

I'd say that GoT would have one of the worst along with BSG but GoT has been such utter trash for years now that it's hard to even get worked up about it anymore. 

 

Yeah, I didn't think the GoT finale was bad but I didn't find it very entertaining either. It's just meh to me. It's funny.. I watched every episode of John From Cincinnati like 4 times each while it aired live. I haven't re-watched a single episode of Season 8 GoT and I don't even feel compelled to re-watch the series finale despite it probably being the only ending to ASOIAF I'll ever get. 

 

 

7 hours ago, DMC said:

This.  The Sopranos pissed everybody off on first viewing.  I, like most, thought my cable went out.  But upon repeat viewing - and especially if you believe Tony was shot by Members Only Jacket - it's actually incredibly genius.  And while Chase refuses to confirm that, he essentially has.  There's thousands words analyses on that final scene, and it's actually worth the read.  Plus, the rest of the episode was good to great, Phil's assassination was particularly memorable.  So, I think it's appropriate that the greatest show ever probably deserves the title of greatest finale ever.

Count me among the "Did the power go out?" crowd. But in hindsight, I've warmed a lot more to the Sopranos finale than how I felt initially that Sunday night. No one -- not even Chase, will convince me that Tony survives that scene.

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33 minutes ago, SansaJonRule said:

I felt it was quite fulfilling and interesting.

That's cool, I’m certainly not the arbiter of other people’s enjoyment.  I did like some bits, Tyrion throwing his pin was one, the bit where Drogon nearly burned Jon was quite tense.

But the more I think about it, the more I realise that not only wasn’t it that great, a lot of stuff didn’t make sense either.  Like, what’s all this pick a king and he’ll decide what happens to the traitor.

Plus, and this seems mean, but I realised there wasn’t any good actors left in prominent parts, apart from Dinklage. That probably changed the feel it was supposed to have.

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This thread just reminds me how much I just don't like TV. Can probably count the number of shows I've watched completely on both hands.

Abyhoo, Buffy is the best. Of everything. EVER.

Angel ended good, 30 rock, Star Wars Rebels finale made me cry like a bitch, um...

Can't think of much else I've watched.

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3 hours ago, Darth Richard II said:

I will spoiler tag this in case, but regards to HIMYM,

  Hide contents

the reason I hated it so much wasn't that the mother died, that was telegraphed from the opening season, but that we spent AN ENTIRE GODDAMN SEASON on Barney and Robins WEDDING, and then in the final episode they're like, oh well they got divorced like a year later, lol, plus, you know, the entire show was about how Ted and Robin shoudn't end up together, then they do? I know they say they shot that ending a while ago and that was their intent, but, well, if that was their intent, they dun royally fucked it up. More like, How I settled For Your Mother

 

No. That's a whole lot of the issues with that finale.  Barney and Robin belonged together.

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48 minutes ago, SansaJonRule said:

I loved Tyrion and Jon's conversation in Tyrion's cell

Yes that was certainly the highlight of the episode, and a pretty stark (sorry) reminder of what the show did well in the long long ago.

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3 hours ago, red snow said:

The americans had me worried that they hadn't left enough time to wrap up in the final episode. I should have had more faith.

I think it might be my favourite finale, I particularly like that they managed to do things that I didn't expect at all and yet in retrospect it feels like it is the only way it could have ended.

Also, I agree with everyone who mentioned Blackadder Goes Forth.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SansaJonRule said:

Season 6 was the one I skipped and just read the episode summaries online (I watched it on Netflix). I hated the flash sideways crap.

So, I've seen at least 3 people list Black Sails as a favorite. It's a show I've considered watching. Is the whole series really good?

The answer is that season 1 was about at 7.5 or a 7.0 out of 10. It has some good characters though. After that they just start churning out 10.0 seasons every time until the end. Definitely watch if you have any interest in the subject matter. They stuck the landing as well.

And yeah, I'd definitely vote for the Shield as the best finale of all time.

The concept of the Wire's finale was fantastic. That the game continues and the players just change with the new generation. But, this was after a final season that was the worst season of their run. And it definitely did not have the punch of the Shield finale.

Edited by Martell Spy

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5 hours ago, polishgenius said:

I dislike the BSG finale a lot less than most people do, but yeah, there was some bullshit in it.


GoT was just terrible. I might hate it less with time but I doubt it. There was one scene I didn't think was dreadful, and even that basically took up space from more important stuff that should have been being dealt with.

Yeah other than dumping all of there food producing ships into the sun the finale wasnt as horrible as people like to say.

As for GoT was the one good scene LC Brienne and the White Book?  Cause that rang true.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SansaJonRule said:

So, I've seen at least 3 people list Black Sails as a favorite. It's a show I've considered watching. Is the whole series really good?

The show and it's finale are pretty good. It actually gets stronger after the first season as well if I remember it right (and I liked the first season). It's basically a bunch of pirate and British factions maneuvering against each other with constant machiavellian politics and plot twists.

Edited by WarGalley

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