Did Bran Play Everyone? Is Bran The bad Guy of The Overall Plot?

[chatty83]

I just don't really get Brans character. I guess the story they are trying to tell is that innocent Bran is the saviour of Westeros, the good King, he doesn't want to be there but through his adventures he has acquired the skills and character to do the best job for the people of Westeros. The Night King wanted to kill Bran because he knew this and if Bran died then Dany would lead a reign of terror that would destroy the kingdoms and leave nothing but ice and fire... That's the plot, I guess.

 

But seems a bit to convenient to me. Bran positioned everybody to get him to the Throne. He didn't need to divide Jon and Dany and had he not told Jon or pushed this agenda it would trigger different events:

1. Jon and Dany wouldn't be divided. They would likely marry and Dany wouldn't go tyrant as she wouldn't have felt Jons betrayal and she would have seeked better guidance.
2. Varys wouldn't have also had to choose between the rightful heirs and thus would have been poised in a better position to do whats right for the kingdom. Dany would get better advise and Jon was happy to sit on his secret and be loyal to his queen so it would have made no difference.
3. With those in place I have no doubt Dany doesn't decide to rule by fear and destroy Kings Landing. We likely get them taking the win when the bells are rang and Dany taking the Throne in peace. Knowing she could lead this way would give her a complete alternate perception to what we got. She would have saw Jons plea for mercy through and there opposing traits and philosophies to ruling would combine to find a perfect middleground for ruling.

The Kingdom would have been better off with a united leadership of Jon and Dany. Now we have a kingdom filled with pent up aggressions that are likely to boil over and spill blood again. Nothing was really resolved. Jon himself said it didn't feel right and I think that was the point, he did the wrong thing but this time it didn't pay off.

Also why have Bran mention Drogon and then say he'll find him himself, has Bran warged Drogon before?

Yeah, Im just convincing myself of a more interesting ending that the shitfest we got but that's what Ive been left to do so why not?

[Vanadis]

It's hard to try to disentangle which choices were made because plot demanded it and which choices were made out of character agency.

Seeing how the showrunners prefer to tell a story, it is obvious that building up unexpected turns and getting viewers to experience shock, good or bad, trumps giving us the information we need in order to understand the characters' motivations.

In Bran's case, my guess is:

With Daenerys as the ultimate villain, this has become a classical fantasy story of good vs evil.

The Stark kids then, all of them, were the good guys in a tale of how they managed to defeat evil once and for all. And it is a coming of age story, one of dreams and finding one's way to the fulfillment of those dreams: One ends up as queen, one as king, two get the adventures they always wanted.

In this coming of age story, Bran may be manipulative, but if he helps the pieces fall into place so that he can become king, then by the mere fact that he is a Stark, i.e. one of the heroes in a classic fantasy tale, his actions are good.

However, if we could back up a few seasons and place this ending within the complex framework that used to be Game of Thrones, then Bran's climb to power would be more sinister because then the show didn't try to be a standard fantasy story.
 

[Sir Hedge of Hog]

I had lots of theories that bran was the great other and this was a plot by the cotf to gain revenge against man for the wiping them out etc.

if he had not revealed the secret to sam and hence jon, then jon/dany would have been married - happy etc.. she would have had her counsellors and jon to keep her in place...

but this would have been a happy ending (ish) and we had the drama of dnay going bad..

 

[Quentyn Kartell]

Bran is Evil... And once the new King Beyond The Wall realizes this, he'll be back for what's rightfully his.

[Moseh Khayim]

Strong argument for that. Seeing as he's omnipotent. 

[Johnston]

We'll find out in the prequel.  Got the feeling questions have been left unanswered to encourage viewing of the new show, 

[L’Age d’or]

Bran was just used as a tool for the writers to "subvert expectations" yet again. Trying to rationalise it through a retrospective examination of Bran's decisions is reading too much into it. 

[bb1180]

Yes,  I do believe that he was the true villain and came to that conclusion last night for similar reasons.  

[Winter prince]

Add one to the Bran being the true villain team. The ending also showed us back to square one. The king is absent and the small council is running the 6 kingdoms. And Bran stuck the burden of guilt on Jon Snow.

[Wagshell]

There aren't going to be any sequels apparently, so how it was left is how it is. Bran didn't become a villain, so that's a story for you to create in your own fan fiction. It clearly wasn't the conclusion we were left with.

[joaozinm]

So you think he is indeed an entity of evil and Magic.

He can see the past, the present and glimpse into the future.

In a world of dragon's, zombie armies, ressurrection, face changers and direwolves you think ALL he wanted was to be king of 6 kingdoms with bronn as his Master of coins?

[Kajjo]

1 hour ago, Vanadis said:

With Daenerys as the ultimate villain, this has become a classical fantasy story of good vs evil.

Yes and no.

Daenerys was not the "ultimate villain", she was just limited by her own ambitions vs. reality. She had a good heart, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Daenerys was one of our most grey-nuanced characters and she is not ultimately bad, but she features some traits that made her fail.

Game of Thrones is not a classical phantasy story. It avoids black-and-white quite carefully and manages a bittersweet ending that fits. But yes, the good somehow perseveres.

2 hours ago, chatty83 said:

Also why have Bran mention Drogon and then say he'll find him himself, has Bran warged Drogon before?

Greensight and warging are entirely different things.

[GeorgeIAF]

Would have been even better if Bloodraven warged into him before dying so basically we have a Targ bastard in charge, but of course that's just fanfiction.

 

[Vanadis]

4 minutes ago, Kajjo said:

Daenerys was not the "ultimate villain", she was just limited by her own ambitions vs. reality. She had a good heart, but the road to hell is paved with good intentions. Daenerys was one of our most grey-nuanced characters and she is not ultimately bad, but she features some traits that made her fail.

Game of Thrones is not a classical phantasy story. It avoids black-and-white quite carefully and manages a bittersweet ending that fits. But yes, the good somehow perseveres.

Greensight and warging are entirely different things.

We're going to have to agree to disagree

Game of Thrones used to be a complex unfolding of human relations with conflicting desires and aspirations, yes, but I think the pain many feel the past seasons is precisely that it transformed into a classical fantasy story, and sacrificed nuance and character development on the way. 

Dany was a complex character originally who was shoehorned into the role of final boss.

 

[Kajjo]

2 minutes ago, Vanadis said:

that it transformed into a classical fantasy story, and sacrificed nuance and character development on the way. 

I don't think so. This is moaning too much.

The show turned into mainstream, was less daring, less creative, less provocative. But the overall storyline fits. Season 8 in particular was too rushed and should have taken 10 episodes, but that is bad telling, not bad story.

[tallTale]

Maybe in the books we'll see Bran do something evil.

But in the show he just gives information and he helps kill the NK.

You can say his information ended up getting many people killed, but it's such a subtle heal turn that it leaves too much up for interpretation. 

I do believe we get evil-Bran in the books, but who knows when that happens 

[Vanadis]

1 minute ago, Kajjo said:

I don't think so. This is moaning too much.

The show turned into mainstream, was less daring, less creative, less provocative. But the overall storyline fits. Season 8 in particular was too rushed and should have taken 10 episodes, but that is bad telling, not bad story.

Oh, I'm sure it is possible to tell the same story and even with the same beats without turning it into a classical fantasy story. Perhaps some day someone will...

[Brendan Hughes]

Bran. Current World Champ of The Game Of Thrones.

 

It's going to be hard to top that game winning strategy of near Omnipotence...

[Aedam Targaryen]

2 hours ago, chatty83 said:

The Kingdom would have been better off with a united leadership of Jon and Dany. Now we have a kingdom filled with pent up aggressions that are likely to boil over and spill blood again. Nothing was really resolved. Jon himself said it didn't feel right and I think that was the point, he did the wrong thing but this time it didn't pay off.

Also why have Bran mention Drogon and then say he'll find him himself, has Bran warged Drogon before?

This assumes that a Dany/Jon marriage would go smoothly and they would stay united the length of their lives, no one would ever try to betray them or divide them, Dany wouldn’t get crazier with age, and none of their eventual Targaryen children would land on the crazy side of the crazy coin. Breaking the tradition of a kings child automatically becoming the next king seems like a better long term solution, not just a solution for right now. That is what has been resolved. 

Even though Jon probably saved a lot of lives by doing so, it of course feels wrong to murder someone you love.

And I thought the ‘I’ll find him myself’ line about Drogon meant that Bran would warg some birds and fly around and find him like he did when searching for NK on his dragon in ep3. 

[SuperMario]

The fact that we are even debating whether Bran is ultimately evil or not shows how bad the showrunners fucked this up. Clearly, their intent was Bran was selected because of his purity and....storied past, apparently.

But we as the audience saw what he was capable of and how he knew this all along. He essentially let millions of people die to what? Start something new? Become king?