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UK Politics: Another vote, just not for anyone who might change their minds


Which Tyler

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1 hour ago, Ser Hedge said:

They could have voted down such a future deal w/o SM access once negotiated and presented to parliament. 

To end up with no-deal instead? Anyway, I think this is attributing long term planing to the Labour front bench, someting I genuinely doubt they are capable of.

They are just like the Tory party, hopeless bunch of self-serving twats, who lack the understanding and/or imagination for what is happening, and more importanly going to happen long term, not even long term. mid-term, like say, two or three years down the road. It's all very Mayish. Apply short term fixes for some problems now, in exchange for creating bigger problems (or basically the same problems+) to pop up in a few months time.

Corbyn is trying to pacify remainers with some superficial cosmetic changes to their illogical, incoherent mess of a Brexit policy. If there were actually a GE on the horizon, the problems would still be there unsolved.

While the Tories Hunt and Johnson are telling all sorts of non-sense that gets them elected by the majority of the deranged Tory party members. That Johnson's do or die Brexit come halloween is gonna fuck him over come October 31st, who cares? The short term problem [for him] is, he is not PM. Same with Hunt's, the EU will re-negotiate nonsense.

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28 minutes ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

To end up with no-deal instead?

Nope, you would have had the WA with its Irish backstop already in this scenario. So mainland Britain could never be worse off than a customs union anyway.

Agree with everything else you said.

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3 hours ago, Werthead said:

Possibly not. One idea being floated is that Darroch realised that without Johnson's support, he'd likely be recalled when Johnson wins the leadership race. However, by resigning now it means that May can appoint the next ambassador and she can pick someone who isn't going to be fawning over Trump's every word (i.e. not fucking Farage). It would then be very politically difficult for Johnson to reverse that decision when he takes office.

The debate last night was farcical. Incompetent, odious shit that he is, but Hunt made absolute mincemeat out of Johnson to the grounds that it was starting to resemble infanticide. Johnson is manifestly unsuited to hold any kind of political office whatsoever, let alone Prime Minister of this country.

I do wonder how he got a elected Mayor of London. 

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15 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

I do wonder how he got a elected Mayor of London. 

The first time around it was an anti-Livingstone vote to a large extent. High voter turnout mobilized around issues such as perceptions of the congestion fare rising far more contributed significantly.

15 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Because he'd been on the telly.

Probably that you, yeah. At the time there wasn't that much of a negative public perception about him from what I remember.

And that lasted for his second election in 2012 benefiting from the coalition government in Westminster probably, or just that nothing had really gone wrong. He did have a good team under him.

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40 minutes ago, Ser Hedge said:

The first time around it was an anti-Livingstone vote to a large extent. High voter turnout mobilized around issues such as perceptions of the congestion fare rising far more contributed significantly.

Probably that you, yeah. At the time there wasn't that much of a negative public perception about him from what I remember.

And that lasted for his second election in 2012 benefiting from the coalition government in Westminster probably, or just that nothing had really gone wrong. He did have a good team under him.

At the time I don't think people necessarily knew a lot about him and he was reasonably successful at appearing to be relatively liberal by Tory standards, although those days now seem a long time ago.

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7 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

After May failed to stand up to Trump, and Johnsons failed to offer any sort of support whatsoever, Kim Darroch has been forced to resign for the sin of doing his job and reporting his honest assessment to his superiors.

This makes me worry for you guys. You're going to crash out, and Trump is going to rake you over the coals due to such weak leadership.

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10 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

This makes me worry for you guys. You're going to crash out, and Trump is going to rake you over the coals due to such weak leadership.

This would worry me more if I thought that the Trump administration (and for that matter the UK government) were capable of concluding a trade deal, even if we roll over completely on every issue, before Trump and Johnson get kicked out of office. But that would require competence. 

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4 hours ago, mormont said:

This would worry me more if I thought that the Trump administration (and for that matter the UK government) were capable of concluding a trade deal, even if we roll over completely on every issue, before Trump and Johnson get kicked out of office. But that would require competence. 

If you crash out with no trade deals in place, desperation will win the day. On both side. Your best hope is that Trump is desperate to get any deal done and will accept almost anything.

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10 hours ago, mormont said:

This would worry me more if I thought that the Trump administration (and for that matter the UK government) were capable of concluding a trade deal, even if we roll over completely on every issue, before Trump and Johnson get kicked out of office. But that would require competence. 

Now then, that's a cheery thought, relying on the ineptness of the two goverments to protect you.

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Watching Johnson wilting under fire from Andrew Neil is embarrassing. Hunt, in contrast, was composed and relatively eloquent, although it has to be said that Neil let him get off scot-free considering his NHS record, whilst he let rip with all barrels at Johnson.

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Presumably he is considering Jerry C. as the lesser evil. So it's basically throwing everything at de Pfeffel including the poverbial kitchen sink, in a last ditch attempt to knock some minimal sense back into Tory party members.

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On 7/10/2019 at 10:28 PM, The Anti-Targ said:

I do wonder how he got a elected Mayor of London. 

Because Ken Livingstone is an utter twat, but then so is Johnson and Sadiq Kahn, think it must be a prerequisite for being the mayor of London!.

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The current UK political furore being about Boris Johnson holding up a kipper live on stage and screaming about how it's the victim of EU regulations when the regulations in question were put in place as part of an agreement between the UK and the Isle of Man (that latter of which isn't even in the EU) is extraordinarily apt.

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Very pleased Parliament had the gumption to take action to prevent a prorogation allowing Boris a free hand with no deal. A good majority backed the amendment mandating Parliament sits in October regardless. Johnson has had some of his fangs pulled before he even gets to number 10.

I had thought the stars were aligning for de Pfeffel after Amber Rudd's treachery but the show of strength in Parliament today reassured me this is not necessarily the case. It is really despicable the so-called conservative party would elect a man whose solution to the greatest political crisis of recent years is to shut down Parliament. 

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Nothing says "Take back control" like closing parliament and not allowing it any control. Not that internal consistency has ever been a strong suit for the Brexiteers.

 

 

Elsewhere, I see Theresa is trying to put some form a patch on her legacy with a 2%+ pay rise for the public sector.

Of course, it's still having to come from the magic money tree, because gods forbit there could be such a thing as responsible economic policy.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49041295

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3 hours ago, Which Tyler said:

Of course, it's still having to come from the magic money tree, because gods forbit there could be such a thing as responsible economic policy.

The phrases "responsible economic policy" and "Conservative governance" are fundamentally incompatible. The transfer of money from the people to the already rich is one of the primary goals of the Conservative Party, and something they have pursued with tremendous success since their inception. Giving a pay rise to the proles at a rate that's about nine years too late is nothing more than a headline-appeasing sop.

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Is it fair to say that your PM to be is a drunk? I was watching the news last night, and they showed a quote of his saying he drinks a lot at lunch followed by tons of clips of him slurring his speech in interviews.

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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49048431

Darren Grimes wins appeal against Electoral Commision

Quote

The Electoral Commission's case was based on an incorrectly ticked box on an application form - something that it had been aware of for over two years and had not been raised in two previous investigations," his statement said.

"Yet the commission still saw fit to issue an excessive fine and to spend almost half a million in taxpayer cash pursuing me through the courts.

"This raises serious questions about its conduct both during and after the referendum."

 

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