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Nagini's Neville

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1 minute ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

People are different in how they choose to respond to trauma.  There is some agency there.  Daenerys became stronger because she is resourceful.  Drogo took advantage of her and it would be rape by our standards.  She is strong though and used an adverse situation to her advantage.  Now she is fighting the slavers to give freedom to the millions of the enslaved.

Compare this to how Arya reacted to her father's death.  Arya chose the way of darkness.  Revenge. 

You cannot chose how you react to trauma though. Usually your psyche and body decide that for you. Of course there might be some agency involved in how you cope with the results of trauma. But for something this severe you'd usually have some symptoms and psychological consequences to deal with. 

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3 minutes ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:

Being relatable has nothing to do with it.  She is a larger-than-life character.  Like a Supergirl type.  Realistic, well this is fantasy and it takes a very special person to hatch dragons from stone.  Daenerys and Bran are on a different realm than the other characters.  They have to be stronger and better disciplined.

well, I guess that than answers my question, why I don't find her relatable. Bran however is very relatable to me.

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My strange list of favorites from the ASOIF books:

1. Tyrion - Not a strange first pick I will admit. He's a complicated character who knowingly does some awful things and yet still struggles to do the "right" thing when he is able. For the first two books he's technically on the "bad guy's" team but I rooted for him anyways because in a world dominated by strong sword arms and cross bows he fights with his mind and his ax. In Clash his POV is the first REAL look at KL politics and it's never better than through his eyes.

2. Prince Oberyn Martell - He was there for a good time but not a long time. Loved every scene he was in and how his legend and the people he trained/mentored live on after him.

3. Ser Garlan Tyrell - Good guy who is also a badass. What's not to like about a guy who gives people the respect they deserve, actually seems to love his wife, and was willing to play the part of Renly's Ghost in order to gain a psychological advantage at the Battle of the Blackwater. 

4. Ser Davos Seaworth - He's an everyman who's got more common sense than many of the Lords of Westeros put together. He believes in his King and doesn't shrink from being an honest adviser.

5. Princess Arianne Martell - Insufferable at first but the reader gets to see her grow as a character and learn the subtle art of politics in Dorne as she does. 

6. Ser Jaime Lannister - You hate him in the first book. Then in the third you finally get his POV and begin to understand the man. Has a lot of flaws but also grows to realize his faults and failings and begin to correct them. Jaime's "I'm tired of idiots" mentality in AFFC is some of the best stuff in the book, at least IMHO.

7. Ser Brynden "Blackfish" Tully - He's himself and nobody else. He didn't change for his brother and he didn't change when Robb died at the Twins. He deals in Reasons You Suck speeches and while an older knight he still is a legitimate badass. 

8. Lord Bronze Yohn Royce - Doesn't take Littlefinger's crap, kicks the asses of men half his age. IDK I just like all of his appearances so far.

9. Dolorous Edd - Always saying that the worst is going to happen. Almost always correct.

10. Kevan Lannister - Tells Cersei off. Rejects power under Cersei. Was beginning to actually fix the mess his niece made when he was killed. Always in Tywin's shadow but still usually the second smartest man in any room next to his brother. Actually loves his family.

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1.  Dany - From scared and abused little girl blossoming to become the great leader that she is.

2.  Doran - The man with the plan, the real spider.

3.  Missandei - Just a prodigy or someone with telepathic abilities? I'm eager to find out. 

4.  Varys - Master of disguises, the man who knows too much.

5.  Jorah - Jorah is to Dany as Batou is to Major Kusanagi. A loyal and stalwart companion.  

6.  Tyrion - The comedy relief. A deeply flawed half of a man who has an interesting story.

7.  Theon - Right up there in complexity with Tyrion and Dany.  

8.  Ned - He's been presented as the ideal family man but that can change the more we know of the past.

9.  Daario - Clowning but dangerous.  Visceral and amoral.  The weirdo among the sell swords.

10. Barristan - Greatest living knight.  Living history.  

 

 

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9 hours ago, Nagini's Neville said:

Khal Drogo? whaaaat? haha I only got through Dany's early chapters, because someone spoiled his death for me. The whole time I was thinking "die already, die already" and was happy, when he finally did. To this day among the hardest chapters for me to reread.

I love Cersei too. I don't like her, but she is just so crazy and interesting. extremely well-written imo. Now and then I catch myself really feeling for her and understanding her and then... she has another conversation with Qyburn :ack: and I'm questioning, if reading about her insanity made me insane too 

Haha I know it's odd but... Well I'm odd. 

Same with Cersei. One second I'm feeling sympathetic to her & the next I'm thinking "you crazy b*tch!" Lol

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6 hours ago, Aline de Gavrillac said:
  1. Daenerys Targaryen.  I just love her.  She is the reason why I stuck with the books all these years despite the long wait period. Love her character, love her story.
  2. Barristan Selmy.  He is what a knight should be. 
  3. Greyworm.  The backstory of the making of an unsullied soldier is interesting and this man rose above all of that to become a leader.
  4. Khal Drogo
  5. Jorah Mormont
  6. Brienne of Tarth
  7. Skahaz Mo Kandaq
  8. Missandei
  9. Catelyn
  10. Daario Naharis

Those are my favorites in order.

Yes! Another Drogo fan ;)

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17 hours ago, Nagini's Neville said:

Who are your 10 favorite characters and why?  If there is an order, in which order? 

I don't have 10. George wouldn't be doing his job of making his readers think if I had that many.  Just about all of the characters are controversial in their own way.  The five (5) characters that I like the best are:

1)   Daenerys

2)   Jorah

3)  Tyrion

4)  Asha

5)  Aemon

Daenerys is the character through which we get the most of the fantasy elements of magic.  It doesn't hurt that she's very, very beautiful. I like my heroes good looking.  She's one of the smartest people within the story.  Jorah is a study in contradictions.  He sold peope to slavery because of money and not he serves the woman who wants to stop the slave trade.  Tyrion is the drunk who needs a worthy cause to get his head straight.  Asha is the female bad ass warrior but also she wants to take her people to a new way forward.  Aemon is the man of knowledge and wisdom.  Marwyn will take his place in the plot but he will be missed.  

 

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1. Tommen - he’s just adorable and I love all of his kittens.

2. Arya - she’s wild and adventurous, but she also has a really soft side that reminds us that she’s still a child. She’s trying to find her place in a brutal society and I’m curious about her journey.

3. Sansa - she’s a dreamer constantly surrounded by creepy men and false friends who try to corrupt her innocent and kind soul. I hope she stays true to herself.

4. Brienne - she’s basically Arya + Sansa. She’s very brave, polite and honest, but also very naïve. She’s stronger than she thinks. 

5. Asha - she’s a strong woman, she’s a free spirit, she cares about other women and their children when it’s in her power to do so and she’s the captain of her ship. She’s also the queen of dissing. At first I was neutral towards her, but re-reading her chapters made me appreciate her a lot. Not sure if she will actually get what she wants, though.

6. Theon - he’s a complex and tragic character. Sometimes he made me laugh, other times he really made me mad and in ADWD he made me cry.

7. Rodrik Harlaw - he got me at “Have you?”...

8. Bran - his storyline is unusual.

9. Hodor - Hodor!

10. Cersei - I love her evil laugh that seems to come out of nowhere and how she refuses to think that she got fat. Shame on the washerwomen!

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Some have no justification, I just like them when I read.

1° Daenerys Targaryen (I started reading the books because of her, and I find her an intriguing character, no matter how much we have her POV will always be asked what really goes on in her head, we can generate a 10 page discussion just talking about Dany)

2° Tyrion Lannister

3° Arya Stark (There is nothing to say, she is for sure the best Stark and I'm really her fanboy, If Daena was Targaryen to the bone Arya is Stark to the bone)

4° Tywin Lannister

5° Brienne Tarth (she is a unique character in history for me)

6° Sansa Stark (Sansa is far from being a very interesting character from my point of view, but I find her closest to an "average" teenager, when I read her POV I remember how I thought of my teenage years and I really root for her a lot)

7° Joffrey Baratheon (Ok, this guy was really a despicable bastard, but for the first time I jumped out of my chair when he announced Ned's murder, it was completely unexpected, Joffrey is the person we can all hate together and it was necessary for things to really start to happen)

8° Jorah Mormont (One of my problems with Martin is Jorah not having a POV)

9° Bran Stark

10° Varys

Honorable Mentions for Hound, Little Finger, Strong Belwas, Jaime, Cat, Maege Mormont, Jon, Missandei, Barristan and Jaqen H'ghar.

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8 hours ago, Nagini's Neville said:

 

In no particular order, Cersei, Arya, Daenerys, Roose Bolton, Ned, Catelyn, Jon, Tyrion, Arianne, and Melisandre.

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In no order except for the first:

  1.  Jon Snow - He's my favourite across all books.
  2.  Bran - Most interesting story and potential.
  3.  Asha - I root for her; her chapters are well-written.
  4.  Catelyn - Imo one of George's best creations.
  5.  Davos - I like his chapters and outsider status.
  6.  Arya - Interesting to read given she goes to so many places and sees so much.
  7.  Robb - Tragic character.
  8.  Stannis - Very determined and harsh, but sympathetic.
  9.  Tyrion - One of the characters that just hooks you in into the story.
  10.  Dany - Amazing development; can't wait for the rest.

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Posted (edited)

Sansa - everyone understimates her, she doesn't have power, she has to lead a double life, to learn how to see the world better, to keep the creeps at bay, to learn how to maneuver with her wits, to use political theater and soft power. At the same time she brings joy with small gestures like a kind word or a dance. She knows how to enjoy life when she can. She prays for everyone. She's not looking for a throne and doesnt like playing the game even though she's quite good at it. She's not a showy character and reminds me of Ned (another favorite). She can be a Regina George sometimes but I find it funny. I could go on...

Varys - I love his backstory. He has his faults, like constantly supporting Targaryens. However I think he's just using the name to grab the reigns of the state and steer it towards something better for the people, to make the land prosper. He's an idealist. He was born a slave. He excels at power and political theater and manages to be an enigma. He reminds me of Arya if she grew into level headedness and patience. 

Cersei - I respect how she knows she lacks morals. Its refreshing. She's not a hypocrite, she knows she's an evil bitch and doesn't care, she just wants her turn to rule. She loves and grieves for her children. I love the twist with the Faith, that readers rooting for her comeuppance have to side with misogynist religious nutjobs.

Jon - I like what a smartass he is, but he's also a dumbass. I mean that in the best possible way. He's a lovable idiot when it comes to his family, whom he'll do anything for. He makes the series less nihilistic.

Arianne - the story has so few noblewomen who are positioned to rule. Dorne is a poor, harsh region and they dont have much strength of arms, so I feel sorry for her and her people. I root for her even if she's made mistakes. I want her to carry a torch for her ancestors, whom I love.

Catelyn - the only reason I continued reading past the first few chapters. Fantasy novels never get the mother's perspective. She is a top notch political advisor. She also fooled "smart guy" Tyrion hahaha

Edited by Rose of Red Lake

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8 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Lazy answer, all PoVs except Victarion, the Damphair, and Tyrion post ASoS, plus Tormund, Mance and Stannis.

Thank you so much! I was hoping you'd post! That explains why you are such a good diplomat :D

I dislike Victarion and Damphair too

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9 minutes ago, Nagini's Neville said:

Thank you so much! I was hoping you'd post! That explains why you are such a good diplomat :D

I dislike Victarion and Damphair too

Diplomat? Me? :leaving:

Nah, really just very lazy. And I do enjoy almost all except the ones I mentioned. :)

 

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I also have a soft spot for Kraznys Mo Nakloz, and Rorge.

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22 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

Diplomat? Me? :leaving:

Nah, really just very lazy. And I do enjoy almost all except the ones I mentioned. :)

 

You of course have strong opinions :D But I've noticed you look at the characters in a differentiated way.  Maybe diplomat is the wrong word? But maybe I also agree with you a lot, but when I don't I usually do partly and or understand your reasoning. So apparently I'm just self-serving here LOL

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Nagini's Neville said:

NOOOO!!!! Rorge???? He must be tossed in the darkest of the 7 hells

Seconded. To go meet some who are already there, like Vargo Hoat, Tywin, Lorch, and w/ a few others to keep him company on his way. :D

ETA: Lorch is dead already, right?

 

Edited by kissdbyfire

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