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Iskaral Pust

Football: A New Hope

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I think Arsenal are the favourites to get that fourth place. Their defence still looks dodgy but Pepe bolsters their attack and Ceballos beefs up the midfield although he's not a Ramsey replacement. They also have the managerial advantage - a second season with Emery who is a better manager than both Solskjaer and Lampard. 

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4 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

I'd also be looking at Wolves, Leicester and Everton this year. If they have a good year and improve then they are certainly on the same level as Chelsea, Arsenal and United are at right now. 

I think Leicester are the most likely to be able to break into the top 6 this season (I wouldn't discount West Ham either). I'm not sure about Everton. I think that defensively they are worse off and defending was a big problem for them last season as well. It also still remains to be seen how Wolves cope with the EL - they were very fortunate with injuries last season and Santo was able to name basically the same starting XI week-in and week-out. These teams tend to struggle in the league when they have European fixtures to contend with - we've seen that with Leicester, Everton, West Ham, Burnley and Southampton in recent seasons.

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21 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

I think Leicester are the most likely to be able to break into the top 6 this season (I wouldn't discount West Ham either). I'm not sure about Everton. I think that defensively they are worse off and defending was a big problem for them last season as well. It also still remains to be seen how Wolves cope with the EL - they were very fortunate with injuries last season and Santo was able to name basically the same starting XI week-in and week-out. These teams tend to struggle in the league when they have European fixtures to contend with - we've seen that with Leicester, Everton, West Ham, Burnley and Southampton in recent seasons.

Yeah agree with all that. Everton have had a decent window but probably need a couple more players, especially up front, Kean and Calvert Lewin won't be enough I suspect. 

On paper though it doesn't feel like those teams are too far behind. Looking at the line ups for Chelsea v Utd this weekend it was kind of shocking.

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2 hours ago, Mark Antony said:

Lovren to Roma close to done. Mignolet, Moreno, and Lovren gone in one summer. End of the banter era

And with Sturridge going too, it also means we’re no longer paying big wages to four players who offer very little to the team. 

But Lovren’s departure means we would be down to just three CBs, two of whom have been injury prone (as has Lovren himself).  Does that mean Hoever is now a fourth-choice CB?  And it makes it much harder to use Gomez as an alternate RB. 

Now we only have depth in MF and instead look thin at every other position.

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Chris Bascombe @_ChrisBascombe
Sadio Mane asked if he is fit to start…
“I am ready. Tiredness is in the head. I have not had a holiday for seven years! Let’s do it.”

Love this guy! :) Hope he smashes a couple past Chelsea tomorrow.

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Kieta man....is he made of cotton FFS?

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@MaddockMirror
He walked off with a physio and went straight down the tunnel, which suggests it's not the best news, and could be an injury recurrence.

 

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3 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

And with Sturridge going too, it also means we’re no longer paying big wages to four players who offer very little to the team. 

But Lovren’s departure means we would be down to just three CBs, two of whom have been injury prone (as has Lovren himself).  Does that mean Hoever is now a fourth-choice CB?  And it makes it much harder to use Gomez as an alternate RB. 

Now we only have depth in MF and instead look thin at every other position.

Bit harsh on Lovren. He was the weakest of the four Liverpool CBs footballing wise, but he was still a solid (albeit limited) defender. He is not that old and a Croatian international, so he presumably also had higher aspirations than being the 4th choice centerback at Liverpool. And yes, I assume that spot is now open for one of the Liverpool youngsters. Might be Hoever, might also be that other Dutch kid you signed this year, the ginger, too lazy to do an internet search for the name.

Anyway in non EPL news. With the Sane injury now having effectively put an end to the transfer saga Bayern have now signed Perisic on loan (talking about an underwhelming window for top clubs), and they are also now linked to a Coutinho loan (+ option to buy). Rumoredly Barca will not demand a fee for the loan as in, they want to get the high wages off the books for next season.

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1 hour ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Bit harsh on Lovren. He was the weakest of the four Liverpool CBs footballing wise, but he was still a solid (albeit limited) defender. He is not that old and a Croatian international, so he presumably also had higher aspirations than being the 4th choice centerback at Liverpool. And yes, I assume that spot is now open for one of the Liverpool youngsters. Might be Hoever, might also be that other Dutch kid you signed this year, the ginger, too lazy to do an internet search for the name.

I don't think that I was harsh.  He's the best 4th-choice CB in the league, but probably one of the highest paid (would Mangala or Jones earn more?).  He's a long way behind Gomez or Matip, and last time we actually needed him he managed to pick up an injury of his own and instead we had Hoever and Fabinho fill in at CB.  He has a terrible history of many small injuries each season; someone quoted a statistic that he's never made more than six consecutive appearances for Liverpool, even when he was the first choice CB.

He's a decent player who has been overtaken by the improvements in the squad.  I would not begrudge him a move for first team football, even though it weakens our squad to let him go.  The fact that we're getting bids of only 15m shows you that he isn't esteemed all that highly in general.  

I'd prefer that the move doesn't go through and he stays another year while Hoever and Sepp Van Den Berg continue to develop.  But if he does go, it does at least mean the club is getting better value for their wage bill.  

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14 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

I don't think that I was harsh.  He's the best 4th-choice CB in the league, but probably one of the highest paid (would Mangala or Jones earn more?).  He's a long way behind Gomez or Matip, and last time we actually needed him he managed to pick up an injury of his own and instead we had Hoever and Fabinho fill in at CB.  He has a terrible history of many small injuries each season; someone quoted a statistic that he's never made more than six consecutive appearances for Liverpool, even when he was the first choice CB.

He's a decent player who has been overtaken by the improvements in the squad.  I would not begrudge him a move for first team football, even though it weakens our squad to let him go.  The fact that we're getting bids of only 15m shows you that he isn't esteemed all that highly in general.  

I'd prefer that the move doesn't go through and he stays another year while Hoever and Sepp Van Den Berg continue to develop.  But if he does go, it does at least mean the club is getting better value for their wage bill.  

Yes, what I meant is, to put him in the same category as Moreno or Sturridge is not really doing him justice. I mean he managed to be a starter and a quite important piece during Klopp's restructuring process. He was only really phased out last season, with Gomez showing why he is so highly rated, and Matip (hopefully) finally putting his injuries past him as better partners for Van Dijk.

15m is not bad price outside the EPL. But generally speaking yes, he is now a hihgly paid fourth choice CB and it's better for both parties that the cooperation ended on seemingly friendly terms. Remember his first CB partner under Klopp? Sakho was throwing a tantrum and apparently a disruptive influence on the squad.  And I recall some scousers voicing more regrets over his depature. Not meant as a dig or something, just a general observation, and why I think the commenting was a bit harsh on him.

Well, that's basically a question of how far Hoever and Van Den Berg are in their development. If you don't trust them to play a handful of games, then why bother with a youth set up at all? Lorven did not carry a huge gameload last season. Presumably Hoever and Van Den Berg have enjoyed quite a good footballing training in the Netherlands, so they are presumably better fits for the way Liverpool wants its defenders to play. And it will really not be 20+ games they'd get.

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Super Cup team news: Confirmed Liverpool line-up v Chelsea

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Sadio Mane and Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain start for Liverpool in this evening’s Super Cup tie with Chelsea in Istanbul.The pair are two of five changes made by Jürgen Klopp for the encounter at Besiktas Park, joining Mohamed Salah in attack.

Elsewhere, Adrian replaces the injured Alisson Becker in goal, while Joel Matip and James Milner come into the line-up.

Naby Keita is ruled out with a muscle strain.

Liverpool: Adrian, Gomez, Matip, Van Dijk, Robertson, Fabinho, Milner, Henderson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Mane, Salah.

Subs: Lonergan, Kelleher, Wijnaldum, Firmino, Lallana, Shaqiri, Brewster, Origi, Hoever, Alexander-Arnold, Elliott.

 

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As much as anything it looks like Klopp is rotating with the fact that we have a game on Saturday in mind.

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May be the wrong attitude, but should we ever compete in such a game, my main concern would be "no injuries, please."

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Milner sloppy in possession as usual, and I know Gomez is there because of rotation but he's again not looked any stronger defensively than TAA while being useless going forward.

Henderson and Salah have looked good.

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That's been coming. Liverpool have been shite.

No midfield at all. Milner has been poor and now looks injured, and Fabinho is still playing like he's drunk.

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36 minutes ago, Rorshach said:

May be the wrong attitude, but should we ever compete in such a game, my main concern would be "no injuries, please."

same

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Liverpool are having real trouble with Chelsea in midfield. Fabinho and Milner not having great games doesn't help but I think the lack of Alisson's quality on the ball at the back is showing too, it gives the opposition one less player the need to cover when they're pressing high.

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I'm not sure if Liverpool are pressing as well as they can, but I am impressed by the short one-touch game Chelsea are playing in midfield.

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Gomez gets left for dead for Chelsea's offside second.

The biggest issue with favouring workhorses in midfield and relying on your full backs for creativity is that, when you drop your most creative full back, you reduce your attacking threat by half.

I think I'd rather see Hoever get a few games at RB if Klopp feels TAA needs a break, and Gomez kept for centre back.

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