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The Baelish Mockingbird

Dany should have been Queen for a season

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This is kind of an add on to a post I wrote about the Iron Bank but Dany really should have formally become the Queen of Westeros.

The problem with Dany being the Mad Queen is that we don't actually see her being a Mad Queen. She uses very unconventional methods to get the throne but really this can all be excused as the necessary evils of war.

Here's how I think the show should have been handled. Season 8 should have ended with Dany becoming Queen in mostly the same way as she did in the last few episodes. The only real difference being that she goes straight for the Red Keep instead and inflicts many unintended casualties against innocent people. 

In this version of events, Varys would be completely loyal to Dany whereas Tyrion would question her methods (role reversal). Dany would be empathetic over the loss of life but mostly shrug it off as the casualties of war against a tyrant. Jon would view it as an impulsive act which had negative consequences but a positive result. Tyrion would start to wonder about her mental state and whether she is properly fit to rule but wouldn't find it to be terribly concerning yet.

The next series (season 9) would focus entirely on Dany as Queen and would show her slow descent into becoming the Mad Queen. She would give a speech about how her enemies will show her no mercy so why should she show them any mercy. 

Throughout the season, Dany will justify herself more and more as she starts to torch everyone who goes against her, as she begins to burn them all. She will go back on her promise to give the Iron Islands independence causing Yara to start conspiring against her. After finding out from Varys, Dany will fly off to Pyke and destroy the castle with Yara inside. Dany will justify this with Jon and Tyrion by stating that they were conspiring against her and they needed to be stopped before they could launch any form of attack against her. This will cause the other lords to become restless at the idea of Dany remaining Queen. The smallfolk in King's Landing would also start growing restless due to fear of the dragon which is free to fly around above them and eat their cattle. This will cause riots in King's Landing. Dany will feel betrayed by the people of King's Landing whom she thinks she liberated from a tyrant and will order the Unsullied to deal with the riots (ending in many deaths of smallfolk). She will then have the ringleaders of the riots rallied up and executed by Drogon much to Tyrion's dismay. This will cause Tyrion to talk to Varys about the possibility of her going mad and whether Jon may be better suited for the throne. Varys warns Tyrion never to speak of it again but doesn't tell Danaerys yet because he thinks Tyrion could still be useful.

Sansa (using her Littlefinger skills) could then reach out to the Iron Bank who are mutually interested in seeing Dany being taken off the throne. Sansa because Dany will not let the North become an independent country, and the Iron Bank because Dany refuses to pay back the debt the crown owes (as it is not a debt she acquired).  Varys will discover this and tell Dany. Dany will then order a parlay and asks Jon to act as her envoy. Jon and Sansa will meet on an open field with an army of Northmen behind Sansa and an army of Unsullied behind Jon. Jon will tell Sansa that Dany is truly doing what she thinks is right for the Kingdoms and that he doesn't want to see anymore bloodshed to which Sansa will tell him that he is being blinded for the love of his Queen and that all she has ever done is in service of herself becoming Queen. Jon will reply asking Sansa if the same could be said for her. This is interrupted by a loud cry in the distance as Dothraki soldiers flank the Northmen and Sansa is captured and taken to the capital. Meanwhile Dany attacks Bravoos with a platoon of Unsullied and destroys the Iron Bank and kills all of the Bankers inside. Jon becomes irrate and realises that Dany betrayed his confidence and demands that she releases Sansa. She refuses and Jon storms off to Tyrion. Dany becomes suspicious of Jon and asks Varys to keep tabs on him. Jon and Tyrion talk about his inheritance and start to talk about Jon taking over as King. Jon agrees that Dany is constantly going back on her word in favour of keeping her throne and is becoming more unyielding by the day so he agrees to take up his birthright. 

Meanwhile Daario returns from Essos and informs Dany that Meereen has fallen back to the control of the masters. Dany doesn't understand what masters as she thought that she had killed them all. Daario tells her that new masters had risen in the city, former slaves who revolted and drove Daario out the city taking control of it and repeating the wheel. Varys also tells Dany that Jon and Tyrion were conspiring behind her back to replace her as Queen and that the North, the Vale, The Riverlands and the Stormlands are all demanding Sansa be set free. Dany snaps, orders Vary to arrest Jon and Tyrion and flies to Meereen and destroys the city figuring that it is a city beyond redemption which has betrayed her trust. When she comes back to King's Landing, she summons Tyrion and Jon. Tyrion confesses to conspiring against Dany and confesses to manipulating Jon into doing the same knowing that Dany has a softer spot for Jon and will leave him alive so that he can end it once and for all. Tyrion is then executed on the spot by Dany who also arrests Daario for failing to keep peace for her in Meereen. The Northmen, Men of the Vale and Men of the Riverlands have also rallied outside of King's Landing demanding that Sansa be freed. Dany orders the execution of Daario and Sansa and gets ready to go burn the Northmen at the gate. This is when Jon decides that enough is enough and kills Dany. Drogon can fly away with Dany the same way he did in the show I suppose. Jon will then order the gates be opened and the Northmen will come in and battle the Unsullied and the Dothraki leading to the end of the war. Jon will then take the throne and tie up loose ends. He will give the North their independence, execute Varys (personally, like Ned Stark would do), implement a Government of some kind to help the monarchy, abdicate the throne in order for an elected King to take it and then willingly choose to go beyond the wall and live his life there away from the guilt.

So what do you think of this idea? Would you have done the series the same way or would you have done it differently.

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Basically Jon as Jamie 2.0. I like it. Certainly better than what we got. I still prefer Dany as a tragic hero rather than a "Mad Queen", but if it was to be done this should have been the way. Don't understand why you would switch up Tyrion's and Varys' roles, though. Varys seems more utilitarian while Tyrion (in the show) shows greater personal attachment to Dany.

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That would damage Dany's story even more.

They stopped her before she goes too far, then people would even hate her not feel sorry for her. She was just a tragic figure, who desperately wanted the IT for right reasons, and then lost her control in the end and died for it.

If she lasted another season as mad queen, then the goal would be how to defeat that enemy, like they tried to defeat Aerys and then Joffrey, and then Cersei, she has become one of these tyrants, but it didn't last long, and it shouldn't last long imo.

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Nah, we already knew how that would go - just look at her fathers reign. 

 

Her death coincided with the vision in the house of undying.

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2 hours ago, Isewein said:

Basically Jon as Jamie 2.0. I like it. Certainly better than what we got. I still prefer Dany as a tragic hero rather than a "Mad Queen", but if it was to be done this should have been the way. Don't understand why you would switch up Tyrion's and Varys' roles, though. Varys seems more utilitarian while Tyrion (in the show) shows greater personal attachment to Dany.

Well I just think it fixes both character's motivations. Both characters are supposed to be incredibly smart but Tyrion ends up looking stupid by loyally backing her until the end just to ask Jon to kill her in the end whilst Varys looks stupid for spending so much time backing the wrong horse. 

I just think allowing Tyrion to be the one to decide she is going too far and allowing Vary's motivations to be the restoration of the Targaryen family (the benefit of the realm just being a front) would fix the two characters.

1 hour ago, Erkan12 said:

That would damage Dany's story even more.

They stopped her before she goes too far, then people would even hate her not feel sorry for her. She was just a tragic figure, who desperately wanted the IT for right reasons, and then lost her control in the end and died for it.

If she lasted another season as mad queen, then the goal would be how to defeat that enemy, like they tried to defeat Aerys and then Joffrey, and then Cersei, she has become one of these tyrants, but it didn't last long, and it shouldn't last long imo.

Sure but a lot of people, including myself, actually hated the character beforehand and saw her as a self-righteous ruler.

She can still be played as a tragic leader, whilst her focus is retaining rule her entire aim is to liberate people. It's why she doesn't understand why the people of King's Landing might fear her (when the people of Astapor didn't) and why the people of Meereen wont fold into the system she made. She fully believes what she is doing is right and she believes it's the only way to make a peaceful world. Everyone is just threatening her viewpoint by trying conspiring against her. She's seeing everyone else as a tyrant and not realising she herself is becoming one. As Harvey Dent puts it in The Dark Knight. You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, The Baelish Mockingbird said:

 

Sure but a lot of people, including myself, actually hated the character beforehand and saw her as a self-righteous ruler.

She can still be played as a tragic leader, whilst her focus is retaining rule her entire aim is to liberate people. It's why she doesn't understand why the people of King's Landing might fear her (when the people of Astapor didn't) and why the people of Meereen wont fold into the system she made. She fully believes what she is doing is right and she believes it's the only way to make a peaceful world. Everyone is just threatening her viewpoint by trying conspiring against her. She's seeing everyone else as a tyrant and not realising she herself is becoming one. As Harvey Dent puts it in The Dark Knight. You either die a hero, or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain

Your reasoning is subjective,

I am talking about the series dynamics, such as Varys's and Tyrion's view, or Barristan's or Jorah's etc. Tyrion's view about Dany has changed completely after the episode 5, Varys has seen it before, Tyrion suspected before but he didn't want to believe, as well as Jon didn't want to believe she would do that, after seing that, not even Jorah could defend Dany in that position, 

You're asking that the heroes of the show should work on how to defeat Dany for a whole season, that will just make it even worse, right now she is just a tragic character who was going good until the destruction and slaughter of KL, then they finished her shortly after, before she gets out of control.

We already have main villains like Night King, Joffrey, Cersei, Tywin etc. Adding Dany into this group wouldn't make the story better imo, leave it as a tragic character, a fallen heroine. Because Dany had a lot of fans who are believing that she is a good person, I was not one of them, but they should respect that.

Edited by Erkan12

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6 minutes ago, Erkan12 said:

Your reasoning is subjective,

I am talking about the series dynamics, such as Varys's and Tyrion's view, or Barristan's or Jorah's etc. Tyrion's view about Dany has changed completely after the episode 5, Varys has seen it before, Tyrion suspected before but he didn't want to believe, as well as Jon didn't want to believe she would do that, after seing that, not even Jorah could defend Dany in that position, 

You're asking that the heroes of the show should work on how to defeat Dany for a whole season, that will just make it even worse, right now she is just a tragic character who was going good until the destruction and slaughter of KL, then they finished her shortly after, before she gets out of control.

We already have main villains like Night King, Joffrey, Cersei, Tywin etc. Adding Dany into this group wouldn't make the story better imo, leave it as a tragic character, a fallen heroine. Because Dany had a lot of fans who are believing that she is a good person, I was not one of them, but they should respect that.

I disagree that they should respect the idea that Dany has many fans and should be left alone. By that logic, Robb had many fans and shouldn't have received the ending he got. I'm a fan of Littlefinger, the way he was killed off wasn't exactly respectful to Littlefinger fans.

The idea isn't that we see a whole season of Tyrion and Jon working to stop Dany, the idea is that we see Dany rule and how she deals with all the loose ends. You're talking as if the way she ended the show wasn't jarring. She killed thousands of innocent people in King's Landing and then shrugged it off as if it was nothing. She isn't a tragic figure, she's a tyrant. If they wanted to make her a tragic figure they would have given her more of a reason to kill all those people. 

What I proposed was that we spend a season seeing why she makes these rash decisions accumulating in her burning down an entire city. She's still presented as a tragic character, potentially even more so this way. The idea of the series isn't about taking Dany down but deciding when power and tyranny become the same thing. Dany feels entirely justified killing those who have conspired against her and in many ways she is entirely justified. You can still have these morally grey questions such as was she doing the right thing. Did her means justify the ends.

Was she protecting her own right by destroying Pyke and the Iron Bank or was she slaughtering people over disagreements? Was she betraying Jon and Sansa's trust by killing the Northmen at the parlay or was she ending the war before it started with as little bloodshed as possible? Was she planning on executing Sansa because she had actively been conspiring against her back since series 8 or was she doing it for petty reasons. Was she planning on executing Daario because he failed his task and left his responsibilities or was she executing him because she couldn't have conflict between Jon and Daario? Did she burn down Meereen because she had gone mad or did she burn down Meereen because they couldn't help themselves and she needed to break the wheel? 

Jon killing her would still be tragic, if not more tragic. This time however it wouldn't be completely out of left-field. Same as with the rest of the viewers, Jon would not know whether or not her did the right thing which is why he would abdicate his position and live beyond the wall for the rest of his life. He'll acknowledge that for all the problems she caused in her short reign, she also ended many other problems such as the Iron Islands and their constant pillaging and the Iron Bank's debt against Westeros.

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8 minutes ago, The Baelish Mockingbird said:

I disagree that they should respect the idea that Dany has many fans and should be left alone. By that logic, Robb had many fans and shouldn't have received the ending he got. I'm a fan of Littlefinger, the way he was killed off wasn't exactly respectful to Littlefinger fans.

The idea isn't that we see a whole season of Tyrion and Jon working to stop Dany, the idea is that we see Dany rule and how she deals with all the loose ends. You're talking as if the way she ended the show wasn't jarring. She killed thousands of innocent people in King's Landing and then shrugged it off as if it was nothing. She isn't a tragic figure, she's a tyrant. If they wanted to make her a tragic figure they would have given her more of a reason to kill all those people. 

What I proposed was that we spend a season seeing why she makes these rash decisions accumulating in her burning down an entire city. She's still presented as a tragic character, potentially even more so this way. The idea of the series isn't about taking Dany down but deciding when power and tyranny become the same thing. Dany feels entirely justified killing those who have conspired against her and in many ways she is entirely justified. You can still have these morally grey questions such as was she doing the right thing. Did her means justify the ends.

Was she protecting her own right by destroying Pyke and the Iron Bank or was she slaughtering people over disagreements? Was she betraying Jon and Sansa's trust by killing the Northmen at the parlay or was she ending the war before it started with as little bloodshed as possible? Was she planning on executing Sansa because she had actively been conspiring against her back since series 8 or was she doing it for petty reasons. Was she planning on executing Daario because he failed his task and left his responsibilities or was she executing him because she couldn't have conflict between Jon and Daario? Did she burn down Meereen because she had gone mad or did she burn down Meereen because they couldn't help themselves and she needed to break the wheel? 

Jon killing her would still be tragic, if not more tragic. This time however it wouldn't be completely out of left-field. Same as with the rest of the viewers, Jon would not know whether or not her did the right thing which is why he would abdicate his position and live beyond the wall for the rest of his life. He'll acknowledge that for all the problems she caused in her short reign, she also ended many other problems such as the Iron Islands and their constant pillaging and the Iron Bank's debt against Westeros.

Robb died as a hero, they didn't change his character, not sure how that's comparable in here.

Why do you need to see how Dany deals with the problems? You already did, by burning them. She doesn't have political skills, she can just use her army and her dragons to kill, that's it.

Daario already said Dany isn't a ruler, she is a conquerer, she would be a cruel tyrant, we already know that.

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1 hour ago, Erkan12 said:

Robb died as a hero, they didn't change his character, not sure how that's comparable in here.

Why do you need to see how Dany deals with the problems? You already did, by burning them. She doesn't have political skills, she can just use her army and her dragons to kill, that's it.

Daario already said Dany isn't a ruler, she is a conquerer, she would be a cruel tyrant, we already know that.

Robb certainly did not die as a hero. He died as someone who broke his oath and suffered the consequences for it. He betrayed the trust of someone who helped him and despite all his attempts to be noble, he was given an undignified death.

Why not? I would be more satisfied having another season of the show seeing Dany have to deal with all the problems that come with her dream and see them slowly start to drive her supposed madness. I think it would be a neat way to end the show.

Just because Daario said something doesn't make it so. As far as I can see, Dany was just written to burn down King's Landing as a means to rush the story and have Jon kill Dany. She uncharacteristically killed many innocent people. I propose that we should have had an extra season to explore more of her descent before she goes into such extremes. Just because many of us figure she would probably be a tyrant doesn't mean it should be eliminated from the plot altogether.

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