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The most special D&D lines throughout the Inside the Episode series (and other media)


Beardy the Wildling

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On 6/13/2019 at 6:03 PM, Beardy the Wildling said:

'His older brother Dickon wasn't really a bad person, he died quite heroically by his father's side.'

Don't forget how they forgot that Sam was a POV character anyway.  The Tarly's seem to give them all kinds of trouble. 

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10 hours ago, Lady Fevre Dream said:

Don't forget how they forgot that Sam was a POV character anyway.  The Tarly's seem to give them all kinds of trouble. 

I think I mentioned this before, but they seem to struggle with literally everything from the book post-red wedding. Oberyn and Ellaria living in a brothel, Stannis and Jon's negotiations at the wall, Euron Greyjoy in general, Lady Stoneheart, Sam's time at Braavos and the Citadel, Arya's training with the Faceless... it's really telling that they got their adaptation hard on by seeing the Red Wedding, and then gave up shortly after.

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9 hours ago, Beardy the Wildling said:

I think I mentioned this before, but they seem to struggle with literally everything from the book post-red wedding. Oberyn and Ellaria living in a brothel, Stannis and Jon's negotiations at the wall, Euron Greyjoy in general, Lady Stoneheart, Sam's time at Braavos and the Citadel, Arya's training with the Faceless... it's really telling that they got their adaptation hard on by seeing the Red Wedding, and then give up shortly after.

Very true. In hindsight, everything you've mentioned and all the other D&Desque innovations were foreshadowing that it was going to end bollocks up. 

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3 minutes ago, Ser Hedge said:

Very true. In hindsight, everything you've mentioned and all the other D&Desque innovations were foreshadowing that it was going to end bollocks up. 

One of my examples, namely, Oberyn and Ellaria living in a brothel, has one of the saddest missed opportunities. Because it was an opportunity for one half of the tits-and-dragons formula, D&D could have been happy, while there also being depth to them beyond 'lol, look at those oversexed ethnics, aren't they funny in their open relationship?'

Book-Oberyn and Book-Ellaria are undoubtedly in an open relationship, but anyone with half a brain can tell that Oberyn's main goal visiting King's Landing is taking down Tywin. Defaming him any way possible, finding leads to show he's monstrous, all that good stuff. And it's strongly implied when, in the books, they ask Tyrion if there's any blondes they can share at Chataya's brothel, that they're in truth looking for Tywin's bastards (there's at least two candidates for such a woman: Alayaya is lighter-skinned than her mother Chataya and Chataya is aware of the secret passageway from the Hand's Tower to her brothel, and there's a blonde-haired, serious-expressioned prostitute at the same establishment).

Trust the Ds to miss a golden opportunity for actual intrigue that could involve the thing they love the most (sophomoric sex references).

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2 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

Very true. In hindsight, everything you've mentioned and all the other D&Desque innovations were foreshadowing that it was going to end bollocks up. 

As you put  it "a great steaming pile of feces."

IMHO, D & D thought they could tell a better story than GRRM.

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4 hours ago, aFeastForDragons said:

People on this forum used to reference an interview where they said they really wanted to do the Red Wedding, that was their ultimate goal for the show to make it that far. Honestly after that point the show does start to decline. 

Even before. Skipping the House of Undying and replacing the daughter of a Lannister Bannerman by a fan fiction nurse was already ignoring the story. And making poor choices.

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1 hour ago, BalerionTheCat said:

Even before. Skipping the House of Undying and replacing the daughter of a Lannister Bannerman by a fan fiction nurse was already ignoring the story. And making poor choices.

Dany throwing a hissy fit when the Qartheen ask her for proof of Dragons, when in the source material she rides in welcomed by all with Drogon on her shoulder!

And no, I believe D&D didn't know any of the story past the books back then. And they have this scene and Dorea murdering, was it Irri? And getting locked in a vault for the same.

Of course now this gets ret-conned as foreshadowing when it was 99.99% nothing of the kind.

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12 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

Dany throwing a hissy fit when the Qartheen ask her for proof of Dragons, when in the source material she rides in welcomed by all with Drogon on her shoulder!

And no, I believe D&D didn't know any of the story past the books back then. And they have this scene and Dorea murdering, was it Irri? And getting locked in a vault for the same.

Of course now this gets ret-conned as foreshadowing when it was 99.99% nothing of the kind.

Unnecessary changes for shits and gigs that they clumsily reincorporated into their suddenly Nazi Dany conclusion. Not the first time they try to twist non-foreshadowing into foreshadowing because they believe their cult of fans will drink their piss and praise the vintage.

Just so you guys know, I have a new tinfoil theory about David Benioff. Hopefully it gets approved by mods, but if not, it'd be fun to discuss here.

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13 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

Dany throwing a hissy fit when the Qartheen ask her for proof of Dragons, when in the source material she rides in welcomed by all with Drogon on her shoulder!

And no, I believe D&D didn't know any of the story past the books back then. And they have this scene and Dorea murdering, was it Irri? And getting locked in a vault for the same.

Of course now this gets ret-conned as foreshadowing when it was 99.99% nothing of the kind.

Locking Doreah in the vault to die was harsh (especially as she and Dany seemed almost in love with each other at one point).  But, the scenes which were deleted show her to be an appalling traitor.  Admittedly, no real reason is given why she would turn traitor (similar to Shae).  But, note that the music is triumphant and uplifting when the vault is shut on her, and Xaro's palace is ransacked.  The viewers were encouraged to see this as justice, not cruelty.

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33 minutes ago, Beardy the Wildling said:

Just so you guys know, I have a new tinfoil theory about David Benioff. Hopefully it gets approved by mods, but if not, it'd be fun to discuss here.

Not another cliff-hanger please! Or is it in the mods' inbox already? Well one thing we are all good at is waiting! :lol:

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21 minutes ago, SeanF said:

But, the scenes which were deleted show her to be an appalling traitor.  Admittedly, no real reason is given why she would turn traitor (similar to Shae).  But, note that the music is triumphant and uplifting when the vault is shut on her, and Xaro's palace is ransacked.  The viewers were encouraged to see this as justice, not cruelty.

Ah yes, I might have been thinking of deleted scenes actually - yeah, that was another character completely ruined by the Ds.

And yeah, as you say, they were playing up violence they themselves gratuitously introduced even without knowing about the character's ultimate arc at that point.

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6 hours ago, Ser Hedge said:

Not another cliff-hanger please! Or is it in the mods' inbox already? Well one thing we are all good at is waiting! :lol:

Welp, fuck it, here was my proposed topic, which I don't think the mods are gonna approve, so here it is, to satisfy curiosity:

(warning: aluminium headwear may be present)

In this thread, I'm not going to talk about D&D; I'm going to aim the gun squarely at David Benioff's head. Why? Well, I recently found out that pretty much every boneheaded shift from the books (as opposed to pragmatic or neutral changes) were the result of David Benioff having a 'creative vision' shift at the last minute and no-one having the spine to tell him 'no'. Talisa? Turns out David Benioff prefers brown women, and couldn't understand why Robb would lose a kingdom over a non-brown one. TV Dorne including Jaime and Bronn? Benioff's call, along with the infamous bad pussy line; remember, he thinks brown women are inherently sexy and can merely mention genitalia to be arousing. Stannis losing the Battle of Ice and being the one to personally burn his daughter? Benioff's call again, later justifying it as Stannis's ambition overruling his love. Sansa being sold off to the Boltons to be raped? Benioff's idea, with Cogman stuck as the fall guy.

So, with this in mind, it shouldn't surprise you that Jaime going back to Cersei time and time again because 'we can't choose who we love' is an invention of Mr Benioff. DB Weiss may have an infatuation with zombie polar bears, but in all fairness, that's harmless spectacle. Dumb, but not malignant. Only Benioff would actively make the show as toxic as it is. Incest is wincest, it would seem. Well, no, not quite, because it should also be noted that Cersei is considerably consequence-free from blowing up the Vatican, beloved, even. It's not just a ruination of Jaime to facilitate more fun incest, it's a simultaneous whitewashing (in a personal way; the act of blowing up the Vatican in a catholic area is kinda fucked, desperate or otherwise) and plot armouring of Cersei.

But why would he do this? Benioff is an unapologetic misogynist who doesn't care about women (just see Season 6's sophomoric tagline, 'Women on top', as a way to show that women are going to be thrown positions of power but also lolsexjoke) so he's not merely trying to appease the radical feminist crowd. If he wanted to be lazy, the Aegon plot was right there to crib from the books, Cersei could have been toppled early (as would be realistic of a person who blew up the fucking Vatican) and he could have worked with an easy Targ rivalry.

But no, it had to be Cersei. Why? Well, I'll spoil my theory ahead of time: Benioff is Cersei. Specifically, he's the worst of Book-Cersei, and has experienced a life not dissimilar to Show-Cersei. Let's go through the points.

Malignant Narcissism - You know how in Book-Cersei's chapters, a self-aware person reads through the self-congratulatory narration praising Cersei's brilliance and cringes, knowing how utterly delusional Cersei is? Benioff, if he even read Feast (which is being generous, I'll be honest), takes Cersei's brilliance at face value. After all, he loves to revel in his own brilliance; that's just what normal smart people do as far as he's concerned. That's why he can't help but talk a load of shit in the Inside the Episode videos; he's just so eager to show the world how awesome he is, but knows everyone around him is 'too dumb' to comprehend his genius without him explaining it. In addition, he's obsessed with his image. He spent the Battle of the Bastards refreshing IMDb over and over again because that rating is life to him. Every other critic he spurned once they turned sour, but IMDb was his safe haven, the place that would always praise him. Heh. How'd that turn out, eh, Danny Boy? Also, it should be noted that in nominating episodes for writing Emmys, he only nominated episodes written by him and Weiss. Not the better-received eps from Cogman, local fall guy. Only him, because only he is brilliant enough to get Emmys.

Proud Alcoholism - What was it Benioff said about where he'll be after the finale? At an undisclosed location, with lots of alcohol, far away from the internet. He isn't just an alcoholic; he thinks alcoholism is cool enough to make it part of a public statement.

Proud Falseness - Just like how Cersei smugly recounts all the ways she's lied to people and thinks she's the height of cunning, so does David Benioff. He outright revelled in the fact that he has no screenwriting qualifications (which explains his remark about themes being for eighth grade book reports) and how he tricked GRRM into thinking he had a screenwriting degree. This is not something to be proud of, Benioff, this is something you should be hiding in shame over.

An inability to face consequences - When Season 5 ended and there was a massive backlash, what happened at San Diego comic con? Oh yeah, D&D pushed the actors forward, knowing everyone can't reasonably blame them for doing their jobs to the best of their ability, while they dodged the event. I guarantee this will happen again this year. Similarly, this fantasy gets written into Show-Cersei. She blows up the Vatican? No prob, bob, everyone loves her! To be fair, this could have something to do with how coddled David Benioff truly is. See, his father's a wall street tycoon, the ex-owner of Goldman-Sachs. He's kind of a big deal. Hence David could be coddled by daddy while he fails at novel after novel, screenplay after screenplay, and because of daddy's connections, he'll only fail upwards. Maybe this is just what Benioff thinks the real world is?

Idealising toxic masculinity while ironically lacking any of its ideals - Now, I may get flack for this. I assure you, I'm not with the ANTIFA crowd, but I know toxic gender stereotypes exist. REAL MEN FIGHT UNGHHH is a toxic stereotype of how masculinity works, so in my view, that's toxic masculinity (as opposed to how radical feminists seem to see it, that is, any expression of masculinity is itself toxic). I think it's safe to say David Benioff wants to be seen as a 'real man'. He's the guy who said Ramsay is more heroic than Joffrey because he fights, he's the one who had Sam say 'lol, learning is for idiots' (once again, this guy lied about his screenwriting qualifications to GRRM, is it any wonder Sam becomes Grand Maester at the end? Pure projection), he's the one who insists on gratuitous rape and sex scenes. He's trying so hard to be testosterone-poisoned, but, let's be honest, the guy's a chicken shit. He isn't a chiselled action hero, he's a greying, weaselly, alcoholic man. He isn't masculine in the non-toxic sense, let alone the toxic sense. Meanwhile, Book-Cersei spends her whole time being misogynistic and wishing she was born a man, much like how Benioff wishes he was born a fuckboy who could make all the sex jokes he wrote sound cool.

Spiteful towards reasonable criticism and dissent - Through AFFC, Cersei is being given reasonable counsel by Harys Swyft, Pycelle, and Kevan Lannister, but of course, this just makes her view them as her enemy. When Lady Stokeworth brings up legitimate concerns, Cersei has them tortured to death by Qyburn. This pretty much matches how he approached Ros, Barristan, Stannis and Jaime's actors. Ros's actress is an exception here, as her concerns boiled down to 'I don't want nude scenes anymore, either I want a meatier role or I'm not interested'. But David needs his fanservice whore... so he has a brilliant idea. He teases a meatier story for Ros, then has her gruesomely killed by Joffrey, all while gratuitously panning a camera up her corpse. That'll show her. As for Barristan, Stannis, and Jaime, each of their actors had read the books and had concerns about their characters' arcs. Stephen Dillane, bless his soul, outright told the press he had 'no idea why his character was doing what he did'. Let's see how each ended: Barristan died in a pit, denying him a book story where he gets to be heroic, Stannis died alone and deserted upon as a fanatic child-killing monster, and Jaime died renouncing his protectiveness for the people, somehow coming off as less sympathetic than... yes, Cersei.

Utterly sex-obsessed - Is there anything Book-Cersei thinks can't be solved by sexual bribery? Nope. Similarly, David Benioff just thinks sex is inherently cool and fun, and can save any scene.

Overly reliant on a rich daddy to make up for incompetence - As mentioned above, it's only really thanks to his father than Benioff has a writing career at all. When your father is a rich, media industry bankroller, you kind of get jobs handed to you. So just like how Tywin shielded Cersei from her own idiocy with Lannister gold, so too does Benioff's father, enabling the moron to keep failing upwards. Today X Men Origins, tomorrow Star Wars.

Well, I think this is long and detailed enough to make my case. I think that David Benioff liked Cersei because it was like looking in a mirror, so he kept her alive against the odds, and made sure she died a scared, pregnant woman in her lover's arms. What do you guys think?

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20 minutes ago, Beardy the Wildling said:

Welp, fuck it, here was my proposed topic, which I don't think the mods are gonna approve, so here it is, to satisfy curiosity:

(warning: aluminium headwear may be present)

In this thread, I'm not going to talk about D&D; I'm going to aim the gun squarely at David Benioff's head. Why? Well, I recently found out that pretty much every boneheaded shift from the books (as opposed to pragmatic or neutral changes) were the result of David Benioff having a 'creative vision' shift at the last minute and no-one having the spine to tell him 'no'. Talisa? Turns out David Benioff prefers brown women, and couldn't understand why Robb would lose a kingdom over a non-brown one. TV Dorne including Jaime and Bronn? Benioff's call, along with the infamous bad pussy line; remember, he thinks brown women are inherently sexy and can merely mention genitalia to be arousing. Stannis losing the Battle of Ice and being the one to personally burn his daughter? Benioff's call again, later justifying it as Stannis's ambition overruling his love. Sansa being sold off to the Boltons to be raped? Benioff's idea, with Cogman stuck as the fall guy.

So, with this in mind, it shouldn't surprise you that Jaime going back to Cersei time and time again because 'we can't choose who we love' is an invention of Mr Benioff. DB Weiss may have an infatuation with zombie polar bears, but in all fairness, that's harmless spectacle. Dumb, but not malignant. Only Benioff would actively make the show as toxic as it is. Incest is wincest, it would seem. Well, no, not quite, because it should also be noted that Cersei is considerably consequence-free from blowing up the Vatican, beloved, even. It's not just a ruination of Jaime to facilitate more fun incest, it's a simultaneous whitewashing (in a personal way; the act of blowing up the Vatican in a catholic area is kinda fucked, desperate or otherwise) and plot armouring of Cersei.

But why would he do this? Benioff is an unapologetic misogynist who doesn't care about women (just see Season 6's sophomoric tagline, 'Women on top', as a way to show that women are going to be thrown positions of power but also lolsexjoke) so he's not merely trying to appease the radical feminist crowd. If he wanted to be lazy, the Aegon plot was right there to crib from the books, Cersei could have been toppled early (as would be realistic of a person who blew up the fucking Vatican) and he could have worked with an easy Targ rivalry.

But no, it had to be Cersei. Why? Well, I'll spoil my theory ahead of time: Benioff is Cersei. Specifically, he's the worst of Book-Cersei, and has experienced a life not dissimilar to Show-Cersei. Let's go through the points.

Malignant Narcissism - You know how in Book-Cersei's chapters, a self-aware person reads through the self-congratulatory narration praising Cersei's brilliance and cringes, knowing how utterly delusional Cersei is? Benioff, if he even read Feast (which is being generous, I'll be honest), takes Cersei's brilliance at face value. After all, he loves to revel in his own brilliance; that's just what normal smart people do as far as he's concerned. That's why he can't help but talk a load of shit in the Inside the Episode videos; he's just so eager to show the world how awesome he is, but knows everyone around him is 'too dumb' to comprehend his genius without him explaining it. In addition, he's obsessed with his image. He spent the Battle of the Bastards refreshing IMDb over and over again because that rating is life to him. Every other critic he spurned once they turned sour, but IMDb was his safe haven, the place that would always praise him. Heh. How'd that turn out, eh, Danny Boy? Also, it should be noted that in nominating episodes for writing Emmys, he only nominated episodes written by him and Weiss. Not the better-received eps from Cogman, local fall guy. Only him, because only he is brilliant enough to get Emmys.

Proud Alcoholism - What was it Benioff said about where he'll be after the finale? At an undisclosed location, with lots of alcohol, far away from the internet. He isn't just an alcoholic; he thinks alcoholism is cool enough to make it part of a public statement.

Proud Falseness - Just like how Cersei smugly recounts all the ways she's lied to people and thinks she's the height of cunning, so does David Benioff. He outright revelled in the fact that he has no screenwriting qualifications (which explains his remark about themes being for eighth grade book reports) and how he tricked GRRM into thinking he had a screenwriting degree. This is not something to be proud of, Benioff, this is something you should be hiding in shame over.

An inability to face consequences - When Season 5 ended and there was a massive backlash, what happened at San Diego comic con? Oh yeah, D&D pushed the actors forward, knowing everyone can't reasonably blame them for doing their jobs to the best of their ability, while they dodged the event. I guarantee this will happen again this year. Similarly, this fantasy gets written into Show-Cersei. She blows up the Vatican? No prob, bob, everyone loves her! To be fair, this could have something to do with how coddled David Benioff truly is. See, his father's a wall street tycoon, the ex-owner of Goldman-Sachs. He's kind of a big deal. Hence David could be coddled by daddy while he fails at novel after novel, screenplay after screenplay, and because of daddy's connections, he'll only fail upwards. Maybe this is just what Benioff thinks the real world is?

Idealising toxic masculinity while ironically lacking any of its ideals - Now, I may get flack for this. I assure you, I'm not with the ANTIFA crowd, but I know toxic gender stereotypes exist. REAL MEN FIGHT UNGHHH is a toxic stereotype of how masculinity works, so in my view, that's toxic masculinity (as opposed to how radical feminists seem to see it, that is, any expression of masculinity is itself toxic). I think it's safe to say David Benioff wants to be seen as a 'real man'. He's the guy who said Ramsay is more heroic than Joffrey because he fights, he's the one who had Sam say 'lol, learning is for idiots' (once again, this guy lied about his screenwriting qualifications to GRRM, is it any wonder Sam becomes Grand Maester at the end? Pure projection), he's the one who insists on gratuitous rape and sex scenes. He's trying so hard to be testosterone-poisoned, but, let's be honest, the guy's a chicken shit. He isn't a chiselled action hero, he's a greying, weaselly, alcoholic man. He isn't masculine in the non-toxic sense, let alone the toxic sense. Meanwhile, Book-Cersei spends her whole time being misogynistic and wishing she was born a man, much like how Benioff wishes he was born a fuckboy who could make all the sex jokes he wrote sound cool.

Spiteful towards reasonable criticism and dissent - Through AFFC, Cersei is being given reasonable counsel by Harys Swyft, Pycelle, and Kevan Lannister, but of course, this just makes her view them as her enemy. When Lady Stokeworth brings up legitimate concerns, Cersei has them tortured to death by Qyburn. This pretty much matches how he approached Ros, Barristan, Stannis and Jaime's actors. Ros's actress is an exception here, as her concerns boiled down to 'I don't want nude scenes anymore, either I want a meatier role or I'm not interested'. But David needs his fanservice whore... so he has a brilliant idea. He teases a meatier story for Ros, then has her gruesomely killed by Joffrey, all while gratuitously panning a camera up her corpse. That'll show her. As for Barristan, Stannis, and Jaime, each of their actors had read the books and had concerns about their characters' arcs. Stephen Dillane, bless his soul, outright told the press he had 'no idea why his character was doing what he did'. Let's see how each ended: Barristan died in a pit, denying him a book story where he gets to be heroic, Stannis died alone and deserted upon as a fanatic child-killing monster, and Jaime died renouncing his protectiveness for the people, somehow coming off as less sympathetic than... yes, Cersei.

Utterly sex-obsessed - Is there anything Book-Cersei thinks can't be solved by sexual bribery? Nope. Similarly, David Benioff just thinks sex is inherently cool and fun, and can save any scene.

Overly reliant on a rich daddy to make up for incompetence - As mentioned above, it's only really thanks to his father than Benioff has a writing career at all. When your father is a rich, media industry bankroller, you kind of get jobs handed to you. So just like how Tywin shielded Cersei from her own idiocy with Lannister gold, so too does Benioff's father, enabling the moron to keep failing upwards. Today X Men Origins, tomorrow Star Wars.

Well, I think this is long and detailed enough to make my case. I think that David Benioff liked Cersei because it was like looking in a mirror, so he kept her alive against the odds, and made sure she died a scared, pregnant woman in her lover's arms. What do you guys think?

It probably should be on the Rant and Rave thread,

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36 minutes ago, Ser Hedge said:

Both barrels @Beardy the Wildling ! And the camping kit, backpack, ammo belt and both boots !!!

"I like" as Sasha Baron Cohen would say in-character as Borat, without in any way, shape or form endorsing Cohen's approach to comedy or his tastes. 

Someone had to go old yeller on 'em.

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Shiiiieeet. @Beardy the Wildling, tell us minnows how you really feel, eh?

To paraphrase? Wellp, that's Angela Lansbury squinting at her tipewriter, gleefully weaving a web of causality. 

No diss, I'm the type of idiot who loved Murder, She Wrote and how no one figured out it was really the old lady herself who brought death in her pretty handbag. Hm...

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One of the themes I always enjoyed was them doing the commentary for the episode where Stannis dies 5.10 (I think if I remember correctly). The entire commentary was just about the looks characters give and how they emote. It was at that point I realized that they think emoting makes great TV.

And the most insane line they have ever said, "We re-conceived the role to make it worthy of the actor's talents." This is how we got Dorne..... and other messes.

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