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NBA Off-Season 2019 - Bridge Over the River Kawhi

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There were Harden and, I believe, Davis on the team but they cancelled before Lillard and DeRozan. Not sure if Popovich can call some replacements or not.

It's still a pretty strong team but the gold is not as certain as it usually is in the Olympics.

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20 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

I know the FIBA World Cup doesn't really matter to us in the states, but good god I just saw the roster. We legit might get bounced out early. Kemba is our best player, being the only All-NBA player on the team, and only a handful of the other players have been All-Stars in the past. I mean, P.J, Tucker is on our national team. P.J. Tucker. P.J. TUCKER!!!!

Can't believe you're sleeping on Thad Young like this

 

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3 hours ago, Rhom said:

It is a damned shame that we were denied the glory of Carmelo reuniting with the Knicks.

Guess he’s done at this point?

I'm sure he's looking for more money, but I could still see him ending up on the Lakers with the vet minimum. Not the best fit for the team, but there's basically no risk or downside to the Lakers there.

The difficulty though is that I've heard before that the Buss family simply doesn't have the money to spend that much on players beyond what the team gets from revenue sharing. Jerry Buss made money in real estate back in the day, but the family aren't billionaires the way most NBA owners are now. So that $2.5 million for Carmelo maybe wouldn't impact the Lakers' cap, but it would be an actual hit on Jeanie Buss's wallet. So maybe he doesn't provide enough value to the team for it to be worth it. 

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On 8/1/2019 at 10:59 AM, Fez said:

I'm sure he's looking for more money, but I could still see him ending up on the Lakers with the vet minimum. Not the best fit for the team, but there's basically no risk or downside to the Lakers there.

The difficulty though is that I've heard before that the Buss family simply doesn't have the money to spend that much on players beyond what the team gets from revenue sharing. Jerry Buss made money in real estate back in the day, but the family aren't billionaires the way most NBA owners are now. So that $2.5 million for Carmelo maybe wouldn't impact the Lakers' cap, but it would be an actual hit on Jeanie Buss's wallet. So maybe he doesn't provide enough value to the team for it to be worth it. 

If I ran the Lakers, I wouldn't give Carmelo that money, either (even if I was a billionaire).

I think he has the potential to be really disruptive to the Lakers, and they've got enough on their roster to win already.

I believe if LeBron and AD stay healthy, they are as tough as any team in the NBA.  If either one misses substantial time, though, they are toast.  (Same is basically true for some other teams, too, of course, including the Clippers.  If Kawhi and PG stay healthy, they'll go deep into the playoffs,maybe win it all.  If not, they are in trouble.)

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55 minutes ago, Cron said:

If I ran the Lakers, I wouldn't give Carmelo that money, either (even if I was a billionaire).

I think he has the potential to be really disruptive to the Lakers, and they've got enough on their roster to win already.

I believe if LeBron and AD stay healthy, they are as tough as any team in the NBA.  If either one misses substantial time, though, they are toast.  (Same is basically true for some other teams, too, of course, including the Clippers.  If Kawhi and PG stay healthy, they'll go deep into the playoffs,maybe win it all.  If not, they are in trouble.)

Its the same for all teams actually. Which recent team outside of the Warriors with KD do you feel can survive a star or even just a key role player missing?

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54 minutes ago, Proudfeet said:

Its the same for all teams actually. Which recent team outside of the Warriors with KD do you feel can survive a star or even just a key role player missing?

Sometimes you just don’t know... Celtics two years ago being a prime example.

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3 hours ago, Proudfeet said:

Its the same for all teams actually. Which recent team outside of the Warriors with KD do you feel can survive a star or even just a key role player missing?

Well, I hear you, but most NBA teams don't have any realistic chance to win a title even on opening day anyway.

Clippers and Lakers are now both so stacked that if they are healthy I'd say no team can beat either of them except the other.

Some stars and superstars are far more injury prone than others, though.  Paul George, Kawhi Leonard and Anthony Davis all have severe injury histories, but LeBron does not, for example.

Realistically, I'll be stunned if Kawhi, PG and AD all make it through this season without a major injury, and I think the NBA champ next year will be one of those two teams (Clippers or Lakers), so I think the title next year will be decided by injuries (or lack of injuries) among those three players:  Kawhi, PG and AD.

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3 hours ago, Rhom said:

Sometimes you just don’t know... Celtics two years ago being a prime example.

Fair, even if I was referring to the expectations rather than the actual results.

1 hour ago, Cron said:

Well, I hear you, but most NBA teams don't have any realistic chance to win a title even on opening day anyway.

Clippers and Lakers are now both so stacked that if they are healthy I'd say no team can beat either of them except the other.

Some stars and superstars are far more injury prone than others, though.  Paul George, Kawhi Leonard and Anthony Davis all have severe injury histories, but LeBron does not, for example.

Realistically, I'll be stunned if Kawhi, PG and AD all make it through this season without a major injury, and I think the NBA champ next year will be one of those two teams (Clippers or Lakers), so I think the title next year will be decided by injuries (or lack of injuries) among those three players:  Kawhi, PG and AD.

I don't know about severe, but LeBron was reliable up till last year. It might just be a blip or it could be the start of a trend since he's getting up there in age and has had a lot of games along with that. I agree that the injury histories of the others is significant, but really, who knows? I've thought that Curry would be retired at this point in his career due to his ankle issues that severely limited his early sessions but he has overcome them fairly well. I think that we are still far from Greg Oden territory yet.

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1 hour ago, Proudfeet said:

Fair, even if I was referring to the expectations rather than the actual results.

I don't know about severe, but LeBron was reliable up till last year. It might just be a blip or it could be the start of a trend since he's getting up there in age and has had a lot of games along with that. I agree that the injury histories of the others is significant, but really, who knows? I've thought that Curry would be retired at this point in his career due to his ankle issues that severely limited his early sessions but he has overcome them fairly well. I think that we are still far from Greg Oden territory yet.

I agree about Curry.  We'll see how he holds up this year with Durant and Iguodala both gone.  Yeah, the Warriors picked up some other talent in the offseason, but not enough to offset the loss of Durant and Iguodala, I think.

I predict LeBron will be fine.  He is one of the most durable players I have ever seen.  Yeah, he's got a lot of miles on him, but he was at the top of his game last year before he got hurt with an injury that, so far as I know, did not even involve joints or tendons (I think it was muscle strain, and that stuff can heal up completely, I believe)

It's going to be a fascinating season, though, no doubt.  If they can all stay healthy, I think the Battle of L.A. may be the most intense rivalry (at least short term) in the history of sports, and I'll be rooting for the Clippers.

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Didn’t see that Green  signed for four Years, $100m. Honestly that’s fair value and makes sense for all parties involved.

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On 8/3/2019 at 10:55 AM, Cron said:

Clippers and Lakers are now both so stacked that if they are healthy I'd say no team can beat either of them except the other.

So stacked?  I don't know about that.  I would consider the Clippers, Lakers, Warriors and Sixers to have most top-end talent in the league.  But comparing any of those teams to the past 10 champions, I would say they're all below average for a typical champ.  The 2020 Lakers and Clippers (assuming full health) are well below any of the Warriors teams, slightly behind the Heat repeat squad or the 2014 Spurs.  They're approximately on par with the 2019 Raptors or the 2016 Cavs.  The only team they're really ahead of is the 2011 Mavs, and that was a fluky year given Lebron's inexplicable passivity in the Finals. 

Both the Lakers and the Clippers I can definitely see getting beat in a 7 team series even if healthy.  The Lakers lack depth, and the Clippers lack experience (aside from their top 2).  In fact IF (and I know this is a big if) but IF the Sixers stars continue to mature and gel, I think they have the talent and the matchups to defeat either one. 

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On 8/5/2019 at 12:47 PM, Maithanet said:

So stacked?  I don't know about that.  I would consider the Clippers, Lakers, Warriors and Sixers to have most top-end talent in the league.  But comparing any of those teams to the past 10 champions, I would say they're all below average for a typical champ.  The 2020 Lakers and Clippers (assuming full health) are well below any of the Warriors teams, slightly behind the Heat repeat squad or the 2014 Spurs.  They're approximately on par with the 2019 Raptors or the 2016 Cavs.  The only team they're really ahead of is the 2011 Mavs, and that was a fluky year given Lebron's inexplicable passivity in the Finals. 

Both the Lakers and the Clippers I can definitely see getting beat in a 7 team series even if healthy.  The Lakers lack depth, and the Clippers lack experience (aside from their top 2).  In fact IF (and I know this is a big if) but IF the Sixers stars continue to mature and gel, I think they have the talent and the matchups to defeat either one. 

Assuming all players are healthy, a matchup between Clippers and Sixers means the Clippers have BOTH of the best two players in the series (by quite a bit, given that one of them is Kawhi), and a matchup between the Lakers and Sixers means the Lakers have BOTH of the best two players in the series (especially given that one of them is LeBron)(.

 

Sorry, but assuming all players are healthy, I'd say the Clippers and Lakers would both easily defeat the Sixers.  (Remember in the playoffs, we have shortened rosters that play, and the Clippers and Lakers' top-heavy top 2 would be even more dominant).

And the Clippers are inexperienced?? Uh, my memory is that were giving the fully healthy (including Durant) al they could handle this past posteason, and THEN they added Paul George and Kawhi Leonard.

Oh, and by the way, the Sixers have some players with major injury histories, too.

Warriors lost Durant and Iguodala.  They made up for some of that loss in the offseason, but not even close to all of it.  Not  even close.

Bottom line: I predict this season will be decided by which team can stay the healthiest (as so many seasons are), but all things being equal, Lakers and Clippers are easily head and shoulders above the rest.

 

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27 minutes ago, Cron said:

Assuming all players are healthy, a matchup between Clippers and Sixers means the Clippers have BOTH of the best two players in the series (by quite a bit, given that one of them is Kawhi), and a matchup between the Lakers and Sixers means the Lakers have BOTH of the best two players in the series (especially given that one of them is LeBron)

Sorry, but assuming all players are healthy, I'd say the Clippers and Lakers would both easily defeat the Sixers.  (Remember in the playoffs, we have shortened rosters that play, and the Clippers and Lakers' top-heavy top 2 would be even more dominant).

I think you're selling Joel Embiid short there.  His problem is staying healthy, but when healthy, he's better than Paul George at least, and comparable to the other three.  Lebron in the 2020 playoffs is not going to be able to take on the extraordinary burden he did the last time we saw him in the playoffs.  His poor defense last year wasn't all just disinterest, he's starting to fade physically.  He'll still be great if he can stay healthy, but only in shorter spurts than he was capable of five or eight years ago. 

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And the Clippers are inexperienced?? Uh, my memory is that were giving the fully healthy (including Durant) al they could handle this past posteason, and THEN they added Paul George and Kawhi Leonard.

I don't really see what them taking two games on a Warriors team that was looking past them has to do with playoff experience.  They had absolutely no pressure in that Warriors series.  This year the story and the pressure will be very different. 

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Oh, and by the way, the Sixers have some players with major injury histories, too.

Chemistry issues too.  The Sixers are a long way from a perfect NBA champ.  But they have just as high, if not higher, ceiling than the Clippers and the Lakers if things come together for them. 

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Warriors lost Durant and Iguodala.  They made up for some of that loss in the offseason, but not even close to all of it.  Not  even close.

Losing Durant to the Nets and Thompson to injury hurts, no doubt.  But if Thompson recovers in 9 months (as is relatively typical for youngish NBA players), I'm reluctant to just count them out.  If they trade Russell for some pieces that fit better they could definitely be in the mix.  Without that, it's hard to see it, but who knows?  The 2019 Finals proved Curry/Green are a tough out, even without a strong team around them. 

Edited by Maithanet

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3 hours ago, Maithanet said:

I think you're selling Joel Embiid short there.  His problem is staying healthy, but when healthy, he's better than Paul George at least, and comparable to the other three. 

Eh, IDK about that. I got Embiid in the top 15, and probably closer to 10 than 15, but George made huge strides this year and probably deserves to replace Westbrook as a top ten player. He did finish third in the MVP ballot after all. 

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Losing Durant to the Nets and Thompson to injury hurts, no doubt.  But if Thompson recovers in 9 months (as is relatively typical for youngish NBA players), I'm reluctant to just count them out.  If they trade Russell for some pieces that fit better they could definitely be in the mix.  Without that, it's hard to see it, but who knows?  The 2019 Finals proved Curry/Green are a tough out, even without a strong team around them. 

Is 30 still youngish, because that's how old he'll be when he gets back (assuming he returns in like March)? Anyways, I had previously said I wouldn't be surprised if they missed the playoffs, but on a second glance I vastly overlooked something. Willie Cauley-Stein might actually be a really good fit for the team. If memory serves me correctly, he's actually fairly athletic and will be able to move well in Golden State's system. A starting five of Curry, Russell, Klay, Green and WCS could be formidable, assuming Russ wasn't a one year wonder and that Klay, and to a lesser extent Green, return to form. 

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13 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Eh, IDK about that. I got Embiid in the top 15, and probably closer to 10 than 15, but George made huge strides this year and probably deserves to replace Westbrook as a top ten player. He did finish third in the MVP ballot after all. 

Is 30 still youngish, because that's how old he'll be when he gets back (assuming he returns in like March)? Anyways, I had previously said I wouldn't be surprised if they missed the playoffs, but on a second glance I vastly overlooked something. Willie Cauley-Stein might actually be a really good fit for the team. If memory serves me correctly, he's actually fairly athletic and will be able to move well in Golden State's system. A starting five of Curry, Russell, Klay, Green and WCS could be formidable, assuming Russ wasn't a one year wonder and that Klay, and to a lesser extent Green, return to form. 

“Fairly athletic” does him a huge disservice.  At the college level I have never seen a big man that could defend a guard on the perimeter like WCS.  He can move laterally and still get back and block shots.  His offense has always been a weak spot, but that’s not necessarily what the Dubs need him to do.

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14 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

 A starting five of Curry, Russell, Klay, Green and WCS could be formidable, assuming Russ wasn't a one year wonder and that Klay, and to a lesser extent Green, return to form. 

It would be pretty galling if GSW managed to win 45-50 games, Thompson comes back and they walk through the playoffs after everyone assumed they were done.

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I know the USA Basketball team is kinda hard up for players, but apparently not so hard up that they need Carmelo Anthony.

https://www.si.com/nba/2019/08/08/usa-basketball-carmelo-anthony-decline-request-fiba-world-cup-Jerry-colangelo

Assuming Carmelo doesn't do much more in the NBA from here, is he a Hall of Famer?

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2 hours ago, Rhom said:

“Fairly athletic” does him a huge disservice.  At the college level I have never seen a big man that could defend a guard on the perimeter like WCS.  He can move laterally and still get back and block shots.  His offense has always been a weak spot, but that’s not necessarily what the Dubs need him to do.

Well in all fairness, I’m not wasting my time scouting the Sacramento Kings. The point is he’s a big that can move and defend, much like Steven Adams, so he’ll be a good fit if all he has to do on the offensive side is rebound and get easy lobs.

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1 hour ago, BigFatCoward said:

It would be pretty galling if GSW managed to win 45-50 games, Thompson comes back and they walk through the playoffs after everyone assumed they were done.

I doubt that will happen. They’ll probably be an under seed, but a dangerous one. The West is fairly open though, so if they can do it, the legend of the Warriors will only be magnified.

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