US Politics: Vaguely above average Tuesday

[Stego]

 

8 hours ago, Isabel said:

Than you dont have any morals. If you wanna vote for bernie to better society, but are willing to make trump a second term president because you didnt get your way, than you a morally bancrupt.

 

If YOU vote for a war monger, YOU are morally bankrupt. See how that works?

[Stego]

6 hours ago, BigFatCoward said:

Most of the rest of the world thinks you are the evil. 

Liberal propaganda and nonsense. There's a reason we have to slow immigration -- everyone wants to BE us.

And the list of countries that owe their freedom or portions of their freedom to the United States contains just about every nation in the world.

But hey, keep believing your version of events.

[Corvinus85]

10 hours ago, Triskele said:

Needs to be Jager.  If a nice pinot noir is your drink of choice the virus will thrive.  

You saying these people should have drunk Jaeger? 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/03/10/44-dead-iran-drinking-toxic-alcohol-fake-coronavirus-cure/5009761002/

[DMC]

10 minutes ago, Stego said:

You should read Truman's biography by David McCullough.

I have, been prominently placed on one of my mother's bookshelves for a quarter-century even though McCullough treats Truman with kid gloves - particularly when it comes to dropping the bomb.  What of it?  McCullough doesn't magically claim Eisenhower instead of Truman issued the Truman doctrine or presided over most of the Korean War.

[Trebla]

The stock market just dropped 1700 points and again shutdown, only the second time in 20+ years. 

I guess people were not exactly reassured by Trump address last night. 

[maarsen]

26 minutes ago, Stego said:

Liberal propaganda and nonsense. There's a reason we have to slow immigration -- everyone wants to BE us.

And the list of countries that owe their freedom or portions of their freedom to the United States contains just about every nation in the world.

But hey, keep believing your version of events.

Not Canada. In fact we owe ours to repulsing you.

[OldGimletEye]

Yes, the government needs to get out right now and stabilize expectations. The quicker, the better.

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/3/12/21173599/coronavirus-stock-market-economy-claudia-sahm

https://www.vox.com/2020/3/12/21174968/democrats-coronavirus-stimulus-package-whats-in-it

[Stego]

16 minutes ago, maarsen said:

Not Canada. In fact we owe ours to repulsing you.

Canada hasn't had a real military in decades. The US has protected them, and will continue to do so. I served with Canadians (all 4 of them in the middle east at the time) and they understood this. Why don't you?

[Stego]

42 minutes ago, DMC said:

I have, been prominently placed on one of my mother's bookshelves for a quarter-century even though McCullough treats Truman with kid gloves - particularly when it comes to dropping the bomb.  What of it?  McCullough doesn't magically claim Eisenhower instead of Truman issued the Truman doctrine or presided over most of the Korean War.

OK, then... who was running the Pentagon during those years?

[DMC]

6 minutes ago, Stego said:

OK, then... who was running the Pentagon during those years?

Uh, technically the various Secretaries of War/Defense Truman went through in quick succession after Stimson (Patterson, Royall, Forrestal, Johnson, then Marshall of course).  But I'm assuming you're referring to the two years and change when Eisenhower served as army chief of staff.  The Truman doctrine didn't emanate from Eisenhower, or even the Pentagon.  That's ridiculous and a horrible misreading of McCullough, if that matters to you.  Marshall, Acheson, and the State Department designed and perpetuated the policy of containment as articulated in the Truman Doctrine.  As for blaming Ike as army chief of staff for getting into Korea?  Heh, there was no love lost between him and Truman on that either.  Regardless, there was that president who popularized the ethos "The Buck Stops Here."

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

I hate to be the “told you so” guy, but @Ormond, I told you, and we’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg. And the ripple is going to be crushing. I think the 9/11 comparisons are wrong, but this is going to be a combined global economic and health meltdown.

If you haven’t stocked up on water, medicine and non-perishables, you’re playing this game wrong. And now I’m wondering if I should take $5-10k out of the bank if they’ll let me.

[Stego]

6 minutes ago, DMC said:

Uh, technically the various Secretaries of War/Defense Truman went through in quick succession after Stimson (Patterson, Royall, Forrestal, Johnson, then Marshall of course).  But I'm assuming you're referring to the two years and change when Eisenhower served as army chief of staff.  The Truman doctrine didn't emanate from Eisenhower, or even the Pentagon.  That's ridiculous and a horrible misreading of McCullough, if that matters to you.  Marshall, Acheson, and the State Department designed and perpetuated the policy of containment as articulated in the Truman Doctrine.  As for blaming Ike as army chief of staff for getting into Korea?  Heh, there was no love lost between him and Truman on that either.  Regardless, there was that president who popularized the ethos "The Buck Stops Here."

I disagree with your googled version. The 5 stars all had unprecedented power. McArthur was an Emperor at this time, for instance. 

I do not blame all of Korea on Eisenhower. I'm sorry my rant of all the reasons Ike sucks was oversimplified. He was responsible for the Army's incompetence and for losing the war. He wasn't responsible for Inchon or the Chosin. I blame a lot of it on the aforementioned MacArthur, as well. 

You seem to have a modern understanding of Generals. They had far more power post-WWII.

[argonak]

8 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

I hate to be the “told you so” guy, but @Ormond, I told you, and we’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg. And the ripple is going to be crushing. I think the 9/11 comparisons are wrong, but this is going to be a combined global economic and health meltdown.

If you haven’t stocked up on water, medicine and non-perishables, you’re playing this game wrong. And now I’m wondering if I should take $5-10k out of the bank if they’ll let me.

If things get that bad, your dollars won't be worth anything, you're better off buying ammo.  I think we're looking at a recession that's going to lag the stock market collapse by a month.   The actual virus simply simply isn't that threatening to the bulk of the population.   

What we're seeing is simply the result of probably the most incompetent administration in history being faced with a real problem, and consistently making everything worse by their combination of actions an inactions.

[Conflicting Thought]

1 hour ago, Stego said:

Liberal propaganda and nonsense. There's a reason we have to slow immigration -- everyone wants to BE us.

And the list of countries that owe their freedom or portions of their freedom to the United States contains just about every nation in the world.

But hey, keep believing your version of events.

Wow, thats ignorant, you are ignorant, and you should feel bad of your ignorance. 

[Stego]

5 minutes ago, Conflicting Thought said:

Wow, thats ignorant, you are ignorant, and you should feel bad of your ignorance. 

Some people have a hard time knowing they only sleep soundly because better men and women protect them.

[DMC]

17 minutes ago, Stego said:

I disagree with your googled version.

Otherwise known as the predominate historical consensus?

18 minutes ago, Stego said:

You seem to have a modern understanding of Generals. They had far more power post-WWII.

You're certainly right about this - Marshall, Ike, MacArthur, Omar Bradley - all had unprecedented influence post-WWII.  But Truman loathed MacArthur and feared he'd take his job in 48, Ike and Marshall didn't get along even though the latter was the former's mentor, etc.  You're looking at things from a perspective that betrays an incredible lack of nuance.  More importantly, to get back to the point, to place responsibility for the Truman Doctrine and the Korean War on Ike instead of all those other prominent officials that had far more to do with both is absurd.

[Fez]

19 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

I hate to be the “told you so” guy, but @Ormond, I told you, and we’re only seeing the tip of the iceberg. And the ripple is going to be crushing. I think the 9/11 comparisons are wrong, but this is going to be a combined global economic and health meltdown.

If you haven’t stocked up on water, medicine and non-perishables, you’re playing this game wrong. And now I’m wondering if I should take $5-10k out of the bank if they’ll let me.

If there's a run on the banks to the point that you can't withdraw money anymore, I'm not sure it'll matter much if you have cash-on-hand. Everything will be paralyzed and money won't do much good anymore anyway. Having money in multiple banks though, so you still have access to funds while dealing with the FDIC if one bank fails, that may be a prudent move.

But stocking up on supplies seems entirely sensible. I have another Amazon Fresh delivery coming today and I'm already thinking of putting in another order. All of a sudden 4 weeks of food doesn't seem like enough. At least my cat should be good for a while, I have about 8 months of his food. 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

19 minutes ago, argonak said:

If things get that bad, your dollars won't be worth anything, you're better off buying ammo.  I think we're looking at a recession that's going to lag the stock market collapse by a month.   The actual virus simply simply isn't that threatening to the bulk of the population.   

What we're seeing is simply the result of probably the most incompetent administration in history being faced with a real problem, and consistently making everything worse by their combination of actions an inactions.

You mean an idiot conman isn’t the best person to protect people?

And on the ammo front, I’ve got plenty. But it also might be wise to have a bit of cash on hand.

[Liffguard]

11 minutes ago, Stego said:

Some people have a hard time knowing they only sleep soundly because better men and women protect them.

The unfortunate truth is that the US military is frequently what people need to be protected from.

Not always. Sometimes they need to be protected from other militaries that are just supplied and trained by the US.

[DMC]

1 minute ago, Liffguard said:

Not always. Sometimes they need to be protected from other militaries that are just supplied and trained by the US.

Oftentimes they protect themselves with arms provided by the US against those militaries that are also..supplied by the US.