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Mlle. Zabzie

US Politics - Primary Numbers

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12 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

In policy news, the Pentagon is transferring just under $4b to Homeland Security for an additional 100 plus miles of wall. I guess a xenophobic vanity project is more important than defense, let alone feeding kids in schools and making sure they have books and computer labs…..

Yes?  Because he can now say that the wall was built?  Incumbency advantage ftw?

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2 hours ago, Simon Steele said:

What does Warren have to do with the post I responded to? The poster suggested that Sanders and Bloomberg had both done bad things and were old and had long histories. So why are you bringing up Warren? The point was that whatever you want to say about Sanders, he doesn't have a history of racist misogyny. Some people assume he does, I guess, but the worst you can say about him is that he might have a race blind spot (though that's debatable). 

Mean culpa, my poor reading - I missed the reference to Sanders. Apologies.

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22 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

In policy news, the Pentagon is transferring just under $4b to Homeland Security for an additional 100 plus miles of wall. I guess a xenophobic vanity project is more important than defense, let alone feeding kids in schools and making sure they have books and computer labs…..

Entitled millenial.

Next gen gets raised old school in cages.  And the only book they'll ever need or read, is The Art of the Deal. And arguably a copy of the constitution, if you choose to raise Libertarian.

Once they are twelve, they get a free NRA membership card, and two M17s (in case they lose one, you know kids).

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Just now, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Entitled millenial.

Next gen gets raised old school in cages.  And the only book they'll ever need or read, is The Art of the Deal. And arguably a copy of the constitution, if you choose to raise Libertarian.

Once they are twelve, they get a free NRA membership card, and two M17s (in case they lose one, you know kids).

I refuse to support this unless those do-nothing kids have to actually buy the ammo.  If they can't afford it, they can do a year of hard labor at the border building a wall.

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36 minutes ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

I refuse to support this unless those do-nothing kids have to actually buy the ammo.  If they can't afford it, they can do a year of hard labor at the border building a wall.

Buy the ammo? You want them to be lazy buying things?

They can make their own ammo. 

The hard labor at the wall should be mandatory for all at the age of 18 for a period of 2 years. Unless the child has a medical condition of course. Like bone spurs. 

Edited by A True Kaniggit

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47 minutes ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

I refuse to support this unless those do-nothing kids have to actually buy the ammo.  If they can't afford it, they can do a year of hard labor at the border building a wall.

What kind of savage, unprincipled monster are you? The Second Amendment also now extends to ammo, and thus has become an entitlement that triggers at birth. If you can’t pray and spray with your two government mandated M17s, what’s the point of having them?  

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Trump asserts he has a legal right to meddle in Justice Department cases.  Perhaps another rough of congressional investigations awaits?

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-claims-legal-right-to-interfere-in-justice-dept-cases/ar-BB1004nO?li=BBnbfcL&ocid=msnclassic

 

WASHINGTON — President Trump asserted Friday that he had the legal right to intervene in federal criminal cases, a day after Attorney General William P. Barr publicly rebuked him for attacks on Justice Department prosecutors and others involved in the case of Roger J. Stone Jr., the president’s longtime friend.

 

In a morning tweet, Mr. Trump quoted Mr. Barr saying that the president “has never asked me to do anything in a criminal case.” The president said he had “so far chosen” not to interfere in a criminal case even though he insisted that he is not legally bound to do so.

“This doesn’t mean that I do not have, as President, the legal right to do so, I do, but I have so far chosen not to!” he said.

 

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I'm in the camp that thinks the Stop and Frisk policy, along with his recent defence of that, show that even if Bloomberg has changed since some of those earlier comments, he really hasn't changed enough.

I think there's a real tendency to form unwarranted positive opinions of people they have familiarity with just because they maintain civility and don't exhibit any obvious bigotries even when you can look at their career history and sometimes see it.

I'm not intending to call anyone out with this, but I'm pretty sure I remember someone saying that Barr was someone with integrity based on their awareness of him through a workplace context (don't recall the exact context, just that it wasn't through regular public channels) and he's certainly not exhibiting a lot of integrity at the moment. It's perfectly understandable that this happens though, it's a natural impulse to try and see the best in people. I just think that in cases where there is a public record on their decision making, or when people make comments that functionally tell us who they are, we should believe that evidence despite their apparent civility rather than extending further benefit of the doubt.

For me Bloomberg's racist policies as mayor and continued defence of his actions and statements are that. He's not going to be throwing red meat to the racist base like Trump, but he does not view all people as equal and he's not going to be tethered to working for all people equally. He'll definitely make the presidency more presentable though.

None of which is to say don't vote for him in the election, just not in the primary.

ETA: I kinda mixed up 2 different things in this post:

1. Familiarity with someone that maintains civil and professional behavior can leave us feeling like we have a better picture of who they are and that they are good people

2. Where you have the capacity to supplement the impression of a people from 1. with their actual actions (ie what they do, not what their civility implies) you should trust their record of actions.

The comment about Barr is only referring to part 1. I don't know enough about him to know if he had a public record that would have predicted his current behavior and I'm not blaming whoever that was for having that impression of him.

I will add that there's a kind of related point 2a that was also in my head - when someone revels in both bigotry and incivility, repeatedly promises to do awful shit and follows through on attempting to do said shit, and over the course of multiple years has gone from "maybe we'll have a third term. Haha it's a joke" to just straight up suggesting multiple terms past his two legal terms while the propaganda outlet supporting him immediately jumps into justifying it with "impeachment reset the clock for him, he should have 3 terms" then maybe, just fucking maybe, believe that he intends to at least try and do what he's suggesting. It's not a joke, it was never a joke, and the individuals of a certain persuasion that come in and try to paint taking it seriously as ridiculous are doing their part in normalising the idea by dismissing concerns. They aren't acting in good faith, don't treat their arguments like they are.

Edited by karaddin

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4 hours ago, Fragile Bird said:

I heard yesterday that Bloomberg has now built an organization larger than the one Obama had when he was elected, and he hasn't even made it to a debate yet, let alone been picked

Obama didn't have billions of dollars that he gouged through information domination of the financial industries either.

To compare this campaign in any way with Obama's is an endorsement of billionaires BUYING the nomination and presidency. For one thing it mattered to Obama's campaign that I gave it donations.  I matter so little to Bloomberg's campaign he doesn't even want a donation from the likes of me.  Which one is going to be representing my interests and which one is not?

Also Bloomberg is a coward.  He's always been a gop, and now he pretends to be a dem.  He doesn't have the guts to take on the bedbug as a republican, which says a whole lot about his chances of getting the Dems out to vote for him.

Black people will not vote for him and without the black vote that's that.  Watch, read, listen to what stop and frisk really meant in the experience of black people in NYC -- particularly for black women.  Bloomberg is goddamned terrorist.  Just because he's more polite about his racism and the rest -- in public! -- doesn't change a goddamned thing.

I will NOT vote for him, no matter what.  I'll vote for my local candidates for local offices.  But I won't vote for him for POTUS.  It's the same thing we already have, just slicker.

 

 

Edited by Zorral

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27 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Obama didn't have billions of dollars that he gouged through information domination of the financial industries either.

To compare this campaign in any way with Obama's is an endorsement of billionaires BUYING the nomination and presidency. For one thing it mattered to Obama's campaign that I gave it donations.  I matter so little to Bloomberg's campaign he doesn't even want a donation from the likes of me.  Which one is going to be representing my interests and which one is not?

Also Bloomberg is a coward.  He's always been a gop, and now he pretends to be a dem.  He doesn't have the guts to take on the bedbug as a republican, which says a whole lot about his chances of getting the Dems out to vote for him.

Black people will not vote for him and without the black vote that's that.  Watch, read, listen to what stop and frisk really meant in the experience of black people in NYC -- particularly for black women.  Bloomberg is goddamned terrorist.  Just because he's more polite about his racism and the rest -- in public! -- doesn't change a goddamned thing.

I will NOT vote for him, no matter what.  I'll vote for my local candidates for local offices.  But I won't vote for him for POTUS.  It's the same thing we already have, just slicker.

 

 

No lesser of two evils thing?

Guys an asshole. But you consider him worse than Cadet Bonespurs on racism?

If it somehow comes down to that. 

Edited by A True Kaniggit

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34 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Obama didn't have billions of dollars that he gouged through information domination of the financial industries either.

To compare this campaign in any way with Obama's is an endorsement of billionaires BUYING the nomination and presidency. For one thing it mattered to Obama's campaign that I gave it donations.  I matter so little to Bloomberg's campaign he doesn't even want a donation from the likes of me.  Which one is going to be representing my interests and which one is not?

Also Bloomberg is a coward.  He's always been a gop, and now he pretends to be a dem.  He doesn't have the guts to take on the bedbug as a republican, which says a whole lot about his chances of getting the Dems out to vote for him.

Black people will not vote for him and without the black vote that's that.  Watch, read, listen to what stop and frisk really meant in the experience of black people in NYC -- particularly for black women.  Bloomberg is goddamned terrorist.  Just because he's more polite about his racism and the rest -- in public! -- doesn't change a goddamned thing.

I will NOT vote for him, no matter what.  I'll vote for my local candidates for local offices.  But I won't vote for him for POTUS.  It's the same thing we already have, just slicker.

As someone who lived in NY while Bloomberg was Mayor, it's not the same thing as Trump. I don't want him as President but I will vote for him if it means no Trump. 

Edited by Mexal

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20 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Also Bloomberg is a coward.  He's always been a gop, and now he pretends to be a dem.

Actually, he was a Democrat before switching to the Republican party in 2001 and then became an Independent in 2007 before coming back to the Democrats in 2018. I am not a fan of his, but his party affiliation (for the last two decades, at least) appears to be mostly determined by what gives him the best chance to be elected.

Also, I don't think he is a coward. He is gambling more money than 99.999%+ of the people in the world will ever see in their entire lives on a strategy that has never worked in the history of the modern primary system. That is, nobody has ever ignored all of the early states and still won (ironically, the last candidate to try was another former mayor of New York City). Granted, Bloomberg is so absurdly wealthy that the money he is spending is a relatively small fraction of his fortune, but even so, few rich people take risks with that kind of cash.

Finally, it's not clear whether people will vote for him or not -- he's currently third (behind Sanders and Biden) according to both RealClearPolitics and FiveThirtyEight.

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15 minutes ago, Altherion said:

Actually, he was a Democrat before switching to the Republican party in 2001 and then became an Independent in 2007 before coming back to the Democrats in 2018. I am not a fan of his, but his party affiliation (for the last two decades, at least) appears to be mostly determined by what gives him the best chance to be elected.

Also, I don't think he is a coward. He is gambling more money than 99.999%+ of the people in the world will ever see in their entire lives on a strategy that has never worked in the history of the modern primary system. That is, nobody has ever ignored all of the early states and still won (ironically, the last candidate to try was another former mayor of New York City). Granted, Bloomberg is so absurdly wealthy that the money he is spending is a relatively small fraction of his fortune, but even so, few rich people take risks with that kind of cash.

Finally, it's not clear whether people will vote for him or not -- he's currently third (behind Sanders and Biden) according to both RealClearPolitics and FiveThirtyEight.

Doesn't follow. Guy has so much money it doesn't matter to him if he throws a few hundred million away? 

That doesn't make him not a coward.

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1 hour ago, A True Kaniggit said:

Doesn't follow. Guy has so much money it doesn't matter to him if he throws a few hundred million away? 

That doesn't make him not a coward.

Rich people -- even absurdly rich people -- do not generally "throw away" hundreds of millions of dollars; that's part of the reason they are rich in the first place (amusingly enough, people who inherit wealth are often quite different, but Bloomberg is not one of these). It takes courage to try a strategy that has never been tried before or, to the extent that it has been tried, has never succeeded.

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2 hours ago, A True Kaniggit said:

No lesser of two evils thing?

He's not a lesser evil, he's the same evil, just smarter, slicker, richer and infinitely more effective.

As many of we Nyers put it when it comes to racism, for just one instance, with bedbug you got the Queen's verison, with Bloomy you got the Brooklyn version.  It's still virulent, vicious racism.  And black women in particular are victimized by it.  Women generally.  Gee whiz -- we start with his racism and we immediately are forced into sexist bigotry too, and the others all follow.  He's not the lesser of two evils, he's the same evil with a different face.

Edited by Zorral

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5 minutes ago, Zorral said:

He's not a lesser evil, he's the same evil, just smarter, slicker, richer and infinitely more effective.

As many of we Nyers put it when it comes to racism, for just one instance, with bedbug you got the Queen's verison, with Bloomy you got the Brooklyn version.  It's still virulent, vicious racism.  And black women in particular are victimized by it.  Women generally.  Gee whiz -- we start with his racism and we immediately are forced into sexist bigotry too, and the others all follow.  He's not the lesser of two evils, he's the same evil with a different face.

So best hope he doesn’t somehow get the nom.

Because if he does, and it’s a choice between him and Trump we’re fucked. 

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8 hours ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

 

  • Education (but I don't believe in free college for all.  I DO however believe in "Free-K" (i.e., free education starting at age 3; and honestly, I'd back a European style creche system).

 

Pardon, but I'm gonna use your post to ask a question.

So right now the norm in is the U.S. is what, K-12 right? That's 13 years of taxpayer schooling.

What is the point of these 13 years? Isn't it to get children enough education that after graduation they can join the workforce? If we are now at the point where the information included in a college degree, but not a high school one, is required for jobs with a livable wage, then why isn't that information included in these 13 years of school? If time is the factor, shouldn't it be extended to 15 years?

What the hell is the worth of 13 years of education if you can't get a decent job with it?

If that is not the case, then shouldn't the onus be on employers to quit demanding multi year degrees, that put people thousands of dollars in debt, for jobs that require 3-6 weeks of OJT?

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2 hours ago, Zorral said:

Obama didn't have billions of dollars that he gouged through information domination of the financial industries either.

To compare this campaign in any way with Obama's is an endorsement of billionaires BUYING the nomination and presidency. For one thing it mattered to Obama's campaign that I gave it donations.  I matter so little to Bloomberg's campaign he doesn't even want a donation from the likes of me.  Which one is going to be representing my interests and which one is not?

Literally, what the flying fuck are you raving about?

Bloomberg gouged billions out of the financial industry? Bloomberg had the vision to realize the financial sector had to be modernized. I was working in the technology sector when his equipment started showing up. He. Changed. Everything. He's worth $61 B and earned every cent of it. He also carved out a business providing information. Feel free to set up a competing business. All you have to do is do it better. Good luck doing that. And he didn't inherit any silver spoon in his mouth either. Daddy did not provide millions to him in his childhood.

And who compared his campaign to Obama's? All I said is that he has set up a huge organization, now bigger than Obama's, to fight Donald Trump, and he will offer it up to the person who wins the nomination if he isn't that person. Do you think that offer is some kind of toxic trap? The Republicans can take hundreds of millions from their billionaires but that's too damn good for Democrats?

Fuck, that's almost rich enough for me to wish 4 more years of Donald Trump on you, except for the fact that means 4 more years of that poxy mouthed orange rat being imposed on the rest of the world.

2 hours ago, Zorral said:

Black people will not vote for him and without the black vote that's that.  Watch, read, listen to what stop and frisk really meant in the experience of black people in NYC -- particularly for black women.  Bloomberg is goddamned terrorist.  Just because he's more polite about his racism and the rest -- in public! -- doesn't change a goddamned thing.

I will NOT vote for him, no matter what.  I'll vote for my local candidates for local offices.  But I won't vote for him for POTUS.  It's the same thing we already have, just slicker.

Do I give a shit about whether or not black people vote for him? I already said I was an Elizabeth Warren supporter. Americans are going to pick the Democratic nominee and it's up to them, not foreigners. And guess what, not up to you either, but the collective voice.

And if Bloomberg is chosen as the nominee, which I doubt, and you decide not to vote for him, I'll hold you in as much contempt as I hold for Bernie bros who just couldn't hold their bloody noses and vote for HRC. If Trump wins, you'll deserve every disgusting thing he does to you. The rest of us won't, but who gives a shit, right?

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5 minutes ago, A True Kaniggit said:

Pardon, but I'm gonna use your post to ask a question.

So right now the norm in is the U.S. is what, K-12 right? That's 13 years of taxpayer schooling.

What is the point of these 13 years? Isn't it to get children enough education that after graduation they can join the workforce? If we are now at the point where the information included in a college degree, but not a high school one, is required for jobs with a livable wage, then why isn't that information included in these 13 years of school? If time is the factor, shouldn't it be extended to 15 years?

What the hell is the worth of 13 years of education if you can't get a decent job with it?

If that is not the case, then shouldn't the onus be on employers to quit demanding multi year degrees, that put people thousands of dollars in debt, for jobs that require 3-6 weeks of OJT?

It's the myth of the liberal education. The concept is to provide citizens with knowledge of all kinds of things--science, arts, culture, etc. In fact, the thought of school just being job training is the problem. Despite having the liberal education model, we are treating it as other countries that use education as vocation training and put their kiddos on tracks.

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