Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Rippounet

What should be done... about climate change

Recommended Posts

34 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

No one WANTS global warming. But not everyone is willing to reduce their quality of life to prevent the 2 degree doomsday prophecy.

Climate change will be resolved. By technological advances. In about 20 years. That’s my prediction. In the meantime focus on paying off your mortgage.

Your prediction doesnt mean shit, like who the fuck are you?. And we allready now that you are not willing to do anything becous you are sooo rational, soo cool, and collected. And we know that you dont think the poeple who are going to suffer more are sub human. You are not the logical being that you think you are, you are not the voice of reason. I hope some day youll realize this and die of shame. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Liffguard said:

I don't blame individuals and their individual desires. I blame the political and corporate institutions that have so thoroughly abrogated any responsibility for their large-scale actions.

BTW, this is literally the entire point of the Climate Strike and Thunberg's UN speech.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 minutes ago, Conflicting Thought said:

Your prediction doesnt mean shit, like who the fuck are you?. And we allready now that you are not willing to do anything becous you are sooo rational, soo cool, and collected. And we know that you dont think the poeple who are going to suffer more are sub human. You are not the logical being that you think you are, you are not the voice of reason. I hope some day youll realize this and die of shame. 

Too emotional.

Fact is, transport and power generation represent the vast majority of carbon emissions. Electric vehicles and large scale battery systems coupled with solar power generation addresses this category almost completely.  In the next 20 years this will largely replace fossil fuel alternatives. But in the interim the problem will remain, although hopefully gradually reducing over time. Thats reality.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

No one WANTS global warming. But not everyone is willing to reduce their quality of life to prevent the 2 degree doomsday prophecy.

Climate change will be resolved. By technological advances. In about 20 years. That’s my prediction. In the meantime focus on paying off your mortgage.

We don't have 20 years. The oceans are rising and losing oxygen AS WE SPEAK. So your dismissive prediction means JACK SHIT.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

That’s why Tesla excites me so much. A way to live and enjoy life while also saving the planet. A win-win outcome.

Strange assumption that living and enjoying life are incompatible with climate action. I...don't even know how to respond to it, because I don't see how the argument follows.

In any case, I'll be very happy to see a major increase in the prevalence of electric cars and the phasing out of combustion engines. But it won't be enough. Not even close.

 

24 minutes ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

And I suspect that’s also why Tesla gets surprisingly muted support from the left wing who should be rejoicing at their progress.

I don't want to get too off-topic. But Tesla gets muted support from the left wing becuse the left wing is generally opposed to unaccountable corporations and billionaires. Tesla might prove useful in mitigating climate change, and that will be good. It still represents fundamentally unjust power structures, and that's bad. It doesn't have to be total support or total villification.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Too emotional.

Right, cuz living in denial is soo logical. 

Hoping that elon fucking musk is going to save us all is so realistic and based on facts and logic. Ugh. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Child activists are a bit of a joke. Their brains aren’t fully developed and they are heavily influenced by what the adults around them have fed into their minds.

Greta should therefore not be taken too seriously.

I have a conservative coworker (actually, most of the office leans conservative, but he's one I can talk to). He sort of subscribes to climate change, mostly because the weather here (Alaska) has been abnormal these past six or eight years in particular.  Extremely mild winters, summers with record breaking high temperatures.

 

Yesterday morning he was really, truly rattled by Greta's UN speech (I'm guessing he caught a Fox News clip).  First thing he brought up was her lack of civility.  

 

I told him we had a president who didn't know the meaning of the word 'civility.'

 

He goes, 'yeah, that's right, but Trump is different.  He's an adult.'

 

I told him Trump's lack of civility has cost him big time.

 

He then goes on about how Greta came across as 'brainwashed' and how 'she should be in school.' (and there are multiple similar comments from conservatives in comment sections to various internet articles) 

 

I told him Greta was highly educated for her age, and her statements, while blunt, lined up with the actual science.  (also brought up in comments to said articles.)

 

At that point he say, 'well, the scientists are wrong.' He left on his route literally chanting 'four more years' under his breath.

 

Talked with him again at days end (rare, we usually don't see each other till the next day).  He'd apparently been listening to some conservative radio and had latched onto the notion that Greta was 'brain damaged' or 'mentally ill'  (maybe somebody here has a clue what right wing screwball he was listening to, but it doesn't matter.)  He couldn't pronounce it correctly, but it was Asperger's, a variant of autism.  Told him that I have a couple of younger autistic quasi-relatives , and while that probably accounted for the perceived 'insensitivity,' it did not affect her reasoning skills.  (story of the autistic ten year old quasi relative who tackled and correctly solved his mothers 2nd year college algebra homework and explained to her where she'd screwed up)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, DMC said:

Right, this is definitely the motto that ensures substantive change.

Yes, don’t try actively try to do accomplish anything because the problem would just sort itself. It makes sense if you don’t think about it.

12 hours ago, karaddin said:

As to that last part - Americans have the cheapest petrol in the Western world yet some seem to think that any kind of price increase is utterly unacceptable AND using vehicles that might reduce that petrol consumption - potentially costing less even with higher petrol prices - is also utterly unacceptable.

But What about the Chinese? How could Americans be expected to change their habits when they’re around? They aren’t trying to actively do anything so why should we? 

 Except they’ve been trying to combat more than the recent American administration has; https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1W906Y

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

But What about the Chinese? How could Americans be expected to change their habits when they’re around? They aren’t trying to actively do anything so why should we? 

 Except they’ve been trying to combat more than the recent American administration has; https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1W906Y

You'd think the whole "they are actually taking steps" would be the achilles heel of the "But whatabout China?" refrain, but reality just bounces straight off that mindset

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Too emotional.

You’ve given nothing to actually lay the groundwork for why anyone on this board should take your predictions seriously. 

You feel that technology would simply advance enough in 20 years to where it won’t be a problem. You’ve given no peer-scientific study that supports your prediction just this vague allusions that they are.

You are either willfully ignoring the facts that many places would either be displaced die because of it, or simply don’t care.

Florida is expected to pay 77billion dollars over this to try to avoid going under water. Island nations who don’t have the resources of a rich nation behind them are literally already sinking.

20 years even if your prediction(which you’ve given no hardcore data to substantiate) was true is too late for many.  

You do not want to ride public transit. You do not want to buy an electric car till it’s cheaper than your current car. Your complaints do not appear to be motivated by fear of your life or vital to avoid poverty but out of a sense such things wouldn’t be as comfortable or prestigious as you’d like. 

These are quite frankly childish and quite frankly selfish complaints for one to raise. 

As if the discussion shouldn’t be just be centered towards how address climate change in the best possible way to avoid the deaths and displacement of millions but how address climate change in a way that won’t inconvenience the not poors even in the slightest of things. “I want to enjoy my luxuries in full; cater to ME, MY fun, is the pressing thing here.”

16 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Those that care at least.

So obviously not the majority of the right-wing in America who deny the problem’s existence in the first place. 

16 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

Not the third world masses who will burn down every forest in sight for a patch of land to grow some food just to feed themselves

Yes, how selfish these savages  are for wanting to eat to live. Seriously though Africa is per-capita and in total is a smaller contributor to Climate Change than the US. Latin America contribute less to the US too and has continued  to has try to reduce its carbon footprint :https://www.climatechangenews.com/2019/06/13/signifys-latin-american-operations-now-carbon-neutral/

But really the upper/middle class of the Rich US shouldn’t be expected to deal try to use public transit(and mingle with the poors)  or cut back on flying. 

 

16 hours ago, Free Northman Reborn said:

No one WANTS global warming. But not everyone is willing to reduce their quality of life to prevent the 2 degree doomsday prophecy.

Climate change will be resolved. By technological advances. In about 20 years. That’s my prediction. In the meantime focus on paying off your mortgage.

Actually answer the question. Who is the “we” in this scenario? Because plenty of people don’t have decades to deal with adverse affects of climate change. 

Paying off their mortgage isn’t going to be that big of an issue to them because they have no homes. 

So who is “we” in this scenario?

 

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, karaddin said:

You'd think the whole "they are actually taking steps" would be the achilles heel of the "But whatabout China?" refrain, but reality just bounces straight off that mindset

I’ve seen some immediately then go “what about India?” Utterly ignoring the fact even that even powerful  right-wing politicos of India  have come out in favor immediate(as in right the fuck now), government, actions to address climate change;https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.indiatoday.in/amp/india/story/pm-narendra-modi-highlights-indias-climate-change-action-at-un-summit-1602363-2019-09-23

Literally every country on earth could change their habits to try to combat this issue and the American right-wingers/conservatives who cry “what about x country” would simply shrug and say “well if everyone else is addressing the issue no reason we have to”. 

It really doesn’t matter what others are doing or sacrificing. All that matters is they get to keep a few select comforts in their daily life. What matters is them not having to give up any of the things that brings them bring them joy no matter how destructive their behavior is to everyone else or how much they don’t need those things to thrive. 

 

 

GRRM made a pretty decent book(well collection of short stories), that showcased the problemwith these “someone else should fix it attitude” or “why should I be inconvenienced” attitudes. It’s called Tuf Voyaging. It’s about a man whose come in possession of a extremely powerful biological warship traveling through space. One of the central conflicts of his journey is Tuf trying to get the people of a country-planet to slow down on making babies because their home is overpopulated and quickly reaching the point where mass starvation. The most practical and immediate solutions are off the table because it would intrude into the way of life the people had grown accustomed-they also believe that breeding would eventually lead their race to be gods.  Tuf in exchange for aid in repairing his ship, offer to help the people in their troubles. They agree but Tuf makes perfectly clear they(particularly government) need to attempt  systemic changes in their society, how the typical person lives must change. They refuse. With the full expectation that someone would bail them out before it got too bad. And Tuf does. He stresses each time what he’s offering is a temporary fix at best. They never learn. They do not alter their lifestyles, government refuses to push out contraceptives or discourage unprotected sex.

It comes to a point where the people either have to drastically curb their birth rates or literally invade other planets to accommodate their vast population. A galactic war would inconvenience Tuf. And at this point the only feasible way Tuf could reduce the birth rates of the people is to trick them into eating a food that severely influences their reproductivity. The longer they waited, the more extreme the actions had to be to address the problem. 

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ye gods.

My twitter feed runneth over with men, white, 40-50+ of age, who desperately wants to discuss Greta. And now we have one here, too.

Could we just remove men? Yes, it would include me, but we seem to be the problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's fucking nauseating & I hate it. Men are the worst.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Heartofice said:

Said in jest but profoundly stupid

Nice to know that my intelligence will from now on be measured by my jokes.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Yes, don’t try actively try to do accomplish anything because the problem would just sort itself. It makes sense if you don’t think about it.

But What about the Chinese? How could Americans be expected to change their habits when they’re around? They aren’t trying to actively do anything so why should we? 

 Except they’ve been trying to combat more than the recent American administration has; https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1W906Y

Even if they weren't that's a rather poor excuse.

12 hours ago, ThinkerX said:

I have a conservative coworker [...]

Talked with him again at days end (rare, we usually don't see each other till the next day).  He'd apparently been listening to some conservative radio and had latched onto the notion that Greta was 'brain damaged' or 'mentally ill'  (maybe somebody here has a clue what right wing screwball he was listening to, but it doesn't matter.)  He couldn't pronounce it correctly, but it was Asperger's, a variant of autism.  Told him that I have a couple of younger autistic quasi-relatives , and while that probably accounted for the perceived 'insensitivity,' it did not affect her reasoning skills.  (story of the autistic ten year old quasi relative who tackled and correctly solved his mothers 2nd year college algebra homework and explained to her where she'd screwed up)

Greta is a thorn in the side of all the people who don't want to do anything about climate change. She makes simple, logical arguments based on solid data and induces a feeling that conservatives hate to experience.

Guilt.

And it's funny that I was randomly musing about guilt yesterday without even making the obvious link with the hatred for Greta because what's at stake with her is precisely how we react to the individual responsibility -and guilt- we have in the whole mess.
Of course it's not surprising that she's going to be loathed on the right. If you think about it, it is a reaction that was no doubt expected. Given the content of her speeches she is fully prepared to bear this hatred for the greater good, which makes her an actual real-life hero.

2 hours ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

The longer they waited, the more extreme the actions had to be to address the problem. 

Which is what I was saying a few weeks (or months?) ago. At this point we can still work on this in a democratic consensual fashion, with only a few die-hard conservatives adamantly refusing to act (*insert random petty joke about brains here*).

But the longer we wait the greater the risk that when action is taken it will be... unpleasant.

7 minutes ago, Rorshach said:

Nice to know that my intelligence will from now on be measured by my jokes.

*insert random joke about brains and penises here*

 

Edited by Rippounet

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

For some much need levity 

Hah! You know, I feel like I gave up on that show a bit too early.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, karaddin said:

And he claims his world view is the true fucking Christianity

Please- As Northman has shown true Christians just use their religion to be dicks to others. Like non-heterosexuals. Jailing people  for having same-sex is a true worth while task for a true Christian.

Actually trying to help poor and weak survive and live in conditions befitting human-beings?  Screw that why should a true Christian care about doing that? Totally not a priority for true Christians. It makes sense if you ignore practically  every word Jesus said in regards to treating your fellow man.

1 hour ago, Rippounet said:

Even if they weren't that's a rather poor excuse.

Agreed. It never truly mattered what China was doing. It was always something was something that was meant deflect.

1 hour ago, Rippounet said:

Guilt

Yes. How dare she not promise unicorns? I want to be able to ride out in my fossil fuel consuming Jeep concerning for as long as it’s readily convenient to me without feeling bad. Thinking about how I’m ruining the planet when I fly to Hawaii  for vacation really puts a damper on my mood.

Shes being so inconsiderate.

I’m sarcastic.

Edited by Varysblackfyre321

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

35 minutes ago, Varysblackfyre321 said:

Please- As Northman has shown true Christians just use their religion to be dicks to others. Like non-heterosexuals. Jailing people  for having same-sex is a true worth while task for a true Christian.

Oh absolutely. As far as I can tell the only thing he views as central to his religion is dominionism. And those views quite clearly don't only apply to religion which is the unspoken thing behind support for inaction on stopping this problem. I don't know how many subscribe to that view but its far too many and is one of the things that poisons the conversation. They know theyre far from a majority though mostly dont actually give their honest reason.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...