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Do you feel this show had any negative effect on how you view the books?

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Not sure if Sansa will end up QitN in the books, but I do believe that Dany will attack King's Landing and be killed by Jon, that Bran will be King and Jon will go back North.

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GRRM has said in the past that for him the story is the journey and details of that journey that are important, more so than the end points, where D&D are more focused on the end points and don't really care if the journey is logically consistent.  I think the end story can be fine with a satisfying journey to get there.

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1 minute ago, divica said:

His arc is about him growing up and ruling something, finding who he is, defeating the others...

Obviously it's not. We have seen the end.

2 minutes ago, divica said:

There is nothing that says he will have to be miserable

We have seen the end. Banned to the Night's Watch. Maybe once not following honor but joining Tormund and Ghost.

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5 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Have you seen the show at all?! My goodness. No knowledge, no contributions, would be a way to go.

Arya is 18 now, turning 19. Of course she can have a ship.

I believe the poster was responding to your comment on which book arc will resemble their show arcs. And it’s quite unbelievable for 11-yr old Arya (even if GRRM ages her to say 13) to captain a ship and sail the high seas. And it’s equally impossible for 10 year old Bran to be King of Westeros in the books.

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, teej6 said:

I believe the poster was responding to your comment on which book arc will resemble their show arcs.

Arya is two years younger in the books. Just two years. So nothing about 11 at the end, but about 16 at least. Such nonsense is not even worth commenting.

Maybe the book takes a bit more time anyway. I think GRRM understood that his ages were a little bit too young to start with.

Edited by Kajjo

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Just now, Kajjo said:

Obviously it's not. We have seen the end.

We have seen the end. Banned to the Night's Watch. Maybe once not following honor but joining Tormund and Ghost.

You keep saying with such surety that we’ve seen the end. We’ve seen the end on the show. But in the books Bran is a 9 yr old kid stuck in a tree and we know that GRRM has given up on his 5-yr gap. So how do you suppose he’s going to make a 9 or 10 year old King? 

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Just now, teej6 said:

But in the books Bran is a 9 yr old kid

He is 9 year old at the beginning. Amazingly enough, he gets older year by year.

 

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, teej6 said:

Bran Stark, King of Westeros and Sansa, queen in the North. What sense does that make? Why would the Northmen want an independent North if the sole surviving son to their beloved Ned is King of the seven kingdoms. Why would they want Sansa to rule as queen when there’s a Stark on the throne of Westeros? The whole Sansa being QitN is D&D’s way of appeasing all the fans that will be upset because the female leader (Dany) didn’t get to sit the IT. 

I also think the rest of the kingdoms would be very worried about the intense power of the Starks. Why would they believe he is 'all knowing?' He is essentially a god at this point, and I can't put my finger on why, but a God as King disturbs me. If Bran is how he is in the show- and I think he will lose a lot of his humanity- I wouldn't want him to be king. I have to admit Sansa as single QITN has been a dream of mine for a long time so I'm a little biased. 

edit: Also I don't think GRRM is against female rulers, they just have to make sense in the patriarchal world of Westeros. There is already a lot of talk of her being the rightful heir, she's just been paired off and used a pawn to get there. 

Edited by fairwarging

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Before Kindle, I heard a well read writer say once that it is always good to have your books made into movies even if it sucks. If it's good, then people buy the books and read them. If it sucks, everyone proclaims the books far better, and buys them. There is no losing for the author here. I agree because the books are almost always better and deserve more attention. Once in a while a book makes serious mistakes that the movie corrects, like one I refrain from naming so as to stay on topic.

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3 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Arya is two years younger in the books. Just two years. So nothing about 11 at the end, but about 16 at least. Such nonsense is not even worth commenting.

Maybe the book takes a bit more time anyway. I think GRRM understood that his ages were a little bit too young to start with.

Arya is what 11 years in the books. She has aged two years in 5 books. You think she’s miraculously going to age another 5 years in the next two books? In the show apparently, Arya is now 18. GRRM will have to write 5 more books to get Arya to be 16.

And there’s no need to be rude. No one is forcing you to respond.

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5 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Arya is two years younger in the books. Just two years. So nothing about 11 at the end, but about 16 at least. Such nonsense is not even worth commenting.

Maybe the book takes a bit more time anyway. I think GRRM understood that his ages were a little bit too young to start with.

 

3 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

He is 9 year old at the beginning. Amazingly enough, he gets older year by year.

 

Have you read the books? Jon is 16 or 17 in the last book. The story takes place between 2 to 3 years so far...

And a kid that spends 5 years in the wilderness wihtout learning how to rule makes even less sense to become king. It is the kind of thing grrm doesn t do. Whoever is chosen to rule must know how to rule! you don t learn it by living in a cave...

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1 minute ago, Stark_in_Winterfell said:

Before Kindle, I heard a well read writer say once that it is always good to have your books made into movies even if it sucks. If it's good, then people buy the books and read them. If it sucks, everyone proclaims the books far better, and buys them. There is no losing for the author here. I agree because the books are almost always better and deserve more attention. Once in a while a book makes serious mistakes that the movie corrects, like one I refrain from naming so as to stay on topic.

I think there is some damage for the more intense fans. They've been soured quite a bit (I'm ok with the endgame, and there are so many threads delved into in the TWOW sample chapters that the book didn't even touch.) If he doesn't finish the books, his legacy will be muddied which makes me sad. I can only hope he delivers two excellent books. Though I would be satisfied with one. 

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6 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

He is 9 year old at the beginning. Amazingly enough, he gets older year by year.

 

Bran is 7 in the start of the books. Read the books before you comment. And amazingly enough he’s just aged two years in five books. 

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5 minutes ago, fairwarging said:

edit: Also I don't think GRRM is against female rulers, they just have to make sense in the patriarchal world of Westeros. There is already a lot of talk of her being the rightful heir, she's just been paired off and used a pawn to get there. 

People want to marry sansa because of her claim. So that they become the rulers of the north. We already have our female ruler with dany. If sansa ends up as ruler of something (and my Money is on the vale because it is what makes more sense at the moment and she has changed so much that she doesn t really belong in the north) then it will be as a widow with a kid or two. Because it is the only way it makes sense...

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so far Yes, I've read here in the forums that show and books will have similar endings, even when Martin makes it more satisfactory in the books, I think the show damaged by view of it, I invest a lot of time, hope and emotion for the series and they give me a ridiculously stupid ending.

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so far Yes, I've read here in the forums that show and books will have similar endings, even when Martin makes it more satisfactory in the books, I think the show damaged by view of it, I invest a lot of time, hope and emotion for the series and they give me a ridiculously stupid ending.

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3 minutes ago, fairwarging said:

I think there is some damage for the more intense fans. They've been soured quite a bit (I'm ok with the endgame, and there are so many threads delved into in the TWOW sample chapters that the book didn't even touch.) If he doesn't finish the books, his legacy will be muddied which makes me sad. I can only hope he delivers two excellent books. Though I would be satisfied with one. 

I'm old so reading has always been my thing. I realize younger viewers don't connect with reading the same way now and a bad show can do a lot of damage.

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12 minutes ago, fairwarging said:

edit: Also I don't think GRRM is against female rulers, they just have to make sense in the patriarchal world of Westeros. There is already a lot of talk of her being the rightful heir, she's just been paired off and used a pawn to get there. 

I don’t think he is either. My point was that D&D in turning Dany into the antagonist and killing her in the end freaked out and felt they had to appease the viewership by making Sansa QitN. I’m sure Sansa will be a ruler (probably of the Vale) of some sort in the end, but I doubt it will be the queen of an independent North. And if Bran takes the throne, it makes no sense for the North to want to be independent. 

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7 minutes ago, divica said:

People want to marry sansa because of her claim. So that they become the rulers of the north. We already have our female ruler with dany. If sansa ends up as ruler of something (and my Money is on the vale because it is what makes more sense at the moment and she has changed so much that she doesn t really belong in the north) then it will be as a widow with a kid or two. Because it is the only way it makes sense...

Whatever your opinion of Dany's storyline, I think it's pretty clear in the books she's toast. The point is that Sansa was the least Northern of the children, but recognized her Stark roots and reclaimed them, which is a storyline I can really get behind. With Bran missing, she is the presumed heir to the north, so why would it make more sense for her to rule the Vale when she zero claim? The best she can hope for in the vale is brood mare and Regent. And there can be more than one female ruler, though I think there won't be. 

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I’ll let you know in 10 years when the WoW is hopefully out. Right now I’m just disappointed with this ending.

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