Watch, Watched, Watching: Those aren't pillows!

[aceluby]

18 hours ago, Zorral said:

Tangled, multiple time lines seem to have become, if not The Thing, A Thing, for screen works these days.  In the 2019 I've see these: True Detective, season 3; Tolkien, the film; The Watchmen; Little Women, the film, and The Witcher; and then Dracula, 2020.  Surely there are others, that I saw and don't remember and others that others watched and I did not see.

Not to mention the evidently increasing number of shows that like to start with a fraught scene, like Succession, and then throw up on the screen, a version of "Three days earlier ...." to then provide the context for this scene, which by the time it's all figured out we've forgotten entirely.

 

 

I feel like this really started with True Detective S1, but got super popular after the success of Westworld S1.  Even Westworld S2 did a gimmicky job of trying to emulate itself in this regard.

[Annara Snow]

21 hours ago, polishgenius said:

I haven't seen Knives Out yet- this weekend, probably- but Parasite is different is that it isn't an outsider looking in exploring the issues it brings up, if I understand what Knives Out's ultimate themes are correctly.

If anything, it's the opposite.

Knives Out mostly focuses on (largely) negative/mocking portrayal of rich  white Americans (even if the main character is an immigrant), and Rian Johnson admits it's the same class he belongs to, so it's very much a case of an insider looking in and showing what he knows.

Parasite has both clueless rich yuppie South Koreans and impoverished South Koreans willing to go anything to get out of their situation,but it's the latter who are the protagonists  and more focused on. I don't know if Bong Koon Ho has ever experienced poverty, but he certainly hasn't been experiencing it in a long time.

The main differences between the two, however, is that the former is ultimately optimistic, while the latter is not and proves to be much darker; and that Parasite is more morally ambiguous in its class portrayal, because the poor people , well, aren't exactly nice (but the point is that they can't afford to). 

Their ultimate messages are quite different -

Spoiler

 Knives Out believes that good people can triumph exactly because of their goodness (and makes a point of it, while the latter doesn't seem to believe that  anyone can be good  in the circumstances of extreme class differences, and everyone loses, no one triumphs.

 

[Raja]

3 hours ago, Annara Snow said:

 so it's very much a case of an insider looking in and showing what he knows.

Sure. But he's certainly an outsider when it comes to the immigrant side of the story ( and you can tell) and sure, for some people the mocking of rich white Americans & generational wealth is the focus of the movie and I agree with *some* of that, but when the back third about the immigrant experience is done so poorly then to me it sort of takes the shine off the movie & the message as the back third makes it painfully obvious that Johnson is an outsider who hasn't *really* thought through the depictions of immigrants in his movie.

But, ymmv.

 

[Heartofice]

Meh; the mocking of rich white folk IS the main focus of the story, there’s no ‘might’ about it.

Its a really good movie. 

[Raja]

7 hours ago, Nictarion said:

Most nerve wracking film I’ve seen in years. 

Man, I won't get to watch this movie for ages

[Ramsay B.]

HBO is in talks with Bong Joon Ho to do a Parasite limited series. I guess it was inevitable given how critically acclaimed it is, and rightfully so. But I’m not very excited about it. Just let it be. Although I guess it’s a positive HBO got it, if anyone. 

@Nictarion You watch The Lighthouse yet?

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

On 1/9/2020 at 10:07 AM, Raja said:

Hmm - will keep a look out about this re: Parasite. Knives Out's exploration of social and political issues felt quite clunky to me & as a person of colour and an immigrant I had *lots* of issues with it  ( if I'm being charitable), but I'm curious to see how Parasite deals with that.

Wasn't the point of it to be clunky? I'm clearly missing your perspective, but I thought the point was to emphasis how poorly the white family behaved towards Marta and how they had no comprehension how their actions affected her while also trying to humanize her. I did a quick Google search and thought this article was a decent point, counter point about some of the problematic things in the movie. The line that jumped out at me was the use of humor at really inappropriate times, causing people to laugh at something that many Latinos and immigrants in general are terrified of.

[john]

That was a good article. I was definitely surprised when Knives Out really went in on perspectives about immigration in the US right now. I was expecting them to deal with it in a more roundabout, generalised way.

I’d be interested if @Raja wants to elaborate on how they dealt with it poorly in the back third.

From my limited perspective 

Spoiler

I thought the use of an immigration status as a motivating factor was cleverly done. I couldn’t imagine doing what Marta did but then I couldn’t imagine what it’s like to have that hanging over you either.

On the other hand, I thought how it ended up was odd. Like, if you just have enough money undocumented status doesn’t matter. I guess that was the point, a bit of satire. But I’m pretty sure as an immigrant the fear wouldn’t disappear just cos you got rich.

 

[Annara Snow]

33 minutes ago, john said:

That was a good article. I was definitely surprised when Knives Out really went in on perspectives about immigration in the US right now. I was expecting them to deal with it in a more roundabout, generalised way.

I’d be interested if @Raja wants to elaborate on how they dealt with it poorly in the back third.

From my limited perspective 

  Hide contents

I thought the use of an immigration status as a motivating factor was cleverly done. I couldn’t imagine doing what Marta did but then I couldn’t imagine what it’s like to have that hanging over you either.

On the other hand, I thought how it ended up was odd. Like, if you just have enough money undocumented status doesn’t matter. I guess that was the point, a bit of satire. But I’m pretty sure as an immigrant the fear wouldn’t disappear just cos you got rich.

Spoiler

 

That's exactly what Marta pointed out to Walt when she started his patronizing speech about how the family will be able to help her with her mother's undocumented status, with their money. She replied that she now had that money and could do it herself.

But she was going to lose all that money and property if she was found to have caused Harlan's death., even accidentally and even in a private lawsuit. And she thought she had (while Walt didn't know that). That was what the whole premise of the movie and the whole reason why Ransom planned the whole thing. If she had actually given him an overdose of morphine and the lab results showed that, it would be hard even for the best lawyers to beat that. And don't forget that Linda was still rich on her own and would have also hired the best lawyers if it came to that. 

 

 

 

[Zorral]

10 hours ago, aceluby said:

I feel like this really started with True Detective S1, but got super popular after the success of Westworld S1.  Even Westworld S2 did a gimmicky job of trying to emulate itself in this regard.

Ah.  I haven't watched Westworld, and probably never will.  Even the descriptions here said it was over the top, the degradation and violence, particularly that of which women were objects.

Though, at least in True Detective, time switches seemed to be functional, at least past and present, due to what the show was doing?

[RumHam]

12 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Ah.  I haven't watched Westworld, and probably never will.  Even the descriptions here said it was over the top, the degradation and violence, particularly that of which women were objects.

I don't want to get to spoilery, but if you're never gonna watch it:

 

I mean it's a show about sentient objects who are enslaved primarily for service, sex and death and finally rebel against their human  masters

[Zorral]

7 minutes ago, RumHam said:

I don't want to get to spoilery, but if you're never gonna watch it:

 

  Hide contents

 

I mean it's a show about sentient objects who are enslaved primarily for service, sex and death and finally rebel against their human  masters

 

 

Ya, I know. But before that lots of degradation, torture and rape.  It's like those old novels and films that showed or at least provided the titillation of suggesting there was all that sex and violence, which was all justified at the end because the villain repents and / or find god. 99% sex and violence, and 1% conversion and repentance.

 

[RumHam]

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

Ya, I know. But before that lots of degradation, torture and rape.  It's like those old novels and films that showed or at least provided the titillation of suggesting there was all that sex and violence, which was all justified at the end because the villain repents and / or find god. 99% sex and violence, and 1% conversion and repentance.

 

This does not describe Westworld at all. There's one embarrassing orgy sequence in the first season. but otherwise it's fairly restrained. You shtould give the show a chance. The third season looks crazy. 

 

Rape and degradation in the park are part of the narrative.  The host robots are programmed to be robotic sex workers. Even their resistance is part of the narrative of Westworld the park. 

[drawkcabi]

3 hours ago, Triskele said:

Just recently watched Aliens and Alien 3 for the first time ever after having watched Alien just a few months ago.  Alien 3* is so much worse, and the wiki tells me that David Fincher has more or less said he doesn't even count it as a film he directed.

The depiction of the Aliens in the first two films which I'm guessing was just badass puppeteering was so much better than the utterly shit CGI or whatever the fuck that was that they tried to do in 3.  Like, they were giving up nothing with what they used in the first two films.  Holds up today remarkably well.  Why would you make that switch?  

 

*realizing this was a consensus, but it was even more of a dropoff than I expected.

Nostalgia Critic did a pretty good review, but if you are a fan of Screen Rant Pitch Meetings, the beginning is extremely funny.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBaFPl6oG5Y&t=181s

 

[williamjm]

I watched Jojo Rabbit, which I thought was good. It's trying to do something quite tricky in balancing often very silly and sometimes surreal comedy with the grim events that are happening during the film. I think the balance is perhaps not going to work for everyone, but personally I thought Taika Waititi did a good job of combining the different elements in the film. It's perhaps more of a comedy drama rather than a pure comedy, and there was more depth to it (particularly in scenes involving Jojo, Else and Jojo's mother) than I would have expected from the trailer. It did also have very funny scenes as well. I thought it had a good cast, particularly Thomasin MacKenzie and Scarlett Johnason.

[Conflicting Thought]

Watched The Lighthouse yesterday, all ready want to see it again. What a beautifully shot movie, i think it will de-thrown Parasite as my favorite movie of 2019 (maybe even decade). 

[Nictarion]

22 hours ago, Ramsay B. said:

HBO is in talks with Bong Joon Ho to do a Parasite limited series. I guess it was inevitable given how critically acclaimed it is, and rightfully so. But I’m not very excited about it. Just let it be. Although I guess it’s a positive HBO got it, if anyone. 

@Nictarion You watch The Lighthouse yet?

I did. So good. I don’t think there’s anyone doing atmospheric horror better than Eggers right now. The dialogue, acting, and score were all top notch. 

Saw 1917 last night as well. Which was also great. What a year 2019 ended up being for films. Maybe the best since 2007. 

[HexMachina]

Late to the party but started watching Sex Education. Love it so far. The banana scene at the party 

[BigFatCoward]

4 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Late to the party but started watching Sex Education. Love it so far. The banana scene at the party 

Excellent timing. Season 2 comes out this friday. I loved it, the cast was excellent. Though it's a weird location which is quite jarring at first. And definitely filmed for the american market as well, UK schools are not like that.  

[Isis]

On 1/11/2020 at 1:06 AM, Zorral said:

Ah.  I haven't watched Westworld, and probably never will.  Even the descriptions here said it was over the top, the degradation and violence, particularly that of which women were objects.

Though, at least in True Detective, time switches seemed to be functional, at least past and present, due to what the show was doing?

Just thought I should say that at the time Westworld came out it sounded to me (and looked from the trailers) like it was going to be yet another drama which used rape as a plot point and I just absolutely couldn't stand to watch another show like that at that time because I felt utterly saturated with it. So I didn't watch the show for a long while. Eventually I felt able to give it a try and it didn't meet those expectations I had for it. I thought it was very good, thought-provoking, clever, great production values etc. I would recommend you trying it but obviously it's your choice...

In other news I went to see Knives Out  and I found it really disappointing. I wish I hadn't bothered spending the money on seeing it at the cinema. 

But I watched Hail Satan last night and thought it was great.