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Alyn Oakenfist

Dany's three betrayals

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So what are the three betrayals? My personal theory is that the one for blood was Mirri, the one for gold will be Faegon claiming Viserion (cause Viserion has gold in his colors and will likely be helped by Varys dooing some turn-cloaking) and the third will be Jon Snow killing her to get Lightbringer. What are your theories?

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1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

So what are the three betrayals? My personal theory is that the one for blood was Mirri, the one for gold will be Faegon claiming Viserion (cause Viserion has gold in his colors and will likely be helped by Varys dooing some turn-cloaking) and the third will be Jon Snow killing her to get Lightbringer. What are your theories?

I disagree with the your second and third.  The first was Mirri Maz Duur.  No question there.  The second was Jorah, he betrayed on behalf of the Lannisters for a ticket home.  Lannisters = gold.  The second is less sure, but only because Jorah has not been executed.  The betrayals are tied to treason, but they also result in executions of the betrayer.  So the fact that Jorah has not been executed leaves a little bit of room for the second betrayal to be something else.  A smaller chance is Aegon usurping the throne, which is hers by right.  He will get executed for this act of treason.  One tiny, tiny possibility is Prince Viserys, her brother, committed treason by threatening the life of a Khaleesi and Rhaego because he was eager to start the fight for his crown.  He got executed, as you already know.  So the betrayers will all get executed, per the prophecy.  Dany is efficient though and uses the executions to perform miracles.  The third is possibly Jon, but be assured that she will execute the bastard for whatever treason he will commit.  Jon will not survive this.  It will be his third treason and will be his last.  Dany will roast his ass and god only knows that will be hatched by that flame.  Maybe the stone beast in the vision will come out of this sacrifice.

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I think they refer to the deaths of Drogo(Blood), Viserys(Gold) and Rhaego(Love). 
Giving us a partial indication of how the dragon hatching ritual worked.

Edited by Narsil4

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The word used is treasons rather than betrayals.

For blood will be Euron second lifing Drogon from her. Gold is probably Tyrion betraying her for Jaime. For love will be Dany herself glamouring as Ygritte to trick Jon into impregnating her.

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1 hour ago, Allardyce said:

I disagree with the your second and third.  The first was Mirri Maz Duur.  No question there.  The second was Jorah, he betrayed on behalf of the Lannisters for a ticket home.  Lannisters = gold.  The second is less sure, but only because Jorah has not been executed.  The betrayals are tied to treason, but they also result in executions of the betrayer.

While I don't disagree that Jorah may be the 2nd betrayal I do question your beliefs that the betrayals must result in executions. What makes you think that? 

1 hour ago, Allardyce said:

So the betrayers will all get executed, per the prophecy

What prophecy says they will get executed? 

1 hour ago, Allardyce said:

The third is possibly Jon, but be assured that she will execute the bastard for whatever treason he will commit.  Jon will not survive this.  It will be his third treason and will be his last.  Dany will roast his ass and god only knows that will be hatched by that flame.  Maybe the stone beast in the vision will come out of this sacrifice

I certainly hope you aren't holding your breath for this. There is essentially no evidence that any of this will happen & is much more likely Jon will kill Daenerys. 

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1 hour ago, chrisdaw said:

The word used is treasons rather than betrayals.

For blood will be Euron second lifing Drogon from her. Gold is probably Tyrion betraying her for Jaime. For love will be Dany herself glamouring as Ygritte to trick Jon into impregnating her.

But how would the bolded be a treason against Dany? 

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56 minutes ago, Lyanna<3Rhaegar said:

But how would the bolded be a treason against Dany? 

It isn't against her, the wording in the text is three treasons she will know, it'll be one she commits.

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2 hours ago, chrisdaw said:

It isn't against her, the wording in the text is three treasons she will know, it'll be one she commits.

This may be the definition of Treason that GRRM intends for us to use. 

Quote
HISTORICAL
the crime of murdering someone to whom the murderer owed allegiance, such as a master or husband.

So Dany's actions which lead to Drogo's death might be considered treason.

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5 hours ago, Narsil4 said:

I think they refer to the deaths of Drogo(Blood), Viserys(Gold) and Rhaego(Love). 
Giving us a partial indication of how the dragon hatching ritual worked.

Well, I kinds believa Glidus's theory on this, ie Rhaego's death paid for Rhagar's life, Viserys's for Viserion, Drogo's death for Drogon, the horses death paid for Drogon's vegetative state and Mirri's death paid for Dany's survival in the flames.

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Yea, that's similar to my own thoughts on it. 

These being the 3 Heads...  
Drogo/Drogon = Life/Bed/Blood
Viserys/Viserion = Death/Dread/Gold
Rhaego/Rhaegal = Love/Love/Love

With MMD being symbolic of the Tail(Red Comet). 
Perhaps her soul being split between all 3 eggs to finalize the hatching. 

Dany may have represented the White(Fire) moon during the ritual. 
Allowing her to survive the flames. 

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1. Treason for blood is MMD.

2. Treason for gold is Jorah.

3. I am divided about that. I think it is either Tyrion who frees Jaime (who has been captured by Daenerys) or Jon who kills Daenerys because she goes mad.

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Like almost every prophesy, vision or otherwise obvious piece of foreshadowing the 3 treasons have not happened yet. The purpose of such things is to create wonder at the possibilities, hype their coming and overwhelm us with awe and excitement in the delivery. Having them already happen before hand or in close proximity to being described nullifies their whole purpose.

The goal here is that when each happens its completely fucking epic and we all pour through the pages thinking holy shit its happening.

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I'll stick my neck out and suggest that the "treason for love" is Tyrion killing her, out of sexual jealousy.

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13 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

So what are the three betrayals? My personal theory is that the one for blood was Mirri, the one for gold will be Faegon claiming Viserion (cause Viserion has gold in his colors and will likely be helped by Varys dooing some turn-cloaking) and the third will be Jon Snow killing her to get Lightbringer. What are your theories?

Quote

 

"three fires must you light . . . one for life and one for death and one to love . . . Her own heart was beating in unison to the one that floated before her, blue and corrupt . . . three mounts must you ride . . . one to bed and one to dread and one to love . . . The voices were growing louder, she realized, and it seemed her heart was slowing, and even her breath. . . . three treasons will you know . . . once for blood and once for gold and once for love . . ."

...

. . help her . . . the whispers mocked. . . . show her . . .

...

Then phantoms shivered through the murk, images in indigo. Viserys screamed as the molten gold ran down his cheeks and filled his mouth. A tall lord with copper skin and silver-gold hair stood beneath the banner of a fiery stallion, a burning city behind him. Rubies flew like drops of blood from the chest of a dying prince, and he sank to his knees in the water and with his last breath murmured a woman's name. . . . mother of dragons, daughter of death . . .

 

My interpretation:

I may not be a native speaker but that "three treasons will you know" sounds to me like she will learn about three treasons, not that she will experience them. It makes some narrative sense as Dany is somewhat obsessed with the treasons and not with the other visions.

Second, the following visions explain (help her, show her) the three fires, three mounts and three deaths. In particular the quoted paragraph match better (imho) with the treasons than with the fires and mounts.

Of course as the whispers mocked things are tricky

the Rhaego visions is probably related to the treason for blood that Mirri committed. Rhaegar dying with Lyanna's name in his lips must be the treason for love and Viserys must be the treason for gold (for a crown).

As you see, all these treasons already happened and contributed to shape Daenerys as the daughter of death.

Edited by rotting sea cow

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Occam's razor, Dany has been rising for too long and these will seriously fuck her up. I think they refer to treason against her, where the people who swear fealty to her betray her somehow. Jon for blood (betrays her for his Stark family, betrays his own Targaryen blood, and blood implies he kills her), Varys for love of the people (he keeps talking about that. But this one could also be family love for Jon), and Tyrion for Jaime or Cersei ("gold" metaphors are all over them). 

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39 minutes ago, Rose of Red Lake said:

Occam's razor, Dany has been rising for too long and these will seriously fuck her up. I think they refer to treason against her, where the people who swear fealty to her betray her somehow. Jon for blood (betrays her for his Stark family, betrays his own Targaryen blood, and blood implies he kills her), Varys for love of the people (he keeps talking about that. But this one could also be family love for Jon), and Tyrion for Jaime or Cersei ("gold" metaphors are all over them). 

Well someone, Mirri, already fucked her up. So that's why I think she was the betrayal for blood. Now we know that there will be a second dance of dragons. One option would be Euron v Dany. However I personally don't think that will be the case, I think Euron will have something more akin to a kraken. The Dragonhorn subplot only serves I think to bring the Dragonhorn into Dany's possession to be stolen in the second betrayal, the one for gold (Viserion has golden scales). So I think someone, either Tyrion or Varys will betray her giving the horn to Faegon, who will use it to tame Viserion. As for the last I think it will be Jon killing her, because of his love for her, in order to obtain Lightbringer.

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Treason for blood is Rhaego's kidnapping by his Dothraki-relatives, by his father's ex-ko Pono. Rhaego is Drogo's son and Pono is blood of Drogo's blood, so he took that "blood", the baby.

Majority of readers think that Rhaego is dead, and that supposedly his life payd for one of Dany's dragons. I am absolutely sure that both of those assumptions are incorrect and that Rhaego is definitely alive. Just because majority think otherwise, doesn't mean that they are right.

The treason for gold is Dany's second husband, Hizdahr, betraying/selling her to Yunkaii for their gold. Or the chief-traitor is Galazza Galare, the Green Grace, who seems to be the Harpy. The Sons of the Harpy is the slavers of Meereen, and her "daughters" are the Graces. So even if the nominal traitor is Hizdahr, nevertheless Galazza Galare was also taking part in that treason.

The third traitor is either Tyrion or Barristan Selmy. Tyrion in the future can betray Dany for the love/acceptance/acknowledgement from his family. And concerning Barristan - I suspect that he is a dragonseed, furthermore a Blackfyre dragonseed. And because it seems that fAegon/Young Griff, who is the mummer's dragon, is a Blackfyre, and I don't think that he is Illyrio's child (that would have been too simple), which means that fAegon's father is someone else, so for now I think that fAegon's father is Barristan, who is a hidden Blackfyre (most likely he is a grandson of Aenys Blackfyre). My guess is that the mother is Lady Jeyne Swann, who is known to readers as septa Lemore. <- Those are my speculations and assumptions, not facts.

Thus, if my theory about Barristan, Jeyne/Lemore and fAegon is correct, then in the future, when Barristan will meet Jeyne, and will find out that fAegon is his son, then it's likely that he will betray Dany, for the sake of his old love (Jeyne) or for his son (fAegon).

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19 hours ago, Allardyce said:

The second was Jorah, he betrayed on behalf of the Lannisters for a ticket home.  Lannisters = gold. 

Jorah betrayed Dany on behalf of the Baratheons, through Varys. The connection with gold is not that clear.

 

18 hours ago, Narsil4 said:

I think they refer to the deaths of Drogo(Blood), Viserys(Gold) and Rhaego(Love).

But then, what would be it be called "treason for"? Neither Viserys nor Rhaego betrayed anyone.

 

I've always thought that the three triads have to be interpreted together, and refer to three different events. The first one seems to be easily identifiable. I think most people agrees that Drogo's pyre is the fire for live, Silver is the mount to bed, and Mirri is the treason for blood. This triad refers to the first part of Dany's voyage, among the Dothraki.

So that would leave a second triad with the fire for death, the mount to dread, and the treason for gold, and a third one with the fire, mount and treason for love. I believe that the second triad will represent the conclusion of Dany's stay at Slaver's Bay, and the third one will cover the last part of her story in the Seven Kingdoms.

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I believe one treason will be Daario. Should be for gold. The last one, maybe Jorah (or someone else loving her). Killing or betraying her because she went mad in her path of Fire and Blood. Or Euron or the Red Priests did something to her and she must be stopped.

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I always felt like the treasons were going to be much larger scale like wars.

I think the treason for blood is the second siege of Meereen, where the masters are trying to win back slavery.

The treason for Gold could be her war with the Golden Company.

The treason for love is a bit early to decide, it could be a war against Jon, or it could be a war against one her own dragons.

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