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U.S. Politics: Pedophilia is Just Acosta Doin' Business


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10 hours ago, Bonnot OG said:

Oh, and fuck Ghandi. I have zero use for the tactics of a racist.
 

That seems self-limiting. Judge a tactic by it's own merits in a given situation, not by whoever else has used it. If any action ever performed by someone with racist beliefs is off the table, I'm not entirely sure what's left for you.

I'm not advocating for or against non-violence, just saying it's use as a strategy should be judged on its efficacy rather than on ideological grounds. The same goes for violence, or indeed property distruction. Whether or not it's morally justified has to be paired with the question of whether or not it actually helps. 

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12 minutes ago, Jace, Basilissa said:

Well you confused me, then, and I apologize for misrepresenting your intent.

I will state again, I'm a democrat.  When popular will reaches a point where mass riots are occurring then I'll be down there with them. But 95% of this country (that's a guess cause they don't poll numbers for toppling the government), including most of the folks being persecuted, are not ready for that. I don't believe I get to force my beliefs on others without popular will. Full stop.

You're talkin' the white people, lady.

Here, among the people of color, it's really different.  It's not only in PR where the people are mobilizing -- and have been at least since Maria, since their federal government has refused any help, and the representatives of this government have done nothing but steal and make fun of them, even making terrible jokes about the rows of dead lined up after the hurricane.

Here, again, for just one instance, in the ballot counting in the disputed Queen's race for state attorney, young people of color are volunteering to be there in person through the entire recount of the paper ballots.  This is going to take at least two weeks, but the people will be there -- organized, again, by the same people who help AOC get into office.  They get all the help from me I can give.

But these are the very people posters here are telling to sit down and be quiet -- and they're the only voters in the country with a plan, who are actually doing things to push back and to have a real agenda. These are the people who are the primary targets as we cannot deny by the fascist, armed white supremacists who work for this state.

 

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6 minutes ago, Jace, Basilissa said:

I never denied being an idealist myself. :cheers:

Hey I got nothing wrong with the general will.  Well, yeah I do, but not anymore than anyone else's treatises.

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1 hour ago, Zorral said:

You know, people in this country have been waiting for 500 years.  When does the time for waiting run out?

No, screw this idea unless you’re committing violent actions to the level throwing literal explosives around you’re doing nothing. 

You act like there’s been objectively no improvement on any social issue for centuries. Quite honestly, the exact opposite unreasonable stance to those who pretend that the US is now completely egalitarian in all aspects.

Progress has been made. Not enough, I’ll fully agree but no there is no quick solution that would immediately expunge racism, homophobia, or sexism that plagues society and it’s government.

53 minutes ago, Inigima said:

What exactly is your plan? Exactly how much nothing do you think it will require to stop operating concentration camps for infants?

This idea of unless you’re doing anything but committing extremely violent acts in protest you’re basically doing nothing is disgusting because it basically discounts all men, women, and even children who’ve been maimed, and even died trying to address massive social injustice through peaceful means. 

46 minutes ago, Zorral said:

What is your plan? o one who fantasizes she's empress Irene of Constantinople, hmmmmmmmmm?

I am continuing with my plan which is supporting all the young activist women of color in my world, with money, with personal presence, and contribution of whatever of my skills are useful for their plans and projects, which includes tracking down assholes where they live and making their hidey holes public so people can call them out in public.  Landlords who are gouging and harrassing tenants really hate it when a crowd shows up outside their own homes with signs and sound systems.

Not all of them are dealing with overtly political targets either.  Many of them are community cultural leaders in the arts, particularly that of the culture that sustains the community and families over generations in their religion, their music and dance.  What these women can do with $20 is ... well, frackin' astonishing ....

Wait, you’re not even referencing any violent action taken. Your plan is effectively non-violent, and relies on communal social pressure, and perhaps civil disobedience to stop  bad actors. 

4 minutes ago, Zorral said:

But these are the very people posters here are telling to sit down and be quiet -- 

No, posters here have said not bomb shit.

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20 minutes ago, Jace, Basilissa said:

I never denied being an idealist myself. :cheers:

But what are you doing?

White people doing nothing, saying nothing are bringing violence ever closer.  You know that.  Or you are in denial.  Denial is not idealism. Neither is hiding in computer games, etc., which it seems to me is just about all straight, white people, by and large, are doing.  Or else, if they're men, telling women what to do.  While women, people of color, etc. are seeing whatever progress in voting right and human rights and civil rights eroding under them every single day.  Talk about all the progress made?  Look at how much it's been taken away by other words, other means: a for-profit incarceration system, police impunity and immunity for shooting people of color, voting rights across the board -- shit, GA won't allow people from Puerto Rico to get driver's licences because it says they aren't US citizens ... one can go on and on.  And we're supposed to sit down and shut up except to praise how far we've come?  Gimme a gdded break,.

Not to mention what's going on at the border, intentionally and with glee.  We've made a whole lot of progress all right.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Zorral said:

But what are you doing?

Dude fuck off with the "what are you doing" question.  What are you doing right now but whining about what others are doing on an internet forum?  No one needs to prove themselves to you, and enough with that dick measuring shit that sometimes happens here with the "oh I help my community more so I'm so morally superior."  I've devoted my life to this shit, whooptie fucking do, doesn't mean I have to agree with any of you (and frankly I don't -- even Jace) - and it also doesn't mean anyone else does either.

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8 hours ago, DanteGabriel said:

I'm not sure "everyone" knows who the asshole is, given the number of people who make excuses whenever the police shoot or beat unarmed black people. Sometimes the non-violent are "asking for it" -- especially if they happen to be poor or non-white.

As to the general efficacy of non-violent vs violent movements... Maybe you need both. MLK provided a peaceful alternative to the Black Panthers and Nation of Islam. But in general I don't believe entrenched power gives up anything without a shove.

They know, they just choose to be arseholes too.

I'll predict it now, armed uprising by the left in the USA won't work.

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4 hours ago, Inigima said:

I'm talking about concentration camps, bucko. I don't see the "adults" making a lot of progress. 

And the approach being suggested would not only achieve less, it most likely would reverse anything that's been gained. Right now the only way to fix this is by maximizing public pressure and eventually regaining unified power. Absent that, nothing will really change, so advocating for deeply unpopular things like violence will only make that outcome less likely to be achieved.  

4 hours ago, Bonnot OG said:

Are you calling me a racist? What adults are gonna actually achieve progress? Your white libs that give funding to a white supremacist party that is caging people, including children and babies, in concentration camps? The ones that attack the women of  color in their party harder than the racists in control of the senate and in the White House? 

 

Your civility and nativity don’t make you mature here, nor does it mean you’re reading the situation correctly. 

I think you've demonstrated quite clearly that you're a bigot and an extremist. Just look at the garbage above. If we put you in charge, we'd always lose. Always!

4 hours ago, Bonnot OG said:

Thinking people are just screaming racist because they don’t like someone, completely ignoring the fact some people don’t like Pelosi and call her a racist for her heavy handiness aimed at women of color over the past 2 years that has been harsher than what she has aimed at Trump. She is a racist. She’s not as overtly racist as Trump, who is clearly a white supremacist, but Pelosi is absolutely a casually racist liberal white woman.

You think she's been heavy handed with them because they're minorities? That is beyond idiotic. She's doing it because they are all political novices who are making a mess of her carefully laid plans. 

Man, did I miss when the inspiration for the slur "San Francisco Liberals" suddenly turned into a right wing crypto-fascist? Jace, when did this happen and why didn't anybody tell me? It's all your fault, BIRD! 

1 hour ago, DMC said:

Whenever I win that bet with @Tywin et al., I might have to make your title Madame Rousseau.

Which wrestler has the intro music that starts with "You've got no chance in hell?"

Beto ain't making it once the raise the minimum bar. Last I checked his campaign was on a death spiral, but really, who cares, He lost to Ted freaking Cruz. 

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11 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Beto ain't making it once the raise the minimum bar. Last I checked his campaign was on a death spiral, but really, who cares, He lost to Ted freaking Cruz. 

All he needs now is literally one more poll - he's already got 3 - where he get's at least 2% by any national or top 4 state qualified polls by August 28.  The chances he doesn't get that are, like, literally >.01%.  You forgot to check your facts, Jack.  Although your unending confidence in the face of certain defeat is pretty goddamn hilarious.  And that's Vince McMahon's entrance music.

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4 minutes ago, DMC said:

All he needs now is literally one more poll - he's already got 3 - where he get's at least 2% by any national or top 4 state qualified polls by August 28.  The chances he doesn't get that are, like, literally >.01%.  You forgot to check your facts, Jack.  Although your unending confidence in the face of certain defeat is pretty goddamn hilarious.  And that's Vince McMahon's entrance music.

Hey, as long as he's technically not in the clear, he's not in it. :P

Also, man do I miss crazy mid-90's wrestling. I hear you can't hit people with chairs anymore. Preposterous I say! I hope the kids use their Googles to see all the brutal s*** they used to do to Mankind Mick Foley! 

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1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said:

I hope the kids use their Googles to see all the brutal s*** they used to do to Mankind Mick Foley! 

Um, if there's ever a reason not to hit people with chairs anymore..except for Benoit I guess.  But you mean headshots - they'll still use chairs generally.

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2 hours ago, Jace, Basilissa said:

That shit ain't gonna stop. I've revised my expectations to fit the reality I live in. Republicans are fully on board with white supremacy and concentration camps... what do you want from me? I live in the real world, pal. If half of the political spectrum says these things are up for debate I don't get to choose otherwise. That's part of being a small d democrat. 

I try to operate in the system we have because it's not going away and the shit Bonnot and Zorral are advocating is just going to make the crackbacks worse.

So your big plan is to let the fascists murder people? I don't think I'm on board with that plan. 

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10 minutes ago, Inigima said:

So your big plan is to let the fascists murder people? I don't think I'm on board with that plan. 

I'd reframe it to state 'hope for and encourage the spread of mass reaction to said deaths in pursuit for political cache'. 

That's the only way they'll be stopped, by an overwhelming public response in voting. This appeal towards unorganized violence is self destructive. 

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2 hours ago, DMC said:

Dude fuck off with the "what are you doing" question.  What are you doing right now but whining about what others are doing on an internet forum?  No one needs to prove themselves to you, and enough with that dick measuring shit that sometimes happens here with the "oh I help my community more so I'm so morally superior."  I've devoted my life to this shit, whooptie fucking do, doesn't mean I have to agree with any of you (and frankly I don't -- even Jace) - and it also doesn't mean anyone else does either.

Dude -- the would-be balissa was the one whining about what is your plaN?????????? The same person who is most aggressive about everyone is worthless and should just die, etc.  And now is clutching the thousand yard pearl necklace of the empress at the very idea that people of color might. just. say. no. and. fight. back.

And then never answers her own question.  WTF is s/he doing to keep these horrors from increasing to the point there is wide-spread constant violence even within one's own communities, hmmmmm?

So, dude, get with the program.

And basilissa - when one isn't allowed to vote, wtf good is that, hmmmmmm? Nobody I know is talking about unorganized violence -- only pearl clutchers.  Unorganized and organized violence all along is practiced by the white supremacists, fascists and the rest of them, OK?  For every one incident that has been directed against the cops of every variety -- private and publicly funded -- there have been thousands directed the other way.

Once again, let me put it in BOLD -- it is only the women of color / diversity who are pushing back in D.C. and elsewhere, and DOING STUFF.  You white ladies ain't doin' shit.  Neither are you white guyz who equally clutch pearls, and desperately run back to polls and so forth to prove that everything is just like it used to be and polls matter.

 

 

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Lol, on a totally different subject, CNN is showing a news report based on surveillance (looks like US and other countries) how Julian Asante leaked the Democratic e-mails while holed up in the Ecuadorean embassy, with the help of professional hackers and Russian intelligence. 

Assange had incredible power in the embassy, demanding high speed internet and the right to have visitors who did not have to log in and who could not be searched by embassy security.

The US government told the Ecuadorians to stop things in late September of 2016 or else there would be serious consequences. The Ecuadorians then cut off his internet and his special visitors, but eventually relented on the visitors and in October two Wikileaks employees showed up and took away more than 100 computer drives. Embassy security wanted to look at those drives but the employees were on the ‘cannot be searched list’.  Things only changed after the government changed.

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1 hour ago, Zorral said:

WTF is s/he doing to keep these horrors from increasing to the point there is wide-spread constant violence even within one's own communities, hmmmmm?

So, dude, get with the program.

And what the fuck are you going to to do to keep these "horrors" from increasing?  The dick measuring, again?  Allow me to repeat - no poster has a responsibility to another poster to prove their goddamn activist bona fides.  So stop acting like they do.  Maybe you should get with the program that nobody cares that you try really really (really, there should be a Celine Dion song written about it) hard, and maybe just focus on the arguments.

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13 minutes ago, DMC said:

And what the fuck are you going to to do to keep these "horrors" from increasing?  The dick measuring, again?  Allow me to repeat - no poster has a responsibility to another poster to prove their goddamn activist bona fides.  So stop acting like they do.  Maybe you should get with the program that nobody cares that you try really really (really, there should be a Celine Dion song written about it) hard, and maybe just focus on the arguments.

Tell that to those who demanded that I do just that, dude, which includes you, dude.  Or maybe you all could grow up and get a room.  Or at least read the thread before your great excellence descends upon it and tells everybody once again to sit down and shut up because you say so.

In the meantime our great Dem leaders have gotten us here --  which is why so many of us are outraged about women of color being told to shut up and sit down by both you guys and the rethugs.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/nancy-pelosi-has-lost-control_n_5d2cb605e4b032ea741220ad

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5 hours ago, Zorral said:

I am continuing with my plan which is supporting all the young activist women of color in my world, with money, with personal presence, and contribution of whatever of my skills are useful for their plans and projects, which includes tracking down assholes where they live and making their hidey holes public so people can call them out in public.  Landlords who are gouging and harrassing tenants really hate it when a crowd shows up outside their own homes with signs and sound systems, press and social media.

4 hours ago, Zorral said:

But what are you doing?

White people doing nothing, saying nothing are bringing violence ever closer.  You know that.  Or you are in denial.

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

WTF is s/he doing to keep these horrors from increasing to the point there is wide-spread constant violence even within one's own communities, hmmmmm?

[..]

Once again, let me put it in BOLD -- it is only the women of color / diversity who are pushing back in D.C. and elsewhere, and DOING STUFF.  You white ladies ain't doin' shit.  [Emphasis mine] Neither are you white guyz who equally clutch pearls, and desperately run back to polls and so forth to prove that everything is just like it used to be and polls matter.

That's, like, 3.5 instances of you descending upon this thread with your great excellence and telling everyone else to fuck off because you are just so much better.  So of course there's this...

11 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Or at least read the thread before your great excellence descends upon it and tells everybody once again to sit down and shut up because you say so.

 

My point, in short, is get the fuck over yourself buddy.  Nobody cares that you're so great and they're not, which is absolutely all the above content is about from you.

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6 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

 

That's the point. Progress towards addressing a social injustice  takes time and often amounts to  more than throwing bombs around. But if dramatic change isn't happening right immediately after trying something , then it's waste of time to you. It is childish to think like that. 

Honestly, I see your stance as even as ludicrous as  the right-wing militias you've deluded themselves into thinking that they could overthrow the government if the government becomes tyrannical(or something they don't like). 

 

You like them  provide nothing to justify your thought process. You expect violence to garners more immediate results to your liking because...nothing really. You've given no rationale on how any such actions would do anything but energize the right. That the government with the strongest military on earth, will not  be cowed because some no bodies, with no political power, or backing from a significant portion of the population throwing some bombs. 

But it feels good to you, to see bad men have bad things happen to them.

There's a lot of movement pushing back against the notion that social progress is ever going forward. If you can get your hands on it, Calvin Warren's essay on Black Nihilism explores how "the politics of hope" are just another tool to get the oppressed to accept their inferior societal standing. He argues that nihilism isn't just a "nothing matters so why try" perspective, but instead, we acknowledge how broken everything is and we try harder to fix it. The status quo that Biden wants a return to is seen by many as a status quo that pushes oppression.

Here is a goodreads link to the essay.

I have a PDF of it, but I am not sure the legality of posting scholarly articles, so I will refrain.

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