International Thread 3

[sologdin]

breaching the term limit and shouldn't be running

this is incorrect, as per the case law there--though as a practical matter he could've made it easier by passing the torch. salient editorial here, wherein it is revealed inter alia that the interim adminstration is a real peach:

Quote

 

His replacement, Jeanine Añez Chávez, agreed. “I dream of a Bolivia free of satanic indigenous rites,” the opposition senator tweeted in 2013, “the city is not for the Indians who should stay in the highlands or the Chaco!!!” After Evo’s departure, Chavez declared herself interim president while holding up a large bible, though she failed to get the required quorum in the senate to do so.

Next to her stood Luis Fernando Camacho, a member of the Christian far-right. After Evo’s resignation, Camacho stormed the presidential palace, a flag in one hand and a bible in the other. “The bible is returning to the government palace,” a pastor said on a video while standing next to Camacho. “Pachamama will never return. Today Christ is returning to the Government Palace. Bolivia is for Christ.”

 

 

[Varysblackfyre321]

1 hour ago, sologdin said:

breaching the term limit and shouldn't be running

this is incorrect, as per the case law there--though as a practical matter he could've made it easier by passing the torch. salient editorial here, wherein it is revealed inter alia that the interim adminstration is a real peach:

 

Really glad this pretty open fascist is in charge of Bolivia  now. it’s finally free again—for bigots to force their interpretation of Christianity in government and onto everyone else, and persecute natives and other undesirable(looking at you gays, atheists) once more. 

I’m being sarcastic.

[sologdin]

in the 80s they had the cocaine coup and escaped NSDAP war criminals; now they have elon musk.

[TrueMetis]

It does seem pretty messed up. You don't get the kind of numbers in the streets you see in a foreign coup, so there's clearly a lot of homegrown elements. But some really shit people are absolutely taking advantage. The people marching though don't seem to have decided that since Evo is gone after thing is fine though, which is good.

[Paxter]

4 hours ago, sologdin said:

breaching the term limit and shouldn't be running

this is incorrect, as per the case law there--though as a practical matter he could've made it easier by passing the torch. salient editorial here, wherein it is revealed inter alia that the interim adminstration is a real peach:

Legally incorrect, sure. But you'd think that Bolivians knew what they were doing when they voted (albeit marginally) not to let him stand again. It's hardly a Brexit scenario. 

[sologdin]

right.  the referendum is one thing, the ruling of the constitutional court quite another.  i think MAS should've retired him into elder statesperson status and run someone else.

[Varysblackfyre321]

The news just keeps getting so much better for Bolivia: 

In Bolivia, at least 23 people have died amid escalating violence since President Evo Morales, the country’s first indigenous president, resigned at the demand of the military last week. Growing unrest 

https://www.democracynow.org/2019/11/18/bolivia_cochabamba_massacre_anti_indigenous_violence

Really glad this racist monster took control of basically illegally took control of the country.

Sarcasm.

Honestly, the fact that the vast majority not of the people who cried it’d be heartless for the US not to stage a coup a Venezuela in response to Maduro's supposed oppression are either silent or praising this fascist really does demonstrate glaring hypocrisy.

When Bolivians are fleeing by the millions to escape, persecution for their ethnicity and religion most of the response to the tragedy would be...to announce this new dictator is more pro-US and that's good for the world...because It  of reasons.

Also, I wonder big a win the ultra-conservatives will give themselves when new, and ”fair” Elections are called. Will it be a 97% vote in their favor to showcase an image of overwhelming support to the facist they'd prop up.  Or will they try to appear more realistic just go with say 60 percent. 

 

[Paxter]

4 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

The news just keeps getting so much better for Bolivia: 

In Bolivia, at least 23 people have died amid escalating violence since President Evo Morales, the country’s first indigenous president, resigned at the demand of the military last week. Growing unrest 

https://www.democracynow.org/2019/11/18/bolivia_cochabamba_massacre_anti_indigenous_violence

Really glad this racist monster took control of basically illegally took control of the country.

Sarcasm.

Honestly, the fact that the vast majority not of the people who cried it’d be heartless for the US not to stage a coup a Venezuela in response to Maduro's supposed oppression are either silent or praising this fascist really does demonstrate glaring hypocrisy.

When Bolivians are fleeing by the millions to escape, persecution for their ethnicity and religion most of the response to the tragedy would be...to announce this new dictator is more pro-US and that's good for the world...because It  of reasons.

Also, I wonder big a win the ultra-conservatives will give themselves when new, and ”fair” Elections are called. Will it be a 97% vote in their favor to showcase an image of overwhelming support to the facist they'd prop up.  Or will they try to appear more realistic just go with say 60 percent. 

 

Bolivians are fleeing in their millions? It's a smallish country so I wouldn't mind a source on that. 

Let's hope that the next round of elections truly are fair, though I understand the heavy skepticism. Obviously there's questions around how fair they were last time when Evo managed to avoid a run-off by a conveniently small margin. To be fair to Evo, he did agree to an audit and a recount if warranted. 

[DireWolfSpirit]

27 minutes ago, Paxter said:

Bolivians are fleeing in their millions? It's a smallish country so I wouldn't mind a source on that. 

Let's hope that the next round of elections truly are fair, though I understand the heavy skepticism. Obviously there's questions around how fair they were last time when Evo managed to avoid a run-off by a conveniently small margin. To be fair to Evo, he did agree to an audit and a recount if warranted. 

Do you have any solid proof that Evo didn't fairly win the majority when he was elected?

As an outsider it always appears the chicanery is from right wingers in Latin America and when put to popular vote the socialists have more support till the wheels of oligarchs, junta's and CIA supported groups start working on the next coup.

[Paxter]

2 minutes ago, DireWolfSpirit said:

Do you have any solid proof that Evo didn't fairly win the majority when he was elected?

As an outsider it always appears the chicanery is from right wingers in Latin America and when put to popular vote the socialists have more support till the wheels of oligarchs, junta's and CIA supported groups start working on the next coup.

No I do not have solid proof (nor does my post imply otherwise). There are significant questions around fairness, as correctly raised by the OAS Electoral Observation Mission. On the back of these questions, Evo himself went on TV to invite an audit of the votes and promised to hold a run-off election if any fraud was discovered.

[Varysblackfyre321]

21 hours ago, Paxter said:

Bolivians are fleeing in their millions? It's a smallish country so I wouldn't mind a source on that. 

 

I said ”when Bolivians are fleeing”

Not that they’re doing it now. I strongly suspect they will be forced to, however. It 

 

[Paxter]

1 hour ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

I said ”when Bolivians are fleeing”

Not that they’re doing it now. I strongly suspect they will be forced to, however. 

Ok sorry I misread that. Let’s hope it never gets to that point. 

[Varysblackfyre321]

2 hours ago, Paxter said:

Ok sorry I misread that. Let’s hope it never gets to that point. 

It does seem to be heading there sadly. 

I sincerely do hope that the Bolivians beat back the right. They’ve ousted their dictators before. But it doesn’t appear to be something that will go anymore peacefully than the last times.. Áñez has already said the MAS party from participating in future elections. Normally the Judicial system would keep a proclamation from any president in check, but she and her supporters clearly have the military and police on her side. 

I do not see this ending peacefully. I see no good reason should the fascists prevail—and indeed there’s a strong chance they will—they will do anything but try to destroy any trace of their political opposition through total extermination. 

[HexMachina]

Netanyahu was indicted on thursday for bribery, fraud and breach of trust

[Paxter]

And the Rajapaksas are back in power in Sri Lanka. Fairly predictable after the Easter attacks and the fallout between Sirisena and Wickremesinghe. 

Bibi is going to hard to get rid of. But the indictment was certainly an important step.

 

[Rorshach]

On 9/15/2019 at 9:22 PM, dornishpen said:

Why did you like such an outdated article? It's more than 35 years old and those facts are no longer true. The majority of Ethiopian Jews now live in Israel and Israel carried out some now famous operations to bring them to Israel (Sudan and also the using many planes to airlift thousands of Ethiopian Jews in one day). 

 

Also just as an aside, unlike what that article said, ritual purification by immersion in water is a major part of rabbinic Judaism.

Just chiming in - late - to point out that those left behind aren't really all that much better off, AFAIK.

It's been - what, 15 years? Time flies! - since I was in Gondar, and we visited a Jewish village outside. Conditions were poor.

On that note, I seem to remember something about those still remaining being considered non-Jews by Israel, but I most certainly may be wrong on that account. 

Finally, a movie worth seeing that relates to this somewhat: Live and Become

[dornishpen]

9 minutes ago, Rorshach said:

Just chiming in - late - to point out that those left behind aren't really all that much better off, AFAIK.

It's been - what, 15 years? Time flies! - since I was in Gondar, and we visited a Jewish village outside. Conditions were poor.

On that note, I seem to remember something about those still remaining being considered non-Jews by Israel, but I most certainly may be wrong on that account. 

Finally, a movie worth seeing that relates to this somewhat: Live and Become

As I understand it there have definitely been issues with racism in terms of the Ethiopian Jewish community and their status as Jews and their treatment in Israel. Israeli law though doesn't require one to be halachacally Jewish to immigrate, but to have one Jewish grandparent (so basically anyone who would have been killed by the Nazis). I did find this article so maybe since Bibi has been indicted and hopefully there will be a new PM soon we can hope things will change for the people mentioned in this article who waiting for aliyah, since it sounds like another racist policy from his government.

[Rorshach]

4 minutes ago, dornishpen said:

As I understand it there have definitely been issues with racism in terms of the Ethiopian Jewish community and their status as Jews and their treatment in Israel. Israeli law though doesn't require one to be halachacally Jewish to immigrate, but to have one Jewish grandparent (so basically anyone who would have been killed by the Nazis). I did find this article so maybe since Bibi has been indicted and hopefully there will be a new PM soon we can hope things will change for the people mentioned in this article who waiting for aliyah, since it sounds like another racist policy from his government.

Seems there has been movement on the issue in the 15 years since I was there. That's good, 

For the remaining few, though, this must be a horrible situation. Knowing that most of your tribe has emigrated, while you continue to live in poor conditions in a very poor country.. 

Agree completely on the "new PM"-thing.

[The Anti-Targ]

Good speech. Wasn't sure where to put it, but because it's a global issue Int'l thread seemed most appropriate. I can't argue with really anything he says. Though I'm sure there could be some unpicking of the parts where he's talking about freedom of expression. But end of the day, every private entity gets to choose what information it associates with, and with whom it will associate. I am relatively confident that ISIS doesn't have a Facebook page or gets ad buys on Facebook micro-targeted to Muslim and Muslim-curious users. But I don't use FB so I'm not 100% sure.

[dornishpen]

10 hours ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Good speech. Wasn't sure where to put it, but because it's a global issue Int'l thread seemed most appropriate. I can't argue with really anything he says. Though I'm sure there could be some unpicking of the parts where he's talking about freedom of expression. But end of the day, every private entity gets to choose what information it associates with, and with whom it will associate. I am relatively confident that ISIS doesn't have a Facebook page or gets ad buys on Facebook micro-targeted to Muslim and Muslim-curious users. But I don't use FB so I'm not 100% sure.

Considering FB as a platform was largely responsible for the spread a lot of the hate speech responsible for the support of the Rohingya genocide in Myanmar I don't think we should assume that, maybe not English language, but FB absolved itself of responsibility for genocidal speech about the Rohingya by saying they didn't have enough moderators who spoke Burmese.