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Iskaral Pust

Football: winter break over

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How do the liverpool fans think the ox has done since he joined?

 

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47 minutes ago, Mark Antony said:

Yeah Robertson too said something about how they celebrated as if they won the final. Comes off very sore loserish. 

I mean, Atletico's whole thing is pretty much that they're massively cynical arseholes who're horrible to play against and they openly acknowledge it so it's not particularly surprising that Liverpool players don't view them in a positive light. 

 

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1 hour ago, Corvinus said:

Maybe, but who else could he have brought in as a striker? Mane was pretty uninspired, too, and would have likely gotten himself sent off in the 2nd half. I missed the games were Minamino played more than 10 minutes, so I don't know how good he is.

On the left side? Ox or Minamino would both have been better options, as both can play through tight spaces and pick out a pass.

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How are Leipzig not ahead yet

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Leipzig fluffed a few really good chances in that half. They've been by far the better side but failing to capitalise could come back to bite them. 

Atalanta well worth their 2-0 lead. Most entertaining side to watch in Serie A followed by Lazio.

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Ben Davis with the most obvious foul/ penalty you'll ever see :lol:

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Deserved win for Leipzig. Should have scored a couple more goals but kept shooting straight at Lloris from close range. Managed to keep a clean sheet as well despite missing their best CBs - Konate, Upamecano and Orban. Spurs only started playing once they went behind - Lo Celso was quality. Mourinho's negativity played a big part in this loss and gifted Leipzig the momentum - had he not set up for a draw right from the outset, Spurs could have gotten more joy against Leipzig's second string defence even without Kane and Son. 

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6 hours ago, Raja said:

How do the liverpool fans think the ox has done since he joined?

 

He was excellent before he got injured. He's been ok since he came back but he doesn't look quite the potential key player he did before. In fairness I think there's been a change in what Liverpool want from their midfield in the intervening period.

Apparently Guardiola's definitely staying at City next year. That's a bit of a blow for my hopes that they were going to implode.

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19 minutes ago, ljkeane said:

Apparently Guardiola's definitely staying at City next year. That's a bit of a blow for my hopes that they were going to implode.

Guardiola would be the least of their problems.

Let's assume the ban sticks (I know, I know, but just follow me there).

The means like 40m a year less income for City. With their wages in place, they are right now roughly making a profit of approximately 10m.

So 10m-40m = - 30m.

And they'd need to make a profit to be eligible for European competitions and FFP rules.

Two years with an annual deficit of 30m in a five year period. This is sure as fuck gonna be interesting.

Logic suggest they have to part with some of their toys instead of adding new ones.

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It's a lot more than a 40m loss without CL. City earned €93m from the CL last season - participation €15m, prize money €33m, Uefa coefficient €24m and TV market pool €21m. Then there is also the loss from match day revenue as well. 

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1 hour ago, ljkeane said:

He was excellent before he got injured. He's been ok since he came back but he doesn't look quite the potential key player he did before. In fairness I think there's been a change in what Liverpool want from their midfield in the intervening period.

At Arsenal, the question was always basically if he would play in the midfield or on the wings. Personally, I always thought he was better as a winger and he didn't have the technical skill & decision making ability to play in a midfield 3 as a 10 or an 8, so I was curious to hear how he has gotten on. In fairness, I think it would be very tough to displace Salah/ Firminho/ Mane.

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3 hours ago, Raja said:

At Arsenal, the question was always basically if he would play in the midfield or on the wings. Personally, I always thought he was better as a winger and he didn't have the technical skill & decision making ability to play in a midfield 3 as a 10 or an 8, so I was curious to hear how he has gotten on. In fairness, I think it would be very tough to displace Salah/ Firminho/ Mane.

He looks much better for Liverpool as an attacking midfielder.  He’s less effective as a winger or wide forward.  But he hasn’t yet had a long run of games after his injury, so he isn’t yet back to that prior  level yet.

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6 hours ago, Consigliere said:

It's a lot more than a 40m loss without CL. City earned €93m from the CL last season - participation €15m, prize money €33m, Uefa coefficient €24m and TV market pool €21m. Then there is also the loss from match day revenue as well. 

Ok, read the 40m somewhere (can'T remember where) and was wondering that the number looked rather low.

I assume they just went with TV pool + participation as baseline. :dunno:

Anyway, fact remains, they'd have to dump salary faster than Arsenal Özil's contract.

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10 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Guardiola would be the least of their problems.

Let's assume the ban sticks (I know, I know, but just follow me there).

The means like 40m a year less income for City. With their wages in place, they are right now roughly making a profit of approximately 10m.

So 10m-40m = - 30m.

And they'd need to make a profit to be eligible for European competitions and FFP rules.

Two years with an annual deficit of 30m in a five year period. This is sure as fuck gonna be interesting.

Logic suggest they have to part with some of their toys instead of adding new ones.

It will be interesting. If City are going to take UEFA to every court in the land for banning them now, imagine what they will do if they are stopped from being in Europe because the ban also prevented them from making enough profit to qualify! 

City are playing with pretty much infinite money turned on so I doubt they have to worry about making money for it's own sake.

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4 hours ago, A Horse Named Stranger said:

Ok, read the 40m somewhere (can'T remember where) and was wondering that the number looked rather low.

I assume they just went with TV pool + participation as baseline. :dunno:

Anyway, fact remains, they'd have to dump salary faster than Arsenal Özil's contract.

They might need to reduce their wage bill but I don't think it's going to be as bad as some are making out. United, for instance, have posted a higher wage bill than City for several years now and have only participated in the CL in 4 out of the last 7 seasons yet we are not in breach of FFP. FFP calculations are more complicated than simple subtraction - other clubs have posted losses in the past but were not in breach of FFP. City's last reported wage bill was £260m which is lower than Liverpool's and £37m/year more than Arsenal's. City benefit massively from how their wages are structured - basically City only pay the players and staff associated with the first team while everyone else is paid by the Football Group. If the claims in Der Spiegel are accurate then the club is not even paying players' image rights. 

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5 hours ago, Consigliere said:

They might need to reduce their wage bill but I don't think it's going to be as bad as some are making out. United, for instance, have posted a higher wage bill than City for several years now and have only participated in the CL in 4 out of the last 7 seasons yet we are not in breach of FFP. FFP calculations are more complicated than simple subtraction - other clubs have posted losses in the past but were not in breach of FFP. City's last reported wage bill was £260m which is lower than Liverpool's and £37m/year more than Arsenal's. City benefit massively from how their wages are structured - basically City only pay the players and staff associated with the first team while everyone else is paid by the Football Group. If the claims in Der Spiegel are accurate then the club is not even paying players' image rights. 

But United have vast sources for other income from commercial partnerships.  Woodward might not be a DoF but he’s worth nearly as much as CL qualification to the club.  City don’t have anything like that kind of additional revenue.  In fact it’s not clear whether the “Emptihad” even produces PL match day revenue comparable to the other big clubs.

And it remains to be seen whether City’s Football Group can continue paying for a slice of the club’s operating costs under FFP.  City’s wage bill is definitely higher than Liverpool’s if you just look at the respective squads, so you are already seeing how their creative accounting hides reality.  Plus they incur much greater costs for transfers as they keep cycling through full-backs at 50m per.

Their one area of legitimate financial advantage is that they did a lot of their player acquisition before transfer prices reached the post-Neymar inflated level.  David Silva, Sterling, KDB and Aguero would all cost a lot more today.  Although that advantage disappears over the next few years as their top players age.

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City do have big commercial revenues though - the 2nd highest in the premier league after United (around £230m/year iirc) and they could always get more from the UAE - PSG does the same but to an even greater extent. On the slim chance that CAS even uphold this sanction, City might have to look to reduce their wage bill and curb spending a bit but it isn't going to be a fire sale like some seem to think. There are always loopholes to exploit and money talks. 

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3 hours ago, Consigliere said:

City do have big commercial revenues though - the 2nd highest in the premier league after United (around £230m/year iirc) and they could always get more from the UAE - PSG does the same but to an even greater extent. On the slim chance that CAS even uphold this sanction, City might have to look to reduce their wage bill and curb spending a bit but it isn't going to be a fire sale like some seem to think. There are always loopholes to exploit and money talks. 

Aren’t those commercial revenues parts of the problem?  They’re above-market commercial payments from their owners and related parties, so they’re not supposed to count as eligible revenue for FFP.

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