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Star Wars: The Circle is Almost Complete


Myrddin

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n order to say that the new movies being dumb as a pile of bricks, completely falling apart at the seams when the audience applies the tiniest bit of scrutiny to them, is somehow okay because the old movies were not perfect either. That's some very twisted logic right there.

yeah, they can both suck independently.  

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My initial thoughts on this were that once you get through the first half hour and realise that this is a sequel to JJ Abrams' episode 8 and not a sequel to the Rian Johnson episode 8 that the rest of the world actually saw, it's actually a fun movie. Just go in expecting "a Star Wars movie" and accept that the plot isn't what Star Wars is about, and you won't be disappointed.

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5 hours ago, YoungGriff89 said:

I don’t get why people seem to think this is a dig at the last movie.  People wanted an explanation for why they couldn’t do this every time and here it is.  There are so many moments where they refer back to the last movie I didn’t get the vibe that they were trying to undo it at all.  

Between this bit, Luke yelling "I WAS WRONG!", Rose being turned into an extra and Ren turning out to have been lying about Rey's parents, I think it's pretty clear that they were trying to undo a lot of things from the last movie.

The director and actors also publicly saying they were trying to change things laid down in the last movie was kind of a hint at that as well.

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2 hours ago, Werthead said:

Between this bit, Luke yelling "I WAS WRONG!", Rose being turned into an extra and Ren turning out to have been lying about Rey's parents, I think it's pretty clear that they were trying to undo a lot of things from the last movie.

The director and actors also publicly saying they were trying to change things laid down in the last movie was kind of a hint at that as well.

Well as far as Luke realizing he was wrong, that was kind of already the point of him facing Ben on Crait in the last film so it’s not really JJ undoing anything rather than just unnecessarily screaming it for people incapable of comprehending anything that isn’t dialogue.  Rose was still in the movie and now leading in the Resistance.  I would think if someone truly wanted to undo the last movie they would have just left her out entirely.  I actually think JJ leaned into the Last Jedi more than he tried to undo it, but the one area where I really disagree with him was going back to the debate about Rey’s lineage.  We got the answer in TLJ, he should have let it go.  The ending to TROS is actually much better without her shirking one important lineage and claiming another.
 

Spoiler

Plus, with the whole “Force Dyad” thing, Rey also being someone important’s descendent is redundant.

 

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At this point I'd love a Palpatine CGI series or movie that covered key moments from the movies and canon shows. With flashbacks shedding light on his early life, motivation and apprenticeship as a sith. Somewhere in there they can explain

his son. Could he possibly have been a son like Boba was to Jango?

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On 12/19/2019 at 9:00 PM, Ran said:

. I feel like a lot of the critics who are lambasting it secretly just embraced Johnson's new vision and are now bitter that Abrams wrested it back because, I don't know, a great deal of jaded cynicism on the one hand and the real problems it gives for this trilogy as a whole.

Hmm - I don't know. I think it is less the direction JJ took it in but equally the execution. I think people, including critics,  would be receptive to the new direction if the execution on JJ's part would have been better, but unfortunately the execution of the ideas that this movie has is so sloppy that even if you're okay with being led down a different direction than TLJ, you're disappointed by the sloppy & rushed writing & the terrible pacing.

From the reviews I've read, especially the ones that are not fond of the movie, they are as much about the poor execution, pacing & writing of the movie as they are about the direction JJ chose to go ( I know they are not *completely* mutually exclusive)

I think JJ coming to this late *really* didn't help but the more time I have with this movie the more I agree with Relic & Werthead's posts.

Edit: Maybe my expectations were too high - I went into the movie having watched none of the trailers or knowing the reaction to the movie so I went in expecting it to be good, if not very good.

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Thoroughly terrible. The only positives I can think of are that it had a few pretty shots (most of which have been seen in the trailers) and that it was so bad that it will give fan-fiction writers the world over a jolt of confidence. I promise, whoever you are out there, that Sailor Moon/Buffy the Vampire Slayer crossover erotica you've been too ashamed to admit to writing is at least as good as this movie, and probably better. And these guys got paid to write. Go you!

Now that the sequel trilogy is finished, my ultimate review is this: Star Wars was a better franchise before it was made. I can think of no worse condemnation than that.

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People wanted an explanation for why they couldn’t do this every time and here it is.  

saying it is 'one in a million' is among the highest praise in the star wars setting--

Quote

Great shot kid, that was one in a million.

this does not throw dern and johnson under the bus, but rather by contrast pays respect to them while removing the maneuver from the standard repertoire of military tactics.

suggestions that isaac's comment is a 'retcon' or a correction or a mockery or a disagreement is accordingly a severely unwarranted interpretation. persons who contend this unwarranted interpretation are advised to watch all the films again before they revise and resubmit their comments.

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41 minutes ago, sologdin said:

suggestions that isaac's comment is a 'retcon' or a correction or a mockery or a disagreement is accordingly a severely unwarranted interpretation. persons who contend this unwarranted interpretation are advised to watch all the films again before they revise and resubmit their comments.

I think this is true. I don't exactly get why it's one in a million, but if Poe says it, I guess it's true, and am glad of it. Though I'd still think, at least, that if someone came up with a deathstar-sized weapon again, the odds of hitting it with a carefully timed hyperspace jump would be much higher...

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On 12/19/2019 at 8:30 AM, Ran said:

I come not to bury The Rise of Skywalker, but to praise it.

Yes, it has a messed up, sloppy, exposition-heavy first act. It really does. The way it clearly backtracks from Rian Johnson's vision of what the end of the Skywalker Saga should look like is awkward and distracting. I feel like a lot of the critics who are lambasting it secretly just embraced Johnson's new vision and are now bitter that Abrams wrested it back because, I don't know, a great deal of jaded cynicism on the one hand and the real problems it gives for this trilogy as a whole.

At the end, for me, it delivers the wonder and catharsis that the original trilogy gave me when I was a kid. The last forty minutes felt like Star Wars to me. in a way that I haven't felt other than in fleeting moments in the previous two films, and (yes, I'll say it) with Rogue One, the only other film of the new bunch that really made me feel transported to that galaxy far, far away.

I was dewy-eyed for a lot of its moments, I have to say.

Also, Adam Driver is bloody amazing and in all honesty I'm not sure how well these films would have worked if someone else had had the part.

More detailed, spoilery thoughts later after I ponder more.

I loved it too. The hate is mind boggling to me, but that's where we are nowadays. At times, the movie felt like what I wanted Return of the Jedi to be. It captured all those big moments beautifully, and I really loved Rey's story. I found her compelling and interesting, but I think you're spot on about Driver, he really nailed it in all three movies. I think of him as what Anakin should have/could have been. Actually, it's like the writers thought, "Let's make a likable whiny emo boy." Anyway, good stuff, and I'm really happy with the new trilogy. It erased the monstrosity of the prequels from my mind.

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I would recommend against seeing this film. You won't listen. I understand, I wouldn't listen either. I walked gaily into the realm of despair. I don't regret it myself, but I regret it for the sake of people who were less desensitized. Go then, and look upon the ruin yourself if you must.

Have you ever woken up in a cold sweat, weeping like a child and hoping that you'd dreamed the entire previous day's events?

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