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Rothfuss XV: Move along, nothing to see here

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So, the previous thread reached its 20-page limit, and it was suggested that I start the next one. Sure, it'd be an honour, and here we are.

 

Other than that, see the thread title. It seems like the progress on the Kingkiller Chronicles is still exactly where we left it at the end of the previous thread. And the one before. And the one before. And a few earlier iterations of the thread too. Anybody have any interesting thoughts they'd like to share? It's not like anything else seems to be happening at the moment.

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Posted (edited)

I still think the reason Rothfuss is so tentative on releasing the last book is that to most in his World Kvothe would be seen as a “Villian” or an “Antagonist”.  I think he’s afraid of the reaction of readers to that end to this story.  

GOT spoilers:

 

Look how many have reacted to the change to Daenerys as evidence.

Edited by Ser Scot A Ellison

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Posted (edited)
On 5/22/2019 at 8:13 AM, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I still think the reason Rothfuss is so tentative on releasing the last book is that to most in his World Kvothe would be seen as a “Villian” or an “Antagonist”.  I think he’s afraid of the reaction of readers to that end to this story.  

Spoiler

Look how many have reacted to the change to Daenerys as evidence.

 

Spoiler

But the problem with Daenerys wasn't her villainy, but inconsistent characterisation. Nothing wrong with a villainous Kvothe, so long as it's written properly.

 

Edited by The Marquis de Leech

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Not to turn every thread into a got finale thread but I think above mentioned plot twist that you may want to spoiler tag was super obvious to those who have read the books.

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Posted (edited)
29 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

Not to turn every thread into a got finale thread but I think above mentioned plot twist that you may want to spoiler tag was super obvious to those who have read the books.

Fixed. Sorry about that.

Spoiler

Daenerys - even an insane Daenerys - self-identifies as a liberator. She would never massacre the ordinary people like that.

 

Edited by The Marquis de Leech

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I forgot all about Rothfuss.  I've even stopped getting the Heifer International mailings.  Hmm. 

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I'm always amazed when I remember this series and hear that it's still unfinished. I never really got into it. Read the first one, liked some ideas but wasn't sold on it. Tried reading the second and gave up on it at some point. I may have gotten to the infamous sex faeries, if memory serves, or I've heard so much about them I just imagined getting there. It's been awhile. 

Rothfuss typically has really excellent prose, however. I just wish his tale was more interesting to me. Or maybe not, given he seems uninclined to keep writing it. Didn't he swear this wouldn't be a Robert Jordan/GRRM situation? That he had totally got the whole thing worked out and ready to be released in quick succession? That's... tragically hilarious. 

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Be that as it may, the third volume, whenever it gets released, will debut at number 1 on the NYT bestseller list and will go on to sell a ton of copies.

Even worse, since Rothfuss is currently not under contract for the second trilogy, even though it will be years before the first installment ever sees the light, expect publishers to bid crazy amounts of money to secure that new book deal.

At the moment, only GRRM sells more than Rothfuss. If not for John Grisham releasing a new book the same week The Slow Regard of Silent Things was published, Rothfuss would have ended up with another #1 bestseller in hardcover.

So regardless of the frustration of many readers, hordes of fans will rush to get their hands on TDoS as soon as it comes out.

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21 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I still think the reason Rothfuss is so tentative on releasing the last book is that to most in his World Kvothe would be seen as a “Villian” or an “Antagonist”.  I think he’s afraid of the reaction of readers to that end to this story.  

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Look how many have reacted to the change to Daenerys as evidence.

 

Or even more simply, if Kvothe doesn't get the happy ending many are expecting. Despite Rothfuss saying that this is a tragedy both in book and in the real world, I believe that most fans are expecting Kvothe to nuke the Chandrian and save the day. 

And there's a lot riding on this. Right now, Rothfuss is the golden boy and has all sorts of stuff in development. If he doesn't stick the landing on book 3, or there's a huge fan backlash, it may give the studios pause about the viability of the series for TV/movies/etc. 

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13 minutes ago, Ninefingers said:

Or even more simply, if Kvothe doesn't get the happy ending many are expecting. Despite Rothfuss saying that this is a tragedy both in book and in the real world, I believe that most fans are expecting Kvothe to nuke the Chandrian and save the day. 

And there's a lot riding on this. Right now, Rothfuss is the golden boy and has all sorts of stuff in development. If he doesn't stick the landing on book 3, or there's a huge fan backlash, it may give the studios pause about the viability of the series for TV/movies/etc. 

If people don’t see this story as a tragedy in the making they are just crap readers.  This has never been a “hero’s journey” and has always been intended to end in a dark place.  Look at the opening and closing passages of each book...

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Posted (edited)

he’s afraid of the reaction of readers to that end to this story.  

scot--

that would be a good thing, for the reasons in the spoiler (game of thrones show spoilers here, kids).

roose--

Spoiler

She would never massacre the ordinary people like that

the difficulty here is that she arrogates the authority to decide what counts as a crime, without notice of either the crime itself or her determination thereof, without recourse to a right to trial by an independent judiciary, right to an appeal, and so on--as well as a penalty that is disproportionate, cruel, undoubtedly unusual.  she is an attorney's nightmare, conflating oikos & polis in her person, and also conflating the three functions of liberal government, tyrion explains how people cheered her killing of slaveowners and other villains within the liberal ideology--those cheering persons whom he describes are plainly the audience. it's a slick little brechtian moment of deploying an alienation effect against the audience, which has taken the bait and started a petition.  this is exactly what brecht would want--a narrative that lingers in critical confrontation.

but inconsistent characterisation

and this is the narrative locus wherein brechtian alienation effects can disrupt the audience's pre-conditioned expectation and compel critical reflection rather than unconsious identification with the narrative. i personally don't care much for consistency of characterization--it's a formalist heuristic, mostly.  real people lack consistency; the true fiction accordingly as an absolutely consistent character.

richard--

Spoiler

super obvious to those who have read the books.

her instrumental rationality is solid in the novels--ends/means calculus.  it is difficult to decide if her objective rationality is worthwhile: on the one hand, she wants to liberate slaves, but, on the other, she wants to enforce her claim to an inherited absolutist monarchy. this is a liberal policy preference within the framework of a profoundly illiberal constitutional order.  that makes the show's denouement plausible rather than peremptory, maybe.

the same rationale applies to kvothe.  his trajectory in the novels could plausibly turn out illiberal ugly, though the shopkeeper role goes a different direction.

 

Edited by sologdin

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1 hour ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

If people don’t see this story as a tragedy in the making they are just crap readers.  This has never been a “hero’s journey” and has always been intended to end in a dark place.  Look at the opening and closing passages of each book...

Don't make the mistake of thinking that the average reader is like someone who frequents book message boards. 

There's lots of correct ways to be a fan.

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1 hour ago, Ninefingers said:

Don't make the mistake of thinking that the average reader is like someone who frequents book message boards. 

There's lots of correct ways to be a fan.

Heh, yeah, not that i dislike Sanderson, who I will use as an example here, but my god, the love Sanderson gets on say facebook and other social media sites is just insane considered to how he is viewed here. We sometimes forgot how tiny this subsection of the board is.

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17 minutes ago, Darth Richard II said:

Heh, yeah, not that i dislike Sanderson, who I will use as an example here, but my god, the love Sanderson gets on say facebook and other social media sites is just insane considered to how he is viewed here. We sometimes forgot how tiny this subsection of the board is.

I do not get the Sanderson love.  I really dislike his writing.  Quantity does not equate to quality.

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The first two volumes hint that there is a magic that alters reality by writing down the story you want to tell.  I have just figured that Kvothe was turning himself into the person he wishes he could be and that the next books would be the "real" story, but at this point, who knows. 

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24 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I do not get the Sanderson love.  I really dislike his writing.  Quantity does not equate to quality.

See that kind of my point. People on other places on the internet would react to you saying that the same they would react to someone saying something like "I don't like orgasms". :P

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On 5/21/2019 at 10:13 PM, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I still think the reason Rothfuss is so tentative on releasing the last book is that to most in his World Kvothe would be seen as a “Villian” or an “Antagonist”.  I think he’s afraid of the reaction of readers to that end to this story.  

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Look how many have reacted to the change to Daenerys as evidence.

 

Honestly, I have managed to avoid spoilers on ASOIAF/GOT for the past several years. Thanks very much for throwing random GoT spoilers around in a thread that is completely unrelated to it. And that without warning. Great.

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1 hour ago, Veltigar said:

Honestly, I have managed to avoid spoilers on ASOIAF/GOT for the past several years. Thanks very much for throwing random GoT spoilers around in a thread that is completely unrelated to it. And that without warning. Great.

Same. There's another in one of the politics thread in Gen Chat as well.

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18 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I do not get the Sanderson love.  I really dislike his writing.  Quantity does not equate to quality.

IMO, Brandon Sanderson is the Nick Cage of the writing world. Prolific with mass appeal, marketability, and dependability. 

But really shouldn't be around on awards night. 

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