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why jaime didnt tell people about the wildfire

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https://nobodysuspectsthebutterfly.tumblr.com/post/137274070973/thefinknottle-reblogged-your-post-i-absolutely

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I have the sense that the nature of wildfire is not commonly known. Tyrion’s brief education from the Alchemists probably puts him in the 99th percentile in the word for knowledge of how wildfire works. The Alchemists don’t even understand it really, they are totally surprised their spells start working better.

So I think Varys knows that there is a lot of wildfire hanging around but he just says, “oh yeah, left over from crazy old Aerys, better not touch that.” Same with Jamie. He knows the wildfire is there, but since he’s under the impression that an alchemist needs to light it for it to burn - and killed the all the alchemists that knew about it- he doesn’t think it is an imminent threat. It makes me think of the tragic city and factory fires of the late 19th and early 20th century, so much loss of life that could’ve been prevented by the safety measures of today that didn’t even occur to the people of the time.

Anyway, when King’s Landing blows I think it will demonstrate that Varys, master of knowing everything, gets tunnel vision too. That the man who wanted nothing, who was slave to no emotion, was exactly that. His own personal brand of justice/prosperity/vengeance for Westeros doesn’t do Westeros any good in the end. I think Varys sees himself as the opposite of Kevan, a bad man serving a good cause. But the cause is really the same crap as before.

You know, this makes absolute sense. The question as to why Jaime hasn’t done anything all this time has bothered me for a while. But if both he and Varys don’t know wildfire can explode on its own, especially if it’s aged… wow. Yeah. Oh, this is going to add extra pain to Jaime’s failure, god.

And you’re also entirely correct about Varys. That’s one whose downfall is going to be so poetically ironic, in so many ways…

 

 

https://nobodysuspectsthebutterfly.tumblr.com/post/175047641588/did-jaime-not-tell-anyone-about-the-wildfire

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What the pyromancer Hallyne told Tyrion is apparently not public knowledge, but a trade secret:

“Why doesn’t it seep into the clay as well?”
“Oh, but it does,” said Hallyne. […] “As it ages, the substance grows ever more, hmmmm, fickle, let us say. Any flame will set it afire. Any spark. Too much heat and jars will blaze up of their own accord. It is not wise to let them sit in sunlight, even for a short time. Once the fire begins within, the heat causes the substance to expand violently, and the jars shortly fly to pieces. If other jars should happen to be stored in the same vicinity, those go up as well, and so—” 

–ACOK, Tyrion V

Nobody else mentions these properties of aged wildfire, so we can presume that nobody else knows, certainly not Jaime. So Jaime, focused on removing the danger of Aerys’s plan to blow up King’s Landing, killed the pyromancer Rossart, killed Aerys, and a few days later hunted down and killed the other pyromancers who had worked on the wildfire plot (Garigus and Belis), and presumably thought it was safe to leave everything where it was. Jaime thinks wildfire needs to be removed from its jar and catch fire to burn, and he thinks the cache locations of warehouses and cellars are safe, where nobody knows about them – he doesn’t know that wildfire seeps into the clay jar it’s stored in over time, he doesn’t know that heat or even jostling could set them off and cause an explosive chain reaction.

 

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Because he is vain, thoughtless and irresponsible. We met him after a lifetime of these traits having grown out of all proportion, but he has always had them.

People have been trying to find an excuse for this. They shouldn't. It is an integral part of his characterization. 

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Stuff matures with time. Both people and weird pseudo magical explosives become more the same, augmenting their characteristics the longer they are left alone and unchecked. 

As a sideways weird fact. I don't know if it has already been contained but there's a huge forest fire in Catalunya right now. Apparently it started from a pile of manure left to ferment in the heat.

The behavior described above is the same. Left to stew on their own, both the wildfire and the characters seem to have refined their worst characteristics. Varys' certainty that he is right, Jaime's vanity and carelessness, wildfire's unreliability. 

Jaime simply considered the problem taken care of and wanted to forget everything about it. 

Edited by It_spelt_Magalhaes
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Ser Jaime is quite busy looking for time to "protect" his sister when he is not guarding the King. Just too busy...

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Because of Pride.  Because he is a vain, arrogant, narcissist.  Because the wolf does not judge the lion.  

In his mind, he has saved the city.  But if he truly cared about anyone other than himself, he would have done more.  As it stands, he only delayed it.

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On 6/29/2019 at 11:31 AM, Platypus Rex said:

Because of Pride.  Because he is a vain, arrogant, narcissist.  Because the wolf does not judge the lion.  

In his mind, he has saved the city.  But if he truly cared about anyone other than himself, he would have done more.  As it stands, he only delayed it.

Agreed but...he also killed the only people who knew where the caches of it were buried. So it's not like he could go find the stuff and...what? deactivate it?  He probably figured, in his ignorance of the substance, that since it was buried and the people who were supposed to set off the caches were dead that it wasn't an issue anymore.

The wildfire is also there for plot reasons. Either someone blows up KL in a fit of rage, the last of the CotF gets their revenge with a massive earthquake that sets off the wildfire, or it's used as a giant wight trap in the next War for the Dawn. Personally I like the last option, and Jaime could even go out like a hero, volunteering to be the one to set the stuff off and get exploded himself.

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"Why jaime didnt tell people about the wildfire"

Because he never needet to do so. Because he is an Lannister and therefore "untouchable". Because he is snobbish and maybe because he likes a bad boy image. Because a Lannister never apologizes, never regrets, never justifies. Because he never felt the need to explain his doings to anybody, because in his eyes nobody is worth it.

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I've always seen it as a bit of a plot flaw but I suppose it's plausible that Jaime thought those particular pyromancers in on the crazy plot with Aerys to blow up his own city were the problem, not the wildfire. "Wildfire doesn't kill people, nutbag pyromaniacs kill people".

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I feel that this is a plot hole. Reasons such as "Never Complain/ Never Explain/Never Apologize" or Negligence and Arrogance don't really fit in this case since there is no need to save face/play tough by concealing a fact as horrifying  as the Capital to the 7K is sitting on a sea of Wildfire. Moreover, Jaime loved Cersei, and it doesn't take a genius to know that all it takes is one spark and she's in danger. What if there was one more pyromancer that Jaime didn't know about (i.e. perhaps Rossart had a designated assistant that Aerys didn't meet)? There is no way in my mind that Jaime could sleep so easily in the Red Keep for year after year knowing he and Cersei were floating on a sea of uber gasoline.

Edited by Br16

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On 6/29/2019 at 2:08 AM, The Sleeper said:

Because he is vain, thoughtless and irresponsible. We met him after a lifetime of these traits having grown out of all proportion, but he has always had them.

People have been trying to find an excuse for this. They shouldn't. It is an integral part of his characterization. 

This could be one of the few times we agree.  :)

Jaime has his head up his ass.  All he was thinking of was his secret relationship with Cersei and his prowess in the sword arts.  He's not an intellectual.  He doesn't know how wildfire behaves.  It's just a flammable substance in his mind.  Maybe in his mind, should Robert ever find out his betrayal, yeah, he can kill them all.

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He perceived that Ned judged him as soon as he rode in, he didn't want to grovel and offer excuses he's too proud for that. In the eyes of the nobility he'd still be the Kingslayer that killed the man he was sworn to protect regardless so fuck it, be the Kingslayer.

As far as the Wildfire, I'd just assume Jaime believed it was sufficient to kill those that know of the plot. He's not an alchemist.  

Edited by Trigger Warning

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On 7/4/2019 at 4:36 AM, Moiraine Sedai said:

It's just a flammable substance in his mind.  Maybe in his mind, should Robert ever find out his betrayal, yeah, he can kill them all.

Woah, never thought about it that way. The cavalier young Jaime might truly be this malicious, especially as his whole world seems to consist only of love for Cersei.

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On 7/5/2019 at 8:35 AM, Trigger Warning said:

He perceived that Ned judged him as soon as he rode in, he didn't want to grovel and offer excuses he's too proud for that.

But surely he should have known that him sitting on the iron throne was simply outrageous from any point of view? Even Alexander executed the Satrap the betrayed Darius. 

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Damn good question.  It's not forgetfulness.  I don't know.  Plot hole.  There is more to what happened.  We have Jaime's thoughts and thoughts can be clouded to protect the ego.  We also have Dany's vision in HotU where it shows Aerys ordering the wildfire lit.  Those are not complete and doesn't fully explain what happened between Aerys and Jaime.  

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I lot of you won't buy this but I think that Jaime was also keeping the vow to keep the King's secrets. Might sound strange when he has broken the most central vow by killing him.

I have previously thought that was one reason he did not tell about Aerys's plot to blow up the city (rather than in the context of the particular issue of why didn't he deal with the wildfire more thoroughly). Reasons are a. not revealing King's secrets b. too proud to be disbelieved which I think he would have been - what wants to be seen as making a cowardy self serving lie after breaking the greatest taboo? c. Like other Westerosi on a deep level he takes the vows as absolute, even when faced with a situation when it would be evil to obey, so he also feels that the crime is in this sense undeniable and unjustifiable to others d. When coming out by accident on the winning side of a rebellion, its not sensible and also not a winning argument to say 'I wasn't actually joining your rebellion and helping my father's forces  - I had a higher motive than you rebels", making yourself suspect as well as probably disbelieved.

As far as he knew only a small elite of the pyromancers knew about the plot and so no back up from that quarter,.

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I think a large part is ignorance of the danger still present and a larger part enjoying his role in things, occasionally the mask slips and he lets out his vitriol of Aerys, of ‘being forgiven’ by Robert but as a whole, Jaime Lannister loves being the Kingslayer. It didn’t take him long to threaten a mans unborn baby after all, and we all know Jaime has it in him to kill children

Edited by FitzChivalry Fartseer

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