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UK Politics: Spaffed up the wall while chuntering from a sedentary position


Chaircat Meow

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4 minutes ago, polishgenius said:


Fair enough didn't look closely enough at that.

No worries. I actually only found out because i went to look for a non-Daily Mail source, and all of the articles, including the DM, were the same 2013 date

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It's still relevant, unless Gove has said anything since 2013 that indicates he's genuinely changed his opinion.

It's not like "If you're poor, it's your fault" isn't a commonly and firmly held view among a segment of the political right.

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1 hour ago, The Anti-Targ said:

It's still relevant, unless Gove has said anything since 2013 that indicates he's genuinely changed his opinion.

It's not like "If you're poor, it's your fault" isn't a commonly and firmly held view among a segment of the political right.

Agreed, and nothing in Gove’s words or actions since suggest to me he holds a different position now. I just think, especially in todays media landscape, its important that news isnt presented in a misleading way.

 

(to clarify - i think the tweet was misleading, i dont think polishgenius meant to be misleading)

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2 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Agreed, and nothing in Gove’s words or actions since suggest to me he holds a different position now. I just think, especially in todays media landscape, its important that news isnt presented in a misleading way.

 

(to clarify - i think the tweet was misleading, i dont think polishgenius meant to be misleading)

Misleading is a bit of an overstatement if there is no evidence anywhere that Gove has changed his tune. Also the tweet links directly to the 2013 article. I would rather assume that people don't get the entirety of their news information solely from the text typed into a tweet and when something is linked in a tweet people will actually click on the link and check the source and not just assume Gove said this yesterday.

I understand the concern that the ethical media needs to try to be free from accusations of fake newsery. But assuming there's nothing fake news about the 2013 article this example doesn't even come close to that. Bascially, does Gove have any grounds to directly attack that tweet as misleading? Since it links the 2013 article as the source, no he doesn't.

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If we’re going to assume that Twitter users are diligent in checking sources then we might as well assume that Gove has changed his mind in the last six years.  Both things are probably not true.

6 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

I wish the right were as diligent at calling themselves out. Why do we have to be honourable?  

Smugness is its own reward. :P 

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34 minutes ago, Which Tyler said:

I've been busy, is anyone watching? Anything to report?

I haven't seen the debate, but I'm watching slack-jawed at the idiocy of the Tory Party Twitter account which changed its name to "Fact Check UK" and is now getting reported in the hundreds of thousands for fraudulently pretending to be a real fact check account. Several real fact checking organisations seem to be threatening legal action, and thousands of other people (including Charlie Brooker, who's gone to town on it) have changed their name to the same thing to drag them mercilessly.

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36 minutes ago, Which Tyler said:

I've been busy, is anyone watching? Anything to report?

Didn't watch but read commentary on twitter.

People think it was a draw - both awful. That may be to Corbyn's gain but he didn't knock it out of the park even against a confused/ignorant debater like Johnson and he needed to to turn the campaign around.

Bad. 

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3 hours ago, Heartofice said:

Most commentary I’ve seen suggests Corbyn missed his chance to hurt Johnson here. Bit of a win for Johnson really 

Corbyn's mere existence seems to be a win for Johnson. He made Boris look mildly competent by bungling his lines on Brexit (e.g. falsely stating that the DUP voted for the WAB). 

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17 hours ago, john said:

If we’re going to assume that Twitter users are diligent in checking sources then we might as well assume that Gove has changed his mind in the last six years.  Both things are probably not true.

 

If that is true, when the source is spoon fed, then there is no way we should be using twitter users as a weather vane for if something qualifies as misleading. If some tweeter complained that this particular tweet is misleading because Gove said it in 2013, the correct response is "we know dumbass, it's linked in the tweet." not "Oh sorry, will do better next time."

 

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Yeah I didn't think it would prove so contentious to say that someone posting an article and saying "X said Y" is misleading because people would assume the article is recent/current. Again, it's not the content that I think is misleading, I imagine Gove still holds those views, I'm just suggesting a little care is taken to ensure people aren't misled. 

And like it or lump it, many people Do take their news updates/news bites from social media like twitter and facebook. So I don't think it's unreasonable to call it misleading 

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20 hours ago, Heartofice said:

Most commentary I’ve seen suggests Corbyn missed his chance to hurt Johnson here. Bit of a win for Johnson really 

Johnson didn't even need to do this debate though - he could have gone for the seven way debate like Cameron did in 2015. Going one-on-one was a sort of pointless risk especially when his debate skills are so weak, so I'm not sure how he wins just because he didn't fall flat on his face. 

And The Absolute Boy did better with undecided voters. 

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15 hours ago, john said:

Having to click a link to check for a date which is not even casually mentioned in the body of the text is an odd definition of the phrase spoon fed.

If you don't care when Gove said it, then you don't need to check. But don't claim you've been mislead when the source of the information is right there in front of you.

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11 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Yeah I didn't think it would prove so contentious to say that someone posting an article and saying "X said Y" is misleading because people would assume the article is recent/current. Again, it's not the content that I think is misleading, I imagine Gove still holds those views, I'm just suggesting a little care is taken to ensure people aren't misled. 

And like it or lump it, many people Do take their news updates/news bites from social media like twitter and facebook. So I don't think it's unreasonable to call it misleading 

If people are so superficial about getting their news information when given access to the full information with a single mouse click, they have no right to claim to have been mislead.

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