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Master thread on what the Show means for the book plot

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Einheri said:

So, according to Isaac Hempstead Wright, King Bran is actually a plotpoint from GRRM:

"[Creators] David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] told me there were two things [author] George R.R. Martin had planned for Bran, and that was the Hodor revelation, and that he would be king. So that’s pretty special to be directly involved in something that is part of George’s vision. It was a really nice way to wrap it up."

http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/season-8-episode-6-finale-isaac-hempstead-wright-bran-interview

Yup, that's the one. Finally the silly "He's a tree! Never leaving his cave!" sceptics will finally give it a rest, just like the R+L=J deniers ultimately were proven wrong when Martin confirmed that D&D got it right.

Long live King Bran the Broken. Long may he reign, calmly and coolly curing the realm of its burning wounds.

Edited by CrypticWeirwood

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6 hours ago, divica said:

Neither jon arryn, ned or hoster tully have any afection for joffrey. However they would have followed him simply because he was robert's heir.

They swore vows to Aerys, the broke those vows and swore vows to Robert.

Lords and Houses break vows, that is what the Lords of the Riverlands have done.

6 hours ago, divica said:

They already gave their vows to follow robb.

Who gave vows to Robb that they'd accept a bastard with no Tully blood as their King?

In fact which Lords made Robb the King and which of those Lords are still alive and in power by the end of ADWD and which will break their new oath to the Crown?

The Darry kid is dead, Edmure is out of power, the Freys are clearly no longer a fan of Robb as King, Lord Vypren and Lord Charlton aided the Freys at the Red Wedding, House Whent no longer exists, House Bracken was one of the first to jump ship and spent 6 months fighting for the Crown.

Blackwood, Piper, (1) Vance and Mallister may be the only current Lords who swore Robb as their king.

 

6 hours ago, divica said:

They already gave their vows to follow robb. Them following his heir is a result of the vows they made to robb.

They did and then they renounced them when they made new vows to the Crown.

Robb's been dead for a year in the books. Why has no one in the North or the Rivelands called Jon King?

Jon may well be King, another Stark may well become King but it won't be because of Robb's will.

6 hours ago, divica said:

The people still resisting in the riverlands used direwolves standards (if I remember right)...

There was two Houses still resisting. Blackfish at Riverrun, since captured and now flying the Baratheon sigil for Tommen and House Blackwood waiting for Jaime to get victory as they did not want the Blackwoods to claim it.

No Lords in the Riverlands are under the Direwolf standard per the events of the Jaime chapters in AFFC and ADWD.

6 hours ago, divica said:

And with uncat and the blackfish it makes sense that they will try to make the riverlands follow robb's heir in order to continue the fight. And I doubt that the riverlords prefer a targaryen to a stark...

Robb was their king for months. And after saving the nobles at Riverrun he abandoned them and did nothing to help them while the Northmen under Roose and the Karstark men raped and plundered from the local populace.

The Riverlands were as sick of the Wolves as they were the Lions in the books.  

https://asearchoficeandfire.com/?q=wolves+lions

Robb's reign as King is not something that is going to be remembered fondly in the Riverlands.

 

 

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6 hours ago, Einheri said:

So, according to Isaac Hempstead Wright, King Bran is actually a plotpoint from GRRM:

"[Creators] David [Benioff] and Dan [Weiss] told me there were two things [author] George R.R. Martin had planned for Bran, and that was the Hodor revelation, and that he would be king. So that’s pretty special to be directly involved in something that is part of George’s vision. It was a really nice way to wrap it up."

http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/season-8-episode-6-finale-isaac-hempstead-wright-bran-interview

One could say D&D were trying to give us a good show as long as possible but had to end up with GRRMs shitty book ending contractually.

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2 hours ago, CrypticWeirwood said:

Yup, that's the one. Finally the silly "He's a tree! Never leaving his cave!" sceptics will finally give it a rest, just like the R+L=J deniers ultimately were proven wrong when Martin confirmed that D&D got it right.

I remember D&D saying they would not tell what is right from GRRM and what is their plot.

None the less, I still don't believe Bran will leave the cave. I still think it shitty to have him king of the south kingdoms.
I will not believe it until GRRM says it squarely and how and why.

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On 5/21/2019 at 9:34 PM, Lost Melnibonean said:

No, Barristan I was published in the paperback version of Dance. Theon, Winds was never published. I say no more. :)

Theon I is published in my aDwD edition: Harper Voyager, paperback edition 2012, 26

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15 minutes ago, sweetsunray said:

Theon I is published in my aDwD edition: Harper Voyager, paperback edition 2012, 26

Theon's chapter was on GRRM web site on December 28th 2011. First chapter after ADWD.

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Isaac has stated that D&D told him two things coming straight from GRRM: Hodor, and him being King. So there you go...

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How in the world does Bran get from the cave to the Iron Throne in the books. I can't see how you could realistically do that. Why would anyone follow him at that stage, let alone make him the King of Westeros. There's no logical reason Dorne, Iron Islands, Westerlands, Stormlands etc would declare for him. 

 

That's killed a lot of my enthusiasm for the books now. 

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, aFeastForDragons said:

How in the world does Bran get from the cave to the Iron Throne in the books. I can't see how you could realistically do that. Why would anyone follow him at that stage, let alone make him the King of Westeros. There's no logical reason Dorne, Iron Islands, Westerlands, Stormlands etc would declare for him. 

 

That's killed a lot of my enthusiasm for the books now. 

Yeah...Bran ending king in the last 2 books is the equivalent of Dany ending mad in 1 episode in the show. I think we're slowly realizing that we were fooled by the books as we were fooled by the show that it is something great. At least that is how it feels to me.

Anyway, it might seem exaggerated for some but I'm selling the books I bought and won't bother buying the new ones..that is, if the last one we'll ever be published. 

I've lost any enthusiasm for this series. This is the first time this happens to me when it comes to books. I've read books with not so good endings or where my favorites end up getting the short end of the stick but I never felt so disappointed. Ever. I'm still reeling over this nonsensical ending.

Edited by Ruki88

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1 minute ago, aFeastForDragons said:

How in the world does Bran get from the cave to the Iron Throne in the books. I can't see how you could realistically do that.

Well there will be the Hodor sacrifice that will be a big help.  I imagine coldhands or maybe Benjen or a combination of the two will help with the journey.  Also Book Bran will probably have more powers and maybe warg some northern animals to help along the way.  More so then ravens scouting which is pretty much the extent of what Bran did.

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Again. Martin may have told them Bran will be king, but it seems there will be two kingdoms at the end of the series. Might be George meant Bran would be King in the North. Which makes FAR more sense, given that he is Ned’s oldest surviving son.

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Posted (edited)

Well, probably it will mean there will be more than 2 books. 

I mean, we need to see:

  1.  Dany getting Essos to order
  2. Stannis reaching Winterfell
  3. Winterfell Battle
  4. Stannis going back to the Wall
  5. Stannis burning Shireen
  6. Jon's resurrection
  7. Jon going back to Winterfell
  8. Boltons dying
  9. Euron doing whatever shit he planned
  10. Aegon doing whatever shit he planned
  11. Dornish girls doing whatever shit Doran planned
  12. Sansa doing whatever shit Petyr planned
  13. Shit happens to Margaery and Tyrells
  14. Arya getting bakc to Westeros
  15. Deny getting back to Westeros
  16. Somebody deal with Freys
  17. Somebody deals with Cersei
  18. Somebody deals with Others
  19. Bran coming back from the cave
  20. Bran becoming a king
  21. Everybody gets some conclusion

There are more action than it happened in 5 books before. I mean, Stannis was crawling to Winterfell for 1.5 books already. Given current pace GRRM will need 10 new books to finalize all this shit

 

Edited by DanaKz

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3 hours ago, T and A said:

Isaac has stated that D&D told him two things coming straight from GRRM: Hodor, and him being King. So there you go...

Not surprising. I'm ok with it.

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1 minute ago, DanaKz said:

Well, probably it will mean there will be more than 2 books. 

I mean, we need to see:

  1.  Dany getting Essos to order
  2. Stannis reaching Winterfell
  3. Winterfell Battle
  4. Stannis going back to the Wall
  5. Stannis burning Shireen
  6. Jon's resurrection
  7. Jon going back to Winterfell
  8. Boltons dying
  9. Euron doing whatever shit he planned
  10. Aegon doing whatever shit he planned
  11. Dornish girls doing whatever shit Doran planned
  12. Sansa doing whatever shit Petyr planned
  13. Shit happens to Margaery and Tyrells
  14. Arya getting bakc to Westeros
  15. Deny getting back to Westeros
  16. Somebody deal with Freys
  17. Somebody deals with Cersei
  18. Somebody deals with Others
  19. Bran coming back from the cave
  20. Bran becoming a king
  21. Everybody gets some conclusion

There are more action than it happened in 5 books before. I mean, Stannis was crawling to Winterfell for 1.5 books already. Given current pace GRRM will need 10 new books to finalize all this shit

  1. Everybody clean

 

Yeah. As I said before the pacing of this whole series is off. How are all those things supposed to happen in just 2 books when the Lannister-Stark/War of the 5 Kings conflict lasted 3 books, and when 5 books in we're still kinda in the middle of the story?

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44 minutes ago, DanaKz said:

Somebody deal with Freys

Whatever the hell is going on with Lady Stoneheart and her Riverlands gang would take up about half a book by itself.

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6 hours ago, BalerionTheCat said:

I remember D&D saying they would not tell what is right from GRRM and what is their plot.

None the less, I still don't believe Bran will leave the cave. I still think it shitty to have him king of the south kingdoms.
I will not believe it until GRRM says it squarely and how and why.

Wellthis isnt D&D telling us, it is Isaac relaying information he received while shooting.

And he says King, not of where though

1 hour ago, aFeastForDragons said:

How in the world does Bran get from the cave to the Iron Throne in the books. I can't see how you could realistically do that. Why would anyone follow him at that stage, let alone make him the King of Westeros. There's no logical reason Dorne, Iron Islands, Westerlands, Stormlands etc would declare for him. 

 

That's killed a lot of my enthusiasm for the books now. 

Rather premature to say this when:

a) there are at minimum two books worth of content to change the circumstances as they currently stand

b) as mentioned above, and also by @Free Northman Reborn, Isaac only says Bran becomes King. This could mean King in the North, which would make a lot more sense. Couldnstill mean King of the 7Kingdoms too, but there are two books to get there as i’ve said.

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

And he says King, not of where though

Come on, that is just plain stupid. Now people are just forcing it...

It was stupid to even think that it was D&D's idea to put Bran on the throne. They hated that character. 

But now some people just sound desperate, which looks pretty sad. 

Edited by T and A

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3 minutes ago, T and A said:

Come on, that is just plain stupid. Now people are just forcing it...

It was stupid to even think that it was D&D's idea to put Bran on the throne. They hated that character. 

But now some people just sound desperate, which looks pretty sad. 

I agree.  If the show made Bran king then they got it from GRRM, anything else is more wishful thinking, just like what people have done about Dany.

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7 minutes ago, T and A said:

Come on, that is just plain stupid. Now people are just forcing it...

It was stupid to even think that it was D&D's idea to put Bran on the throne. They hated that character. 

But now some people just sound desperate, which looks pretty sad. 

How is it stupid? Its a valid interpretation. And i’m very much open to the possibility i’m wrong and he does in fact mean King of the Seven Kingdoms. 

That Isaac just said King does leave open the possibility of KitN. I see nothing stupid about acknowledging that

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