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LadyOfCastamere

Quaithe: Sun's son and Mummer's Dragon - thoughts

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Posted (edited)

Hey guys!

Okay, this thought might be extremely far fetched, but somehow I have this strong feeling that there is something to it.

It's about Quaithe's words towards Dany which say:

[...] Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon.
(ADWD)


~>Quaithe seems to name the people and ordeals Dany will face:

- The pale mare is the flux that is terrorizing Slaver's Bay and killing many people
- After her the others: This may just be a way to summarize the rest, but perhaps it's also a hint at the Others behind the Wall?
- Kraken and Dark Flame: Victarion and the red priest Moqorro who is very good at reading the flames and prophecizes accurately so far. Victarion wants to take Dany and seize her dragons.
- Lion and Griffin: Highly assuming this will be the fight for the Iron Throne against the Lannisters and Young Griff/Aegon

The last two are the really tricky ones:

Who is the Sun's Son?

Many think that the Sun's son is regarding to Quentyn, but he has never been an actual issue to Dany (plus she herself thinks that it is Quentyn who is meant). Call me ignorant, but this seemed too easy. Now, if not Quentyn, who else could this be?

1.) Doran has Trystane and his marriage to Myrcella + her eventual claim to the Throne as a joker, but I don't think this is it, either. The issues Dany will have to deal with come in packs of two, surrounding one specific issue. If the Sun's son was Trystane, I do think Quaithe would've mentioned him alongside the Lion and Griffin, but she didn't. Instead, she grouped him with the mummer's dragon and I do not see the connection between Trystane and Mummer's dragon.

2) And this is where I thought of Oberyn's children and one of his daughters pretending to be a boy: Sarella/Alleras. She is involved with Marwyn and the Citadel, magic, glass candles, etc. I don't really understand yet what she is urging for, but it seemed to me that she was never her Uncle's puppet and pursued her own interests. She's clearly not in the Citadel to study to become a Maester for some household- there is a reason why she's around Marwyn. Her actual loyalty and goals remain unknown. Perhaps she could be working with the faceless men which would tie together with the mummer's dragon - more on that below.

3) Another option is that the sun's son is actually meant to be Aegon, since he is presumably the real son of Rhaegar and ELIA, which makes him half Targ/half Dornish- also a son of the sun! Could it be that Griffin only refers to Jon Connington and the Golden Company, splitting at some point from Aegon and therefore making the two of them a separate issue? But who would be the mummer's dragon then?

Who is the Mummer's Dragon?

a) The most popular idea is that the 'mummer' is Varys (he spend a lot of time with mummers in his youth and learned their ways) and that he is trying to disguise a FALSE Dragon, aka a non-Targaryen boy (Young Griff) as Aegon, the son of Rhaegar. But how does this correspond with the sun's son, where is the connection between Aegon and Trystane/Quentyn? My main reason for rejecting this theory is that even I connected these 2 dots of 'false dragon' and 'Aegon' and this is a 99.99% reason for me to believe it's wrong. I always fall for red herrings and GRRM is outsmarting me all the time, so in conclusion, I do believe there must be something else/more to this:P

b) What other mummers do we have beside the ones who actually work as ones? Exactly, the Faceless Men - their whole 'magic' is a mummery of a sort. Furthermore, there is a strong reason to believe that Jaquen H'ghar is using Pate's face, that he has the key to access all books in the Citadel AND that he is also consorting with Marwyn/Alleras and now additionally Sam. The later is highly interested in finding books about the Others, but I doubt that this is what the FM is there for? Another popular theory says that Euron paid a FM with a dragon egg to kill Euron. Is Jaquen trying to find books about hatching dragons perhaps? And if this is the case, could it be that ''Mummer's dragon'' doesn't refer to some false dragon, but an actual real dragon hatched and ''owned'' by mummers- namely the FM?
 

We know that the first FM was born amongst the slaves of Old Valyria and gave the ''gift of death'' to other suffering slaves and also slavers later. They had endured the Valyrian regime and as we know, the Targs are descendants of OV, so there is probably bad blood between the FM and Dany+her dragons. Perhaps they try to hatch their own dragon to oppose her? It also reminds me of how Dany is called 'the slayer of lies' - perhaps she is slaying the FM who deceive everyone?

But again, how do ''sun's son'' and ''mummer's dragon'' tie together?

It could be that I'm totally off here, but what if indeed JonCon and Young Griff/Aegon part ways and Aegon comes upon the FM who, as non-Targs, are incapable of controlling their dragon?
Could it be that Elia's ''son of the sun'' takes control of the ''mummer's/FM dragon'', going on a voyage to fight his younger sister?

I think it would be a cool twist if Aegon was really the one he claims to be and fights his sister on the back of his own dragon!

But enough tinfoils and crazy ideas, what do you think about all this?

Edited by LadyOfCastamere

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I think Suns Son is Quentyn. As Martells sigil is a sun and Q is the son of Doran. It’s seems to refer to all the characters with designs on Daenerys and him and Aegon are two of them.

Just as an aside I would have liked if Quiathe implied that Jorahs trying to make his way back to Dany like a lot of the above characters are/were. It’s always nice when he appears in Danys visions like the one at the end. Theirs should be the Song of Ice and Fire. :crying:

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Sun's son is most obviously Quentyn unless of course there is some expectation of another Martell showing up. The fact of the matter it won't be Trystane with the expected coupling of he and Mrcella however there are other Martells who could fulfill the position.

The Lion and the Griffin, the Lion is easy to figure it is obviously Tyrion the Griffin is somewhat more difficult considering Connington is at Storm's end however it will be someone from the Golden Company probably a second of Lysono Maar's.

The Mummers Dragon is more than likely Marwyn with a distinct possibility also of being Euron..

Remember all this foreshadowing was made before Drogon left with Danerys therefore any of the most choices are probably feints and diversions

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Posted (edited)
51 minutes ago, LadyOfCastamere said:

t's about Quaithe's words towards Dany which say:

[...] Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon.
(ADWD)


~>Quaithe seems to name the people and ordeals Dany will face:

Kraken and dark flame are, as you suggest, Victarion and Moqorro.

Lion and griffin:  Lion is probably Tyrion Lannister, who is now on his way to Daenerys.  Griffin is most likely Jon Connington, who, at that time, was also on his way.  They will probably meet in any event.

Sun's son is pretty clearly Quentyn.  He and Trystane are the only ones we know of, and it isn't trystane.

Mummer's Dragon is probably Aeron VI, the Mummer's (Varys's) Dragon (Targaryen). 

Victarion, Tyrion, and Quentyn I am confident on.  The others less so.

 

Edited by Nevets

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, Nevets said:

Kraken and dark flame are, as you suggest, Victarion and Moqorro.

Lion and griffin:  Lion is probably Tyrion Lannister, who is now on his way to Daenerys.  Griffin is most likely Jon Connington, who, at that time, was also on his way.  They will probably meet in any event.

Sun's son is pretty clearly Quentyn.  He and Trystane are the only ones we know of, and it isn't trystane.

Mummer's Dragon is probably Aeron VI, the Mummer's (Varys's) Dragon (Targaryen). 

Victarion, Tyrion, and Quentyn I am confident on.  The others less so.

 

No thought to Manfrey Martell or his off spring?

Why would Connington even be considered  as the Griffin at this point when both he and Aegon are ready to take the Iron Throne without the need of dragons? Shucks maybe Red Ronnet is on his way to Mereen at the behest of the small council

All your views seem to be with the expectation that Danerys will show up during or shortly after the Battle of Mereen.. I think she'lll be busy enough for several months even with the assistance of Drogon cleaning up the  Dothraki Sea, Vaes Dothrak, Khals and Kos she has a hate on for and uniting the Khalasars  who swear loyality to her Pono (maybe a pipe dream considering he was the first of Drogos rider to separate to his own khalasar) , Zekko, Motho returning by way of the Demon Road. So Marroq and Victarian are not necessarily shoe ins I would think given my impression of Danerys's moves that Bennero and Euron are more logical choices for the dark flame and the Kraken

 

Edited by Gerg Sknab

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22 minutes ago, Gerg Sknab said:

No thought to Manfrey Martell or his off spring?

Why would Connington even be considered  as the Griffin at this point when both he and Aegon are ready to take the Iron Throne without the need of dragons? Shucks maybe Red Ronnet is on his way to Mereen at the behest of the small council

All your views seem to be with the expectation that Danerys will show up during or shortly after the Battle of Mereen.. I think she'lll be busy enough for several months even with the assistance of Drogon cleaning up the  Dothraki Sea, Vaes Dothrak, Khals and Kos she has a hate on for and uniting the Khalasars  who swear loyality to her Pono (maybe a pipe dream considering he was the first of Drogos rider to separate to his own khalasar) , Zekko, Motho returning by way of the Demon Road. So Marroq and Victarian are not necessarily shoe ins I would think given my impression of Danerys's moves that Bennero and Euron are more logical choices for the dark flame and the Kraken

 

Manfrey Martell?  Never heard of him, so no.  I think we have heard of everyone important by now.

The names seem to indicate individuals who will meet and attempt to influence her, and all the names I listed fit.

I noticed that some of the names are paired.  Victarion and Moqorro were traveling together, as were Tyrion and Jon Connington.   The last two could be together or separate.  If together, it could be becauase of the Martells' plans to hook up with Aegon.

Btw, Euron is a reasonable possibility for the Kraken.  The rest I stand by.

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Posted (edited)

@LadyOfCastamere, I tend to follow the same line of thought as you about the Sun's Son and I have a whole document written about this. 

I also come at this from the perspective of someone who believes that Aegon is exactly who he says he is, Elia and Rhaegar's son.

As you pointed out, there are more than one "sun's son" in the story. Doran had two sons, making them both the sun's son and Elia had a son, making him also the sun's son. The sun and spear was her sigil and even more so because she is Dornish. So my opinion is that Aegon is the sun's son.

Quentyn arrives in Meereen ahead of everyone because he left Westeros ahead of everyone. His placement in Quaithe's riddle sticks out like a sore thumb. The people that are named in pairs have all met. Mo and Vic are traveling companions now. Tyrion and Jon Conn were traveling companions at one time. If we suppose that Quentyn and Aegon are who Quaithe is eluding to, then those two don't know each other, have never met each other, have never breathed the same air.

And wouldn't it make more sense to group Jon Conn and Aegon together since those two have been together for some 12 years now?

Mo, Vic and Tyrion are right outside of Meereen while Jon Conn and his young protégé are now in Westeros. Meanwhile, Quentyn still sticks out, because of his placement in the riddle.

So I've been thinking for a while that the sun's son is Aegon. 

As far as the mummer's dragon goes, we do have more than one dragon in the story. The other one is at the Wall. The people around Jon Snow, the ones who got him elected are small potatoes compared to those around Aegon, but even if it's a small scale operation, Sam played the game deftly enough to get Jon elected as Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. Even the words he used to convince Denys Mallister that Jon was the right choice are rather similar to the ones used by Varys when he is describing Aegon to Kevan Lannister. 

Actually, the first time the word "mummer" appears in the story, it's in a Jon chapter in relation to Pyp, one of the men Sam enlists to help him get elect Jon (I think the whole reason he's at the Wall is because he was placed there). We don't know what he did, though. 

I know that Jon is not traveling to Meereen, but neither were Jon Connington and Aegon. The plan was just to meet Dany in Volantis. So then, we really end up with a split. Kraken and dark flame end up together, traveling to Meereen. Lion is kidnapped with the plan to take him to Meereen. All three are right outside Meereen ahead of the battle. 

Griffin, the sun's son (if it's Aegon) and the mummer's dragon (if it's Jon Snow) are all in Westeros.

Edited by Alexis-something-Rose

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Mnfrey Martell Doran's castellean

John Connington is leagues away on a different continent and seems to be effected by a quick type of greyscale. Still think Red Ronnet is a better choice considering his supposed screaming loyalty to the small council, I would think he'd be on the scow across the Narrow Sea

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Posted (edited)
On 6/8/2019 at 2:10 PM, LadyOfCastamere said:

Hey guys!

Okay, this thought might be extremely far fetched, but somehow I have this strong feeling that there is something to it.

It's about Quaithe's words towards Dany which say:

[...] Soon comes the pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon.
(ADWD)


~>Quaithe seems to name the people and ordeals Dany will face:

- The pale mare is the flux that is terrorizing Slaver's Bay and killing many people
- After her the others: This may just be a way to summarize the rest, but perhaps it's also a hint at the Others behind the Wall?
- Kraken and Dark Flame: Victarion and the red priest Moqorro who is very good at reading the flames and prophecizes accurately so far. Victarion wants to take Dany and seize her dragons.
- Lion and Griffin: Highly assuming this will be the fight for the Iron Throne against the Lannisters and Young Griff/Aegon

I don't think we will get anywhere if we look for a single "correct" interpretation of any prophecy in the series. I believe GRRM has written a lot of the prophecies in an ambiguous way because they will be true for more than one character: all of the obvious interpretations can be true (griffin = Connington, kraken = Greyjoy) but there will be other meanings that will also be true. Some additional layers of meaning might be true in the same character arc or they might be true for an entirely different character.

Additionally, a lot of the stuff that goes on in Essos is a sort of "fun house mirror," distorted version of things going on in Westeros. We know that Jon Connington is the not-dead-yet Lord of Griffin's Roost, and Young Griff has been put forward as his son. Dany has not yet encountered either of them. We also have Red Ronnet Connington who was in Brienne's back story as the guy who gave her a red rose as he broke their betrothal (the reason she hates roses). And there was a griffin knight in the feast at Harrenhal described in Meera's story in Bran's arc.

But I believe there may be deliberate wordplay for the word "griffin" and the word "finger." What if the surface meaning of Quaithe's prophecy applies to one arc, but a deeper, hidden interpretation (or just a backward reading?) applies to another arc? This might mean that Littlefinger is a griffin/finger character - this certainly seems to apply to Sansa's story, where Baelish pretends to be her father as Jon Connington pretends to be fAegon's father. But we also have a number of characters who have lost fingers in combat or for other reasons.

If Moqorro is represented by the dark flame in Quaithe's prophecy, shouldn't Benerro, Melisandre and Thoros of Myr qualify under the same symbolism? They are all priests or priestesses of R'hllor. But the interpretation could include something quite separate from the red god: in the Dunk & Egg stories, we met a Targaryen prince called Brightflame. "Dark Flame" could refer to someone descended from his rival within the Targaryen family. (Aegon V, Bloodraven and - I suspect - possibly Ser Duncan the Tall. The name "Dunk" could be a hint about "dunkel," the German word for "dark.")

As for the sun's son, Dorne and the Martells are a clear interpretation. But the Karstarks also use a sun sigil. In Jon's arc, if Quaithe's prophecy applies, we may see a clash between Jon Snow and Harrion Karstark. Or the clash may be between Jon Snow and Cregan, who is also A sun's son if not THE sun's son. If that is the case, we have already seen the conflict and Cregan won because he occupies the Lord Commander's tower (take a look where they put him after removing him from his ice cell) and Jon Snow is dead.

I think it's also important to look at Quaithe in context. Qarth is a really strange interlude in Dany's almost dream-like, allegorical journey around Essos. Quaithe wears a red mask covering her face. She meets Dany in the company of a guy with blue lips and another guy with colorful jewels all over his nose, creating a beak-like appearance. For purposes of literary interpretation, I suspect Qarth is an aspect of Dany's mind - it's a real place in the plot, of course, and a vivid part of GRRM's world-building, but the "meaning" of Qarth is to advance Dany on her hero's journey.

Long ago, I surmised that the House of the Undying was like the Winterfell Library: both hold dusty volumes of past history and both are burned. So the blue-lipped warlock led Dany into an exploration of her family history, in my opinion. Once she had "read the books," the library was burned. Dany was ready to write her own story.

The colorful nose (bird beak) guy, Xaro, wants Dany's dragons (but doesn't particularly want Dany, except as a means to an end). When he finds out he can't get a dragon, he tries to get rid of Dany. Does he also represent her past in some way? He has a nose like a bird beak and birds are associated with flying (among other things). Maybe Xaro represents Dany's version of the three-eyed-crow, urging her to fly. She thinks of him again while on board a ship she has named Balerion, after the historic dragon belonging to Aegon the Conqueror.

If the idea also holds true for Quaithe, that the three envoys of Qarth are somehow representatives of Dany's Targaryen heritage and/or inner self, it seems likely that Quaithe represents the red door that Dany remembers and seeks. The red lacquered mask is the red door. The door Dany seeks may or may not be a real door somewhere in the world, but it also represents her inner strength and peace-of-mind and sense of rightness. In this interpretation, the people or things about which Quaithe warns Dany may not actually be people or things: what if they are all aspects of Dany's own self? The things behind the door?

  • Dany has a pale mare - Drogo gave her the horse called her "silver" and she masters it beautifully, jumping over a fire, the first time she climbs on its back.
  • Dany wears a white lion skin, given to her by Drogo. It reminds her of him.
  • As for the mummer's dragon, Dany is being aided by Varys and Ilyrio (or so it seems - they also seem to be supporting fAegon). Maybe this is why she should be wary - she should stop being the mummer's dragon, and be her own dragon. (The ship she named Balerion was provided by Ilyrio, but Dany broke it into pieces to make seige engines to attack Meereen instead of returning to Pentos, as Ilyrio intended.)

Quaithe appears to Dany when she needs to figure out what to do next. She also seems to be insubstantial, almost like a projected hologram. I think she is like the projected face of the Wizard of Oz (part of a larger theme with ASOIAF paralleling the Wizard of Oz). In the movie, the wizard projects a big scary face onto a wall and uses it to communicate angry commands. Toto pulls away a curtain, however, exposing the real wizard, who is a plain human man with a microphone and a projector. When he flies up from the fighting pit with Danaerys on his back, Drogon is Toto pulling away the curtain. He is showing Dany that she is in charge of her own self, not being directed by some figment projected on a wall (nor by the loveless-arranged-marriage husband who manipulated her into reopening the fighting pits).

Edit: It may also be significant that Qaithe touches Dany's wrist, leaving a tingling sensation. Both Olenna and Lysa Tully hold or grab Sansa's wrist. I interpreted these crones grabbing young women by the wrist as a woman's version of taking up a sword: the wrist is the weapon's hilt. One of Dany's bloodriders warns Qaithe against touching Dany's wrist. But Qaithe may have activated the weapon in some way (like the button on the hilt of a lightsaber?) and put Dany on a path to personal growth.

Edited by Seams

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The simple answer is that it is not a prophecy, it is a report. Quaithe has a glass candle and is watching through it people heading Dany's way at the time. Or more specifically suitors heading Dany's way. 

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Every potential ally/threat - damn Quaithe and her paranoia - is paired together. 

Kraken - Victarion & Dark Flame - Moqorro

Lion - Tyrion & Griffin - Jon Connington - they were together before Jorah stole Tyrion 

Sun's Son & Mummer's Dragon - notice Quaithe doesn't use the vision of HotU to define Dany's last threat but use the interpretation of Dany. Sun's Son is Quentyn and if Mummer's Dragon is Aegon like haters say, then there two aren't together and never crossed ways ever. I think Mummer's Dragon is Tattered Prince of Windblown and TP is a Blackfyre descendant that lost his position to Illyrio. 

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19 hours ago, LadyOfCastamere said:

But again, how do ''sun's son'' and ''mummer's dragon'' tie together?

Those people were divided into pairs, based on what they wanted from Dany:

Kraken and dark flame - Victarion and Moqorro - they want Dany's dragons.

Lion and griffin - Tyrion Lannister and Jon Connington - they wanted to make a political alliance with Dany.

The sun's son and the mummer's dragon - Quentyn Martell and fAegon/Young Griff - they wanted to propose to Dany, and marry with her. That's what ties them together - same intentions concerning Dany.

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Posted (edited)

The Sun’s son is Jon. The mummers dragon is Aegon VI. Aegon (literarywise) is  like a “could have been” aspect of Jon if his life had been different. Aegon is real (as I do believe) but him being the mummer’s dragon is called as much because he is being used as a puppet of two mummers. So, Jon and Aegon are both Sun’s son, because they are sons of the “sun” Rhaegar, but Aegon will be defeated (easily) by Dany. That leaves Dany and Jon, Dance 2.0 , a much more major conflict positioning  Jon as THE Sun’s son. 

Remember Danys dream about taking Rhaegar’s war helm and meeting a ‘usurper’ at the Trident (history repeats with a twist). That is Jon in ‘black ice’ armour (That armour being Bran and his helm of enlightenment/new greenseer info). This is the deciding battle, which side of the Rhaegar reformation coin will land heads up? The war side, or the “things must change” bookish side?

Edited by The Fattest Leech

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18 hours ago, Gerg Sknab said:

Why would Connington even be considered  as the Griffin at this point when both he and Aegon are ready to take the Iron Throne without the need of dragons?

Quaithe's warning is not a prophecy. She has a glass candle, and was using it to keep a watch all over the world for people that are relevant for Dany's situation. Those glass candles are like Tolkien's Palantir, except it seems that they don't show the future or the past events -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palantír

At that time, shortly prior Quaithe appeared to Dany, and gave her that warning, Victarion was intending to go to Meereen, and to use Dragonbinder to submit Dany's dragons; Moqorro and his people were also intending to go to Dany, and ask her help to deal with an upcoming civil war in Volantis; Tyrion at that time was with JonCon and fAegon, they were also intending to go to Dany (though Tyrion tricked fAegon into going to Westeros without Dany and her dragons, and because that happened already after Quaithe saw them thru glass candle, her warning didn't included the change in JonCon's and fAegon's plans); and Quentyn with his people was intending to go to Meereen, and offer to Dany to marry, and form an alliance against Lannisters.

Already after Quaithe gave that warning to Dany, Jon and Co changed their plans, and instead went to Golden Company and then to Westeros. So this is an evidence, that Quaithe's warning is not based on her knowledge of the future, instead it is based on information that she got thru usage of glass candle, which is a spying device, that could be also used for communication. So Quaithe doesn't know what will actually happen in the future. She was merely making guesses, based on information that she saw.

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On 6/8/2019 at 10:30 PM, Alexis-something-Rose said:

As far as the mummer's dragon goes, we do have more than one dragon in the story. The other one is at the Wall. The people around Jon Snow, the ones who got him elected are small potatoes compared to those around Aegon, but even if it's a small scale operation, Sam played the game deftly enough to get Jon elected as Lord Commander of the Night's Watch. Even the words he used to convince Denys Mallister that Jon was the right choice are rather similar to the ones used by Varys when he is describing Aegon to Kevan Lannister. 

Actually, the first time the word "mummer" appears in the story, it's in a Jon chapter in relation to Pyp, one of the men Sam enlists to help him get elect Jon (I think the whole reason he's at the Wall is because he was placed there). We don't know what he did, though. 

I know that Jon is not traveling to Meereen, but neither were Jon Connington and Aegon. The plan was just to meet Dany in Volantis. So then, we really end up with a split. Kraken and dark flame end up together, traveling to Meereen. Lion is kidnapped with the plan to take him to Meereen. All three are right outside Meereen ahead of the battle. 

Griffin, the sun's son (if it's Aegon) and the mummer's dragon (if it's Jon Snow) are all in Westeros.

That is actually a brilliant idea, I totally left Jon out of this. Jon is indeed a Dragon, but I only just had the idea that his mummer could be indeed Ned Stark who acted his part as Jon's presumed father and disguised Jon as a bastard of the North. 

In my head I tend to think that Quaithe's order of ordeals chronological, starting with the Pale Mare.

Quote

[...]pale mare, and after her the others. Kraken and dark flame, lion and griffin, the sun's son and the mummer's dragon.

That would mean:

Pale Mare - The flux, already in motion
Kraken and dark flame (Moqorro) - On their way, close to Mereen
Lion - Tyrion with the Second sons, still in Slaver's Bay, though I assume Tyrion will meet her Dany upon her return with the Dothraki and not go back to Westeros.
..and Griffin - JonCon+GC are already active in Westeros, so it is to be assumed they're what Dany will face first when entering Westeros
Sun's Son - The actual real Aegon Targaryen, son of Elia and Rhaegar
Mummer's dragon - Jon Targaryen, the dragon hidden by the noble mummer Ned Stark upon request of Lyanna Stark
 

This would also go hand in hand with the idea of the Dragon's having three heads. Aegon, Dany and Jon meeting - what a clash of dragons! Now, what if each of them gets a dragon as well? Dany herself said that a Dragon chooses a rider carefully and just because a person can ride one dragon, it does not mean that he can ride another. Will Viserion (for her Dany's brother Viserys) perhaps be mounted by her other brother, Aegon? That would leave Rhaegal to Jon which is curious considering that Rhaegal is observed to be, so far, the most dangerous and 'aggressive' dragon of the three, while Viserion is more affectionate. Perhaps it'll be the other way around and Viserion would rather pick Jon and Rhaegar fare with Aegon.

What still leaves us unsure if why Drogon is bigger and apparently stronger and more developed than his siblings. It is assumed, both in the books and the series, that the dragons deteriorate when confined (wether hold in the dragon pit or a bunker), but in one of Dany's chapters it is underlined that this is just an assumption of the Maesters who apparently want dragons and magic gone from the world. Also, we see that Rhaegal and Viserion do grow despite being confined, just not as much.

Could it be that their growth also depends on having a connection with a human of their blood? Seeing that Drogon is acceptive of Dany riding him, it is very well possible that they share the blood bond of a kind. The Stark children (ice) have their direwolves and warg them, could the connection of fire between a dragon and his human be similar? This could explain why Dany, as a young girl, is capable of showing so much strength and determination, whilst Drogon grows more powerful and grows at a bigger rate. 
This could lead to a very interesting future when Viserion and Rhaegal meet their human for a fire/blood-bond. It could very well be that they get a boost in power and growth as well so that Drogon is not as outstanding anymore.

 

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9 hours ago, Megorova said:

Quaithe's warning is not a prophecy. She has a glass candle, and was using it to keep a watch all over the world for people that are relevant for Dany's situation. Those glass candles are like Tolkien's Palantir, except it seems that they don't show the future or the past events -

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palantír

At that time, shortly prior Quaithe appeared to Dany, and gave her that warning, Victarion was intending to go to Meereen, and to use Dragonbinder to submit Dany's dragons; Moqorro and his people were also intending to go to Dany, and ask her help to deal with an upcoming civil war in Volantis; Tyrion at that time was with JonCon and fAegon, they were also intending to go to Dany (though Tyrion tricked fAegon into going to Westeros without Dany and her dragons, and because that happened already after Quaithe saw them thru glass candle, her warning didn't included the change in JonCon's and fAegon's plans); and Quentyn with his people was intending to go to Meereen, and offer to Dany to marry, and form an alliance against Lannisters.

Already after Quaithe gave that warning to Dany, Jon and Co changed their plans, and instead went to Golden Company and then to Westeros. So this is an evidence, that Quaithe's warning is not based on her knowledge of the future, instead it is based on information that she got thru usage of glass candle, which is a spying device, that could be also used for communication. So Quaithe doesn't know what will actually happen in the future. She was merely making guesses, based on information that she saw.

I'm inclined to think that as often, her words have different meanings for different times and on different levels. What you say is very logical, but it also fits another narrative. I'm super curious what Grrm is going to make out of this.

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Posted (edited)

 

On 6/9/2019 at 6:10 AM, LadyOfCastamere said:

Many think that the Sun's son is regarding to Quentyn, but he has never been an actual issue to Dany (plus she herself thinks that it is Quentyn who is meant). Call me ignorant, but this seemed too easy. Now, if not Quentyn, who else could this be?

Personally I think Quentyn is a dead ringer for the Sun's son. He released 2 of her dragons so I would hardly call that never being an issue for her. Furthermore his death is likely to create an obstacle for her acquiring the Dornish loyalty (although I still think she will manage it). He also fits into the sun rising in the west and setting in the east prophecy, I think it would be very misleading for George to use the Dornish sun/son for two different people like this.

Quote

a) The most popular idea is that the 'mummer' is Varys (he spend a lot of time with mummers in his youth and learned their ways) and that he is trying to disguise a FALSE Dragon, aka a non-Targaryen boy (Young Griff) as Aegon, the son of Rhaegar. But how does this correspond with the sun's son, where is the connection between Aegon and Trystane/Quentyn? My main reason for rejecting this theory is that even I connected these 2 dots of 'false dragon' and 'Aegon' and this is a 99.99% reason for me to believe it's wrong. I always fall for red herrings and GRRM is outsmarting me all the time, so in conclusion, I do believe there must be something else/more to this

I believe "The mummers dragon" is Aegon. I don't think there necessarily has to be a "mummer". He is simply someone pretending to be a Targaryen.

The two tie together strongly, because Quentyn's death is a catalyst for Aegon to possibly win the support of Dorne (but I think he will fail on that in the long term.)

Edited by Makk

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