Jump to content
Baelor 'Breakspear'

Character community opinion #1

Recommended Posts

Hey! this is a series where I list a character and you tell me what you think about him ( Complex, boring, Overrated, underrated, interesting, love, hate ) do an analysis about him, theories about him, your opinion, predictions maybe even do a ranking of something (best character,fighter,interesting,underrated) and put the character there. You can do a whole essay or respond with a single word

 

The objective of this is to see what the aSoIaF community thinks about some specific characters and I am planning to do a series. 

 

With that being said the first character is: Cregan Stark

 

Edited by Baelor 'Breakspear'

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cregan Stark is one of the more interesting Starks that we’ve seen so far. He’s a daunting, intimidating figure who brought justice to King’s Landing regardless of his loyalties. He was also the only man in Westeros who saw the good sense in warning Aegon about the treachery of the nobles flocking to the boy king. Granted, he was a bit mad to think he could conquer Storm’s End or Casterly Rock, even if he did have more than 10,000 wild Northmen at his back. But for the most part, he’s an interesting foil to Ned Stark. Both men came south at the urging of their southron allies and try to administer justice as Hand of the King. But while Ned was steeped in the honour of the Vale and thus tempered from being a true wolf of the North, Cregan was a full blooded Stark of old. He was a savage warrior, a just man, and a hard man who only speaks the language of the North and has nothing but contempt for the south. One of them died, and the other didn’t. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Baelor 'Breakspear' said:

Hey! this is a series where I list a character and you tell me what you think about him ( Complex, boring, Overrated, underrated, interesting, love, hate ) do an analysis about him, theories about him, your opinion, predictions maybe even do a ranking of something (best character,fighter,interesting,underrated) and put the character there. You can do a whole essay or respond with a single word

 

The objective of this is to see what the aSoIaF community thinks about some specific characters and I am planning to do a series. 

 

With that being said the first character is: Cregan Stark

 

We already know how each of us feel about the characters.  You can tell from my user name where I stand on the characters.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Bowen 747 said:

We already know how each of us feel about the characters.  You can tell from my user name where I stand on the characters.  

The point is to see how the community feels about a character

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a theory about Cregan Stark (though it's way different from what general public thinks on this forum). I think that Cregan Stark is ancestor of Bloodraven and current Targaryens, starting from children of Aegon V and Betha Blackwood.

Cregan Stark had four daughters with Alysanne Blackwood. I think that one of them, Mariah, had married back into Blackwood family, with one of her cousins, and that Melissa Blackwood was her daughter and Cregan's grand-daughter. Melissa was Aegon IV's mistress, and gave birth to three of his children - Bloodrvaen, Mya, Gwenys.

For some reason Cregan had a duel with Kingsguard Aemon the Dragonknight, Aegon IV's brother. I think that the reason of this duel was Aegon's affair with Melissa. Cregan had won, and forced Aegon to end his relationship with Melissa. Or something like that.

Later Aegon had legitimized his bastards. So Melissa's children became Blackwoods. Their mother was a highborn lady, and their father was a King. So it's possible that Mya and Gwenys, even though originally they were born as bastards, later became ladies, and married into great Houses. I think that Mya, same as her (possibly) grandmother, Mariah Stark, had married into Blackwood family, and that Melantha and Betha Blackwoods were Mya's daughters, Melissa's granddaughters, Mariah's great granddaughters, and Cregan Stark's great great granddaughters.

Then Melantha Blackwood had married with Willam Stark (Lyanna Stark is their great granddaughter), and her (possibly) sister Betha Blackwood had married with Aegon V Targaryen (Rhaegar Targaryen is their great grandson). If this is correct, then both Rhaegar and Lyanna are great great grandchildren of Mya Rivers, Bloodraven's sister.

Which also means that Bloodraven is Bran's 3rd great grand uncle on Stark-side of Bran's family. And I think that they are also bloodrelated on Targaryen-side. I think that Aegon IV's mistress, Jeyne Lothston, was mother of the Bastard of Harrenhal, and that this bastard was secret son of Aegon IV, and he also was founder of House Whent, grandfather of Shella Whent and her siblings and cousins, and great grandfather of Minisa Whent (mother of Catelyn Tully). If the Bastard of Harrenhal is Bran's great great great grandfather on his mother's side, and Bloodraven is the Bastard's brother (different mothers, but father is Aegon IV), then Bloodraven is Bran's 3rd great grand uncle on Targaryen-side of Bran's family.

 

Family tree (for easier understanding):

9. Cregan Stark + Alysanne Blackwood = 4 daughters (Mariah)

8. Mariah Stark + Blackwood husband = Melissa

7. Melissa Blackwood + Aegon IV] [Jeyne Lothston + Aegon IV]    

6. Mya + Blackwood husband, Gwenys, Bloodraven] [the Bastard of Harrenhal + wife]

5. Melantha Blackwood + Willam Stark] [Betha Blackwood + Aegon V Targaryen] [the Bastard's children]

4. Edwyle Stark + Marna Locke] [Jaehaerys + Shaera] [the Bastard's grandchildren - Shella Whent + Walter, Oswell, others, parent of Minisa Whent]

3. Rickard Stark + Lyarra] [Aerys + Rhaella] [Danwell Frey + Wynafrei Whent (daughter of Shella and Walter, the original Queen of Love and Beauty at Harrenhal), Minisa Whent + Hoster Tully]

2. Brandon, Ned, Lyanna, Benjen] [Rhaegar, Dany] [Catelyn, Lysa, Edmure]

1. Bran] [Jon, Rhaego]

Bloodraven is Bran's 3rd great grand uncle thru his father's Stark-Blackwood line (thru Mya Rivers, Bloodraven's sister), and his 3rd great grand uncle thru his mother's Tully-Whent line (thru the Bastard of Harrenhal, who possibly was first Lord Whent and Aegon IV's bastard, and Bloodraven's half-brother).

 

This theory is based on three elements:

1. the timing and number of generations.

(For example, Melissa Blackwood is just the right age to be Cregan's granddaughter; same number of generations between Mya Rivers and Rhaegar, and Mya Rivers and Lyanna; old Shella Whent is just the right age to be great granddaughter of Aegon IV - the Bastard of Harrenhal was probably born in 178 or 179, so he was from about the same generation as Maekar Targaryen (born between 174 and 178), the Bastard's children (including father of Shella Whent) were about the same age/from the same generation as Aegon V, so Shella is from the same generation as Jaehaerys Targaryen (born in 225, would have been 75 in 300 AC). Jon Arryn died aged 78-80, Walder Frey is going to be 92 in 300 AC, maester Aemon died aged 102, Old Nan is in her late 80s if not older, so Shella Whent could be in her 70s; etc.). 

2. that duel between Cregan and Dragonknight.

3. in some cases GRRM is using similar names, to show to readers that certain characters are bloodrelated. For example:

(Black Pearls of Braavos) Bellegere Otherys - her daughter Bellenora - Bellonara - Bellegere.

(Lysene pirate-kings) Sargoso Saan - Saathos Saan - Samarro Saan - Salladhor Saan (ancestors and descendants).

(Prostitutes at KL) - Chataya - her daughter Alayaya.

So, maybe, this is also one of those cases - Alysanne Blackwood-Stark - Mariah Stark-Blackwood - Melissa Blackwood - Mya Rivers-Blackwood - Melantha Blackwood-Stark.

Edited by Megorova

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Megorova said:

 

3. in some cases GRRM is using similar names, to show to readers that certain characters are bloodrelated. For example:

(Black Pearls of Braavos) Bellegere Otherys - her daughter Bellenora - Bellonara - Bellegere.

(Lysene pirate-kings) Sargoso Saan - Saathos Saan - Samarro Saan - Salladhor Saan (ancestors and descendants).

(Prostitutes at KL) - Chataya - her daughter Alayaya.

So, maybe, this is also one of those cases - Alysanne Blackwood-Stark - Mariah Stark-Blackwood - Melissa Blackwood - Mya Rivers-Blackwood - Melantha Blackwood-Stark.

Also the Ty in Lannister names, Brandons in dtark, Ae, -ys and -on in Targ names

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Baelor 'Breakspear' said:

Also the Ty in Lannister names, Brandons in dtark, Ae, -ys and -on in Targ names

Yes, and also several variations of name Lyanna in Stark family - Lyarra, Lynara, Lyanne; and Ben - Benjen, Bennard, Benedict, Beron, Berena; and Bran - Brandon, Branda, Barthogan. And more of the similar elements.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Megorova said:

Yes, and also several variations of name Lyanna in Stark family - Lyarra, Lynara, Lyanne; and Ben - Benjen, Bennard, Benedict, Beron, Berena; and Bran - Brandon, Branda, Barthogan. And more of the similar elements.

Yeah and generally we can find a lot of B and L in stark (and other northern houses) names

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I respect that he had his goal in mind at King’s Landing and for better or worse completely acted on his vision and like a true Northman gave up that ridiculous amount of power after such a brief time in order to go home with his new wife. 

He is the north. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Cregan Stark is pretty interesting, and his Hour of the Wolf might be foreshadowing what goes down in the South after Dany and (f)Aegon's fire breathing tango of doom; the Hour of the White Wolf/Dragon Wolf/Bastard Wolf. Jon Snow might be paralleling Cregan Stark by going South and not being horribly betrayed, while simultaneously being a next-gen improvement on Ned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×