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Football: foreVAR confused


Iskaral Pust

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Liverpool a little bit lucky but I can’t say I’m too fussed. That’s a big result. 

Also while I do think the Alexander-Arnold handball should have been a penalty it’s quite funny how pissed off Kompany is about it given he definitely should have a red at the Etihad last year.

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It shouldn't be a penalty though according to the new rules. I missed a bit of the first half and so didn't see Liverpool's opening goal but after having seen some replays, the ball hits D. Silva's arm first and then rebounds onto Alexander-Arnold's arm. It would have been harsh to give a penalty there and even if one was given, VAR should be overturning it  since any handball by a player on the attacking side is now an infringement. 

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13 minutes ago, Consigliere said:

It shouldn't be a penalty though according to the new rules.

Is that the case though? If it had missed Alexander-Arnold, gone to a City player and they'd scored it clearly would have been ruled out under the new rules but does a defender committing a foul in the box count as City creating a goal scoring opportunity? I'm not sure. 

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9 minutes ago, ljkeane said:

Is that the case though? If it had missed Alexander-Arnold, gone to a City player and they'd scored it clearly would have been ruled out under the new rules but does a defender committing a foul in the box count as City creating a goal scoring opportunity? I'm not sure. 

Premier League allows extra leeway for deflections though. Since the ball rebounded off Silva and then onto TAA's arm, that would be taken into account as well.

https://www.premierleague.com/news/1263332

Quote

Premier League players will be allowed extra leeway when it comes to ricocheted handballs.  

It is often impossible to avoid contact with the ball if it has deflected off the body of an opponent, team-mate, or even another part of the own player. 

So a handball will not be awarded if the ball touches a player’s hand/arm directly from their own head/body/foot or the head/body/foot of another player who is close/nearby.

 

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1 minute ago, Consigliere said:

Premier League allows extra leeway for deflections though. Since the ball rebounded off Silva and then onto TAA's arm, that would be taken into account as well.

Right, but Bernardo Silva wasn't really that close to Alexander-Arnold. I think he probably could have gotten his arm out of the way if he'd really wanted to. Look, I'm not too upset it wasn't given but if I was the referee I would've given a penalty.:dunno:

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12 minutes ago, ljkeane said:

Right, but Bernardo Silva wasn't really that close to Alexander-Arnold. I think he probably could have gotten his arm out of the way if he'd really wanted to. Look, I'm not too upset it wasn't given but if I was the referee I would've given a penalty.:dunno:

It was David Silva's hand not Bernado's and D. Silva and TAA were close to each other.

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1 minute ago, Consigliere said:

It was David Silva's hand not Bernado's and D. Silva and TAA were close to each other.

How close they are is kind of subjective but it was definitely Bernardo Silva considering David Silva was on the bench and didn't get on.

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4 minutes ago, ljkeane said:

How close they are is kind of subjective but it was definitely Bernardo Silva considering David Silva was on the bench and didn't get on.

Yeah, it was B. Silva. My mistake. Proximity will be subjective but I still think it would have been harsh to award a penalty there given the leeway the EPL has granted for deflections. 

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Yeah, on a slow motion replay it looks bad and you'd say penalty but in real-time it all happens in a split second and the two players were close enough so I think it's unreasonable to expect TAA to have been able to get his arm out of the way in that situation. 

If a penalty was awarded then I still feel that VAR should be overturning it since the ball did deflect off Silva's arm and City would be gaining an advantage because of that deflection. However I doubt that that would happen in this hypothetical scenario since the VAR has tended to stick with the on field refs decision in the vast majority of cases.

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18 hours ago, Iskaral Pust said:

.........

Edit: and Bernardo Silva’s hand/arm contact with the ball immediately before TAA means a penalty is impossible there.  Under the new rule, an attacker cannot benefit from even an accidental handball.   Even if you want to claim that Bernardo’s contact was accidental but TAA’s not.

 

15 hours ago, Consigliere said:

It shouldn't be a penalty though according to the new rules. I missed a bit of the first half and so didn't see Liverpool's opening goal but after having seen some replays, the ball hits D. Silva's arm first and then rebounds onto Alexander-Arnold's arm. It would have been harsh to give a penalty there and even if one was given, VAR should be overturning it  since any handball by a player on the attacking side is now an infringement. 

Yeah, this seems crystal clear to me. An attacking player can’t get an advantage from it hitting your arm. It clearly hit Silva’s arm. Why is this even a debate?

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18 hours ago, lmanion said:

Henderson has improved heaps the last few games, we looked lost because we replaced him with Milner who just is a step off the pace now in these bigger games. Should have been ox on instead.

Henderson was very good on Sunday but his prior few appearances weren’t great, even though he had some good games back in September.  Gini also had a good game after a few not-so-great showings.  Salah too.  Nice that they could lift their game for the big clash, but hopefully they can bring that focus more consistently. 

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