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Lady Anna

Euron or Jon Snow?

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Reading some posts here about Jon's ressurection and how it will play out, led me back to this quote:

Sleep came hard, even when Daario came back, so drunk that he could hardly stand. Beneath her coverlets she tossed and turned, dreaming that Hizdahr was kissing her … but his lips were blue and bruised, and when he thrust himself inside her, his manhood was cold as ice. She sat up with her hair disheveled and the bedclothes atangle.

I guess most people, myself included, think this is about Euron, due to the ''blue lips'', but how does the latter fit? ''manhood was cold as ice'' - does this fit? Euron is not connected to ice or cold, at least for now (i do believe him being ‘‘crow’s eye’‘ and a possible skinchanger is important but his story is more connected to the south and Dany).

So I thought maybe the blue lips refer to Euron and the latter to someone else - Jon Snow (who is a character strongly associated with cold, ice, winter). There's a big chance Jon and Dany will meet, as per the Undying:

Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… . mother of dragons, bride of fire . . .

The underlined part also points, as I believe, to either Euron or Victarion (and the possibility of either of them and Jon becoming Dany's lovers, like Drogo - the 1st part of the quote). I actually think it's Victarion, but we know Euron is also after Dany, so her dream could be referecing that, while the Undying stick to Victarion. But, basically, I don't think Euron will be involved with Dany sexually or romantically, it's probably Victarion. So forgetting Euron, and the corpse being Victarion, we move on to the blue flower.

Jon maybe died and will come back to life. As a fire wight? I no longer think so. And this is where you guys input comes in. Some theories postulate that maybe he’ll rise up as an other or something similar. I know there’s a theory that the others arrived at the wall when Jon got stabbed, so maybe that’s what follows. Another, that the wall itself works some magic at that moment. As pointed out Jon has this dream:

Burning shafts hissed upward, trailing tongues of fire. Scarecrow brothers tumbled down, black cloaks ablaze. “Snow,” an eagle cried, as foemen scuttled up the ice like spiders. Jon was armored in black ice, but his blade burned red in his fist. As the dead men reached the top of the Wall he sent them down to die again.

‘‘armored in black ice’‘ - Maybe this means he will be some kind of ice wight, so to speak, or an other, but unlike them, with a flaming sword instead of an ice one (also I just realized this may be a way to extend his lifespan - ‘‘ice preserves’‘). So even after death and rebirth he would have blue lips and a cold body.

So basically I think ‘‘but his lips were blue and bruised, and when he thrust himself inside her, his manhood was cold as ice‘‘ may actually refer in its entirety to Jon Snow.

(Sorry if this isn't very well presented or written, my keyboard has got some problems! eating letters)

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I don't know if every dream in ASOIAF has to be prophetic or, more importantly, if every prophetic dream or vision has to come true in a literal sense. For example, in Theon's dream of the feast of the dead, Robb and Grey Wind appear wounded and covered with blood, which foreshadows their deaths, but I don't think we will read of an actual meeting between Theon and dead Robb. Another example is Dany's vision of the mummer's dragon - its meaning is obviously symbolic. At least I hope there won't be any scenes describing actual sex with a wight / corpse / literally ice-cold body in the future books. In a non-literal sense, the ice-cold manhood sounds like a symbol of a loveless and joyless relationship to me. Dany's dream may simply foreshadow a loveless, cold marriage with Hizdahr or express Dany's - justified - fear of such marriage. Of course, it may foreshadow her later relationship(s), as well, but, to me, it still seems to say more about the relationship itself than about the identity of the man. 

 

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It may refer to Jon Snow.  All memories of warmth has left his body.  Should he be resurrected it will be the white walkers who do it.  Then a dream can be just a dream and nothing more. 

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1 hour ago, Julia H. said:

I don't know if every dream in ASOIAF has to be prophetic or, more importantly, if every prophetic dream or vision has to come true in a literal sense. For example, in Theon's dream of the feast of the dead, Robb and Grey Wind appear wounded and covered with blood, which foreshadows their deaths, but I don't think we will read of an actual meeting between Theon and dead Robb. Another example is Dany's vision of the mummer's dragon - its meaning is obviously symbolic. At least I hope there won't be any scenes describing actual sex with a wight / corpse / literally ice-cold body in the future books. In a non-literal sense, the ice-cold manhood sounds like a symbol of a loveless and joyless relationship to me. Dany's dream may simply foreshadow a loveless, cold marriage with Hizdahr or express Dany's - justified - fear of such marriage. Of course, it may foreshadow her later relationship(s), as well, but, to me, it still seems to say more about the relationship itself than about the identity of the man. 

 

I agree with the bolded as well. I'm not sure if she and whoever will have literal sex, also because the way it's written is ominous and scary, but it definitely speaks of the type of relationship. Continuing on from my post, maybe it means that she and Jon will not be happy and romantic~, that is, their relationship will not be passionate, given Jon's state or the choices and sacrifices the characters will have to make.

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She sleeps with Euron, thinks it's Euron. Then later with Jon, realises it was really Jon.

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I think Victarion will be Daenerys' next true husband (Hizdahr is a farce). The dying man smiling sadly on a ship? Yep. That's Victarion. Think about his last name: Grey-Joy. Plus, with his injury, Victarion is literally dead on his feet. He's not going to survive.

Jon will be Daenerys' last husband. He's the blue rose blooming from a wall of ice. Not only are those particular roses native to Winterfell, the fact that Daenerys finds the rose beautiful and aromatic suggests that Daenerys will be madly in love with Jon. Emphasis on the term madly.

And I think that sex nightmare Daenerys had depicts Jon. I think it's not only referring to sex with Jon but it's also referring to maybe her death at Jon's hands. Jon will be something of a zombie and likely cold-blooded (in more ways than one) so his erections will hardly be typical. What's another thing that is cold and hard yet not so assuming in size? A steel dagger.

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I always read the bit about "manhood cold as ice" to infer a sort of horror at this coupling from Dany's perspective.  She's facing her first real agreement to political marriage.  Still she's taken with the sell sword.  Lots of conflict there.  She doesn't want to marry Hizdar, but she will because she sees this as her duty and a means to an end--peace in Mereen.  That's no different that Robert marrying Cersei, really.  There could well be warning in her dreams without actual prophesy.  I can't see Dany willingly sleeping with Victarion or Euron.  They are not her kind of swaggering good looking young guy willing to worship her.  They are not kings she has to compromise for.  Euron is certainly set to be important in a very murky way we cannot yet realize while Victarion is really sort of a big dumb clod.  Not to mention that her husband, Hizdar, is still very much alive.  

Dany gets small hints about Jon Snow.   She never sees his face or hears his name.  Her visions and dreams tend to be all about self realization and purpose.  A blue flower growing from the chink in a wall of ice can't possibly mean much to Dany at this point.  We don't know that Dany even knows the biggest hint that we do, Rhaegar's gift to Lyanna at Harrenhal.   Dany's blue flower in this context is small--a sort of alternative or final destination in terms of prophesy.  Barely on her radar.  Until she becomes aware of all the information we have or a dream clearly defines Jon Snow, Dany cannot know what this blue flower is.

Will Jon Snow return to normal activities unchanged?  That's doubtful.  The term "wight" denotes a lack of thinking ability and that's not where the hero of the entire story is headed.  Jon will likely find himself wanting scalding baths as Ghost when he returns.  His Targaryen traits have to come out sooner or later so why not as a consequence of these circumstances?  Perhaps it will be a subtle as his burned hand being completely restored.   Either way Jon has to not only demonstrate some of his other (fire) magical abilities, he's got to acknowledge the magical abilities he already knows he's got.  That's a long way of saying Jon's got to identify himself before anyone else can.    

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Euron is half the world away and nothing connects him to ice cold.  Jon is also distant but he got stabbed in the last book and leaked out his life's blood.  If the dream meant anything it is Jon.  The union of ice/dead with fire/living might be the ticket to peaceful coexistence with the Others.  

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Plot twist: it’s Tyrion!

Quote

"Lemore has been washing you with it. Some say it helps prevent the greyscale. I am inclined to doubt that, but there was no harm in trying. It was Lemore who forced the water from your lungs after Griff had pulled you up. You were as cold as ice, and your lips were blue. Yandry said we ought to throw you back, but the lad forbade it."

ADWD

:D

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On 1/19/2020 at 3:17 PM, Lady Anna said:

 

Sleep came hard, even when Daario came back, so drunk that he could hardly stand. Beneath her coverlets she tossed and turned, dreaming that Hizdahr was kissing her … but his lips were blue and bruised, and when he thrust himself inside her, his manhood was cold as ice. She sat up with her hair disheveled and the bedclothes atangle.

So I thought maybe the blue lips refer to Euron and the latter to someone else - Jon Snow (who is a character strongly associated with cold, ice, winter). There's a big chance Jon and Dany will meet, as per the Undying:

Her silver was trotting through the grass, to a darkling stream beneath a sea of stars. A corpse stood at the prow of a ship, eyes bright in his dead face, grey lips smiling sadly. A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness… . mother of dragons, bride of fire . . .

 

It's pretty clear that the dream is referring to a single man, I don't get why you would turn this into a threesome.  Jon's lips could be blue and bruised because of the cold and the lack of blood (due to his stabbing)

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On 1/23/2020 at 2:17 PM, ApostolinO said:

It's pretty clear that the dream is referring to a single man, I don't get why you would turn this into a threesome.  Jon's lips could be blue and bruised because of the cold and the lack of blood (due to his stabbing)

No, I agree. I was just exemplifying that both things combined point to one man - imo Jon, and don't fit Euron.

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