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You are Viserys Targaryen, what do you do to retake the seven kingdoms for your house?


Yucef Menaerys

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Assuming this was just before the events of AGOT. Viserys thought that 10,000 screamers would be enough to retake the iron throne but I very much doubt those would be sufficient. How would you approach the problem were you in his shoes? 

Edit: after having some time to think of it I've come up with my own 10 point plan

Personally here's what I'd do. 

1. My primary focus will be to get the Reach on my side, I'll do everything towards that end at the beginning. I'll secretly establish contact with the Tyrells, offer to marry Margaery and make Mace hand of the king and whatever resanobale demands that they have. It shouldn't be extremely difficult, after all the Tyrells fought for the Targaryens during Robert's rebellion 

2. Offer the hand of Daenerys to Quentyn Martell, send my messengers to Oberyn especially and rouse him towards his quest for vengeance, that'll likely make him convince Doran to declare for Viserys. 

3. Once this is set in motion I'll arrive at the Reach, declare my banners and gather a huge combined Reahcer and Dornish force, I'll use tyrell gold to hire the golden company and any other mercenary company I can afford to hire to unleash chaos on the coast of the Stormlands so as to prevent them from giving Robert any meaningful help, I won't try winning them over since they're fiercely loyal to the Baratheon regime instead I'll seek to keep them out of the conflict with raids, naval blockades (with the Redwine fleet) and so on.

4. At this stage I'll order a mad rush and bet everything towards a swift capture of King's Landing with overwhelming number Reacher/Dornish forces, all of these steps will happen successively and rapidly so as not to give royal forces enough to organise a good defense and a big army of their own. Once King's Landing is captured Viserys will have legitimacy on his hands, I'll have a coronation and immediately offer a full pardon to all rebels and those who have not joined my forces yet (Westerlands, Vale, Riverlands, North) 

5. Next I'll turn my focus on the Riverlands and cajole them with a series of carrots and threats, I'll offer them two terms, either clemency or a massive punitive campaign a la the Lannister campaign of destruction during the WoT5k, given how exposed their lands are I think they'll be wise enough not to resist. 

6. The Vale is very unlikely to side with the Targs, if they stayed out of the war I'd leave them alone but if they do join the war on Robert's side I'll order the golden company and redwine fleet to expand their naval campaign towards the Vale coast and wreck havoc with the intention of forcing them to back down.

 7. I'll finally turn my attention towards the most dangerous foes in the entire conflict, the Lannisters. Like the Vale I don't think they'd side with Viserys too, they know the Targaryens have it against them for their betrayal, sacking of Kings landing and murder of Rhaegars children. I'll order a full and three pronged invasion of the Westerlands with Rivermen from the North, Reachermen from the south, and possibly another one from the coast by the Ironborn. I won't offer them independence but I'll give them the chance to cause carnage on the Westerlands coast and take loot, even if they decline it won't be a big deal but I doubt they will. 

8. At this point there are only 3 kingdoms left to subjugate, after conquering the Westerlands I'll finally order an invasion of a softened up Stormlands, I'll offcourse have left a large contingent in Kings Landing and the Crownlands of Dornish troops (most of the force) incase the stormlanders attempt an assault against the city during my Westerland's campaign. With 5 kingdoms behind me it should be easy to conquer the Stormlands. 

9. I'll lay siege and a total bloakcade on the Vale until they surrender, I won't try a ground invasion (that is folly) 

10. Only the North and Iron Isles are left, at this point they'll have no choice but to surrender. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Yucef Menaerys said:

Assuming this was just before the events of AGOT. Viserys thought that 10,000 screamers would be enough to retake the iron throne but I very much doubt those would be sufficient. How would you approach the problem were you in his shoes? 

Rightful King Viserys did not have a lot of options before the events of AGOT.  He was not getting the 10K Dothraki Cavalry unless Princess Daenerys and Khal Drogo married.  Let's assume he gets them.  10K is not enough to gather the houses to his cause, no matter how badly they might want to support him.  He has to show them a high percentage of winning before they jump to his cause.

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51 minutes ago, Brandon Ice-Eyes said:

I would sell the dragons eggs and hire the golden company plus more sell swords and wait for renly to die, Tywin to be too busy with Robb n then take Kings Landing and marry Maegery and then defend the city from Stannis. 

Viserys could make Tommen competent, the guy is simply not a threat.

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Here's a plan presuming he lands before the WoT5K starts

Well presuming that Viserys was actually competent, then I would basically use the Dothraki to their outmost potential and use the actual ties with Westeros he has. I'm going to presume he lands in Dorne and due to Doran Martell's help he gets all of Dorne. My plan would be as follows.

1. Order some Dornish detachments to raid up the Boneway and over the Sea of Dorne. This should keep the Stormlands busy enough to avoid them becoming involved immediately.

2. Offer Balon a promise of independence if he attacks the Westerlands. Even if he fails he should be enough to keep the Westerlands busy. With both the Westerlands and the Stormlands committed you should have no problem with the next part of your plan.

3. Cross the Prince's Pass and enter the Reach with the screamers. The Reach is the perfect environment for the screamers. Have the remaining Dornish follow up as a siege force. Do true Fire&Blood, those who bend the knee are incorporated those who don't are destroyed.

4. Use the Dothraki's speed to destroy any armies before they can mass up and overwhelm you.

5. Hopefully after enough early victories the Reach is in no condition to organize a coordinated counter attack and to scared of you and as such should bend the knee (there is one lord who would clearly agree to bend the knee instanly, Mathis Rowan).

6. To make sure everything goes smoothly offer to marry Margery Tyrell. This should make the Tyrells join your side and with the fear factor by now the Reach should be almost completely behind you. You should then make a small pause. Use this time to consolidate the Reach and gather all their forces.

7. By this point the Stormlands, Crownlands and Riverlands have probably amassed a combined army. March immediately against them before the North can bring it's full force (here we're presuming Jon Arryn is dead and Littlefinger is biding his time). You should have 10k Dornish left, the original 10k screamers and at least some 30k Reachmen. They should have 20k Stormlords, 10k Crownlanders and 15k Riverlords. You have both numbers and quality on you side. March down the Roseroad and use the plains to your advantage. You should have far superior cavalry (Reach knights and Dothraki) use this in the battle and you should probably win.

8. Take KL. By this point almost everybody should swear fealty. You have only to deal with the Stormlands and the North now. The Stormlands can be easily made to bend the knee though SE should last a year or more it will still fall in due time, especially seeing as you have the Redwyne fleet. The North will be a pickle.

9. By this point the North and the Iron Isles are all that remains, both having probably declared independence. Your biggest short terms problem is now legitimacy. Backstab the Dothraki using some various war crime as pretext. All your other subjects won't mind so just massacre them all. They might be elite but they're 10k against a continent. Dealing with them should be relatively easy.

10. Secure Westros proper and rebuild the Royal Navy.

11. Now with a loyal 5 kingdoms behind you and 2 fleets try to deal with the Ironborn. They were probably already thrown out by Tywin so their strength at land if they had any is gone. All they have is the Iron Fleet. Use your 2 fleets to try and destroy them. After that they'll probably bend the knee. Now all that remains is the North.

12. Use a 2 pronged attack. Order the Ironorn with what's left of their navy to attack Moat Cailin Torhhen's square and Deepwood Motte. The Northmen should send their troops to deal with that. This however is only a diversion.

13. Land an army At White Harbour. The massive port and the kingsroad that connects it will be enough to supply your troops. After taking the initial Port wait and bring more troops until you outnumber the North.

14. March on Winterfell. Some less loyal Northenr houses such as the Dustins and Boltons should join you. The Starks will either face you in open battle in the Kingsroad which they'll lose or else they'l wait inside Winterfell and be sieged out. Regardless eventually you'll now win the North. Keep the Starks as lords paramount but take a lot of hostages.

And that's how I'd win Westeros as Viserys III Targaryen if I landed before Wot5k.

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20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. Order some Dornish detachments to raid up the Boneway and over the Sea of Dorne. This should keep the Stormlands busy enough to avoid them becoming involved immediately.

It should keep the marches busy, not the entire  Stormlands.

 

 

22 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. Offer Balon a promise of independence if he attacks the Westerlands. Even if he fails he should be enough to keep the Westerlands busy. With both the Westerlands and the Stormlands committed you should have no problem with the next part of your plan.

Balon  is not helping as long Ned and Robert are alive, the man is not enough, not you have enough manpower  to actually look palatable enough to risk your neck.

 

 

 

23 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

3. Cross the Prince's Pass and enter the Reach with the screamers. The Reach is the perfect environment for the screamers. Have the remaining Dornish follow up as a siege force. Do true Fire&Blood, those who bend the knee are incorporated those who don't are destroyed.

4. Use the Dothraki's speed to destroy any armies before they can mass up and overwhelm you.

The thing with fire  and blood your way to the land is... That people don't like Dothraki ravaging their lands and they don't really like savage invaders.

 

That without saying that you're in their land, they know how to drive you. The only thing they know to do is goles up in one castle while the forces are amassing in other.

 

 

 

30 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. Hopefully after enough early victories the Reach is in no condition to organize a coordinated counter attack and to scared of you and as such should bend the knee (there is one lord who would clearly agree to bend the knee instanly, Mathis Rowan).

Ditto, ravaging someone's lands it's not going to grant you people's love. Look at Tywin's success in the Riverlands. 

Now, Rowan is not a loyalist, that's more fancanon than anything else.

 

 

 

 

32 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. To make sure everything goes smoothly offer to marry Margery Tyrell. This should make the Tyrells join your side and with the fear factor by now the Reach should be almost completely behind you. You should then make a small pause. Use this time to consolidate the Reach and gather all their forces.

After you alledgedly destroyed them??

 

 

 

 

33 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. By this point the Stormlands, Crownlands and Riverlands have probably amassed a combined army. March immediately against them before the North can bring it's full force (here we're presuming Jon Arryn is dead and Littlefinger is biding his time). You should have 10k Dornish left, the original 10k screamers and at least some 30k Reachmen. They should have 20k Stormlords, 10k Crownlanders and 15k Riverlords. You have both numbers and quality on you side. March down the Roseroad and use the plains to your advantage. You should have far superior cavalry (Reach knights and Dothraki) use this in the battle and you should probably win.

If Robert is alive, LF is total nonfactor, just as Lysa.

The idea that you don't have cassualties and the Riverlords don't have more than 15k is honestly curious.

 

 

 

37 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. Take KL. By this point almost everybody should swear fealty. You have only to deal with the Stormlands and the North now. The Stormlands can be easily made to bend the knee though SE should last a year or more it will still fall in due time, especially seeing as you have the Redwyne fleet. The North will be a pickle.

I was going to continue  but it's all too easy for Viserys, it's more a combination  where everything is luck and combination of the rebels incompetency and... The fact that you just smash your way to victory without barely taking cassualties.

The Stormlords love the Baratheons, I have a very interesting time seeing them bending the knee  easily.

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23 minutes ago, frenin said:

It should keep the marches busy, not the entire  Stormlands.

That and the Rainwood, but it should buy enough time.

23 minutes ago, frenin said:

Balon  is not helping as long Ned and Robert are alive, the man is not enough, not you have enough manpower  to actually look palatable enough to risk your neck.

I don't know Balon seems dumb enough to do something like this.

24 minutes ago, frenin said:
1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

3. Cross the Prince's Pass and enter the Reach with the screamers. The Reach is the perfect environment for the screamers. Have the remaining Dornish follow up as a siege force. Do true Fire&Blood, those who bend the knee are incorporated those who don't are destroyed.

4. Use the Dothraki's speed to destroy any armies before they can mass up and overwhelm you.

The thing with fire  and blood your way to the land is... That people don't like Dothraki ravaging their lands and they don't really like savage invaders.

 

That without saying that you're in their land, they know how to drive you. The only thing they know to do is goles up in one castle while the forces are amassing in other.

The problem with disciplining the Dothraki is very true as you say, probably the greatest problem with my plan as it is. If they hole up in their castles it's perfect. The only thing the Dothraki should be doing early on is to rush the Reach with their speed and prevent any armies from merging.

36 minutes ago, frenin said:

Now, Rowan is not a loyalist, that's more fancanon than anything else.

There is quite a lot of proof, mut it's more meta proof, having to do with FAegon's path towards the Iron Throne. When analyzing that coupled with the few nuggets of proof we have in text, it is pretty safe to assume he's a Targ loyalist, though I do agree with you that the in text proof is very weak.

26 minutes ago, frenin said:
1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. To make sure everything goes smoothly offer to marry Margery Tyrell. This should make the Tyrells join your side and with the fear factor by now the Reach should be almost completely behind you. You should then make a small pause. Use this time to consolidate the Reach and gather all their forces.

After you alledgedly destroyed them??

Not the Tyrells. Highgarden is very hard to siege and the Dothraki aren't exactly masters at siegeing so my plan is more on the lines of destroy a few minor armies and raze a keep or 2 to show you mean business then offer the marriage pact and all this combined with the long tie it will take reinforcements to arrive should hopefully make Mace agree to join Viserys.

28 minutes ago, frenin said:
1 hour ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

. By this point the Stormlands, Crownlands and Riverlands have probably amassed a combined army. March immediately against them before the North can bring it's full force (here we're presuming Jon Arryn is dead and Littlefinger is biding his time). You should have 10k Dornish left, the original 10k screamers and at least some 30k Reachmen. They should have 20k Stormlords, 10k Crownlanders and 15k Riverlords. You have both numbers and quality on you side. March down the Roseroad and use the plains to your advantage. You should have far superior cavalry (Reach knights and Dothraki) use this in the battle and you should probably win.

If Robert is alive, LF is total nonfactor, just as Lysa.

I don't know, given how remote the Vale is it will just be enough for him to pull a Late Walder Frey and delay enough for the main battle to unfold and let him instantly declare for whoever wins. Also I'm not sure even if they join that the tide of the battle will turn. As for casualties, I am predicting the loss of 5k out of 15k Dornish in the raids and in the couple of sieges and I'm estimating that Viserys marshals only half of the Reach's potential.

31 minutes ago, frenin said:

Riverlords don't have more than 15k is honestly curious

They maybe have more if you add the Frey's, but given their history with wars they'd probably sit this one out too.

32 minutes ago, frenin said:

The Stormlords love the Baratheons, I have a very interesting time seeing them bending the knee  easily.

Well if Robert is defeated decisively, then they will probably surrender when they start seeing a massive host at their doorstep. 

I'm not saying that this plan is going to work, I'm just saying that it's what I'd do. The odds would be unbelievably against Viserys regardless. The main problems with this plan are, in my opinion as follows:

1. Disciplining the Dothrakis. Probably the greatest problem, as if they aren't under control Viserys will gain 0 support. All it takes is 3 highborn rapes and he's campaign is done for.

2. Preventing a combined Reachmen force from destroying him at the Prince's Pass. Basically if people find out about his invasion the moment he lands in Dorne and the Reach assembles a host he's done for. Secrecy is the key here and again point 1. Is very important.

3. Tywin or Renly arriving with a large host before Viserys turns over the Reach. This is pretty unlikely if Viserys has the element of surprise when he exists the Prince's Pass, but it's still a possibility if he get's bogged down in the Marshes. All in all at this point speed is key, and that's what the Dothraki's are for.

4. Balon raiding the Reach. It would be monumentally stupid of him to do that, with no long term benefit, but we has precedent with him invading the North. This would tie up a lot of Reach forces and clear up Tywin's forces, all in all massively tipping the scales in Robert's favor.

5. Robert doing Fabian strategies, refusing to battle on the Roseford, letting Viserys gave KL and quickly dealing with Balon in the Westerlands, but in return having the full force of the North, Vale, Riverlands, Westerlands and Stormlands behind him. This would be the wisest thing to do, but it doesn't really seem to be Robert's style.

And that's pretty much it. After a decisive battle on the Roseroad and the capture of KL it would only be a matter of time till Viserys takes it all. The Stormlands will hold out but most smaller castles will bend the knee after seeing a massive host with no way of getting relieved, with only SE remaining, and after that only the IE and the North will remain, which though they'll both take a long time to control, can also not really pose a significant threat.

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  1. If I'm sane!Viserys the first thing I'm gonna do is contract the Golden Company. At this time Jon Arryn is still alive.
  2. Send the GC to infiltrate King's Landing and Dragonstone over time. They don't need to get in the household or anything, but they simply need to trickle in over time so that they're in those cities secretly. By the time that the GC has managed to get into place Jon Arryn has probably died and Robert has left to go North and make Ned his Hand and probably come back.
  3. I would have to have a set date for the hidden 'Trojan Horse' soldiers to launch attacks on both Dragonstone and the Red Keep. If this happens when Robert is alive then I will take the castle and all members of House Baratheon hostage. Ned Stark and his daughters will also be taken hostage. If Robert has died then I won't have Renly but I will otherwise have the rest of the Baratheons as well as Cersei, Sansa, and Ned. If Ned has been executed then I still at least have Sansa.
  4. Since the Lords of the Crownlands generally have lingering loyalties for the Targs I would expect them to come over to my side while the rest of the Kingdom is reeling in confusion. If I succeed in taking all of House Baratheon hostage then execute them all. If I haven't (a free Renly) then execute Joffrey and Tommen and send Stannis to the Wall.
  5. If Renly has escaped then I would marry Shireen to unite the Stannis-Targaryen claims. If he hasn't then I would send him to the Wall too and request to marry Margaery Tyrell.
  6. If Ned Stark is alive, then offer a pardon for the Starks as long as he swears allegiance and marries Robb to Daenerys. If Ned was executed by Joffrey, then offer terms to the North - Robb will swear allegiance, but keep King in the North as a courtesy title (like Prince of Dorne is a courtesy title) while I crown myself High King of Westeros. Ice will be returned. He will be free of the Frey oath and marry Dany instead. I would also promise to make the Westerlands pay indemnities to rebuild the Riverlands and a tithe for the crime of executing Ned.

At this point things get overtly complex to bother detailing. But the general idea would be the kill Renly in the field and then crush the Lannisters. If Renly was captured and thus a nonthreat then I would just proceed directly to killing the Lannisters. Dorne would come onside fairly quickly though they'd probably not commit many if any troops until things were overwhelmingly in my favour. The Vale would just remain isolationist as per canon. The Iron Islands would be crushed last after the rest of the country was united.

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12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

That and the Rainwood, but it should buy enough time.

Not unless you send a considerable host there, host that you will need later.

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

I don't know Balon seems dumb enough to do something like this.

Not even Balon, the man knew better than that, that's why he only rose with Robert's and Ned's deaths.

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

The problem with disciplining the Dothraki is very true as you say, probably the greatest problem with my plan as it is. If they hole up in their castles it's perfect. The only thing the Dothraki should be doing early on is to rush the Reach with their speed and prevent any armies from merging.

That's easy to say, the Reach is not exactly small and to properly rush the Reach with their spped to prevent any armies from Merging, you have to know exactly where to go. It's virtually impossible to do that. It would require a knowledge that neither Viserys, who left Westeros when he was 8, nor the Dothraki have.

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

There is quite a lot of proof, mut it's more meta proof, having to do with FAegon's path towards the Iron Throne. When analyzing that coupled with the few nuggets of proof we have in text, it is pretty safe to assume he's a Targ loyalist, though I do agree with you that the in text proof is very weak.

No there isn't. We know he dislikes the Lannisters and would rather see Jaime dead and we know that he does not like the charade over Rhaegar's kids deaths Tywin pulls... That's exactly the same we know about Ned...

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Not the Tyrells. Highgarden is very hard to siege and the Dothraki aren't exactly masters at siegeing so my plan is more on the lines of destroy a few minor armies and raze a keep or 2 to show you mean business then offer the marriage pact and all this combined with the long tie it will take reinforcements to arrive should hopefully make Mace agree to join Viserys.

But then you aren't a problem, the only thing Mace needs to do is holing up and sooner or later you'll be trapped, razing keeps to show you mean business will only going to make you hated, besides Loras is Renly constant companion.

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

I don't know, given how remote the Vale is it will just be enough for him to pull a Late Walder Frey and delay enough for the main battle to unfold and let him instantly declare for whoever wins. Also I'm not sure even if they join that the tide of the battle will turn. As for casualties, I am predicting the loss of 5k out of 15k Dornish in the raids and in the couple of sieges and I'm estimating that Viserys marshals only half of the Reach's potential.

As i say, LF is only a factor if there isn't someone the Vale lords have a higher alligiance to or have more ties with... If Robert is alive and Ned is alive... both Lysa and to that extent Petyr become pretty much irrelevant. I don't know how 30k would not be significant.

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

They maybe have more if you add the Frey's, but given their history with wars they'd probably sit this one out too.

They should have more than that regardless. The River host seemed little because Edmure had lost a good deal while spreading his forces and Tywin pretty much destroyed him piece a meal while Jaime smashed him.

 

 

 

12 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Well if Robert is defeated decisively, then they will probably surrender when they start seeing a massive host at their doorstep. 

I'm not saying that this plan is going to work, I'm just saying that it's what I'd do. The odds would be unbelievably against Viserys regardless. The main problems with this plan are, in my opinion as follows:

1. Disciplining the Dothrakis. Probably the greatest problem, as if they aren't under control Viserys will gain 0 support. All it takes is 3 highborn rapes and he's campaign is done for.

2. Preventing a combined Reachmen force from destroying him at the Prince's Pass. Basically if people find out about his invasion the moment he lands in Dorne and the Reach assembles a host he's done for. Secrecy is the key here and again point 1. Is very important.

3. Tywin or Renly arriving with a large host before Viserys turns over the Reach. This is pretty unlikely if Viserys has the element of surprise when he exists the Prince's Pass, but it's still a possibility if he get's bogged down in the Marshes. All in all at this point speed is key, and that's what the Dothraki's are for.

4. Balon raiding the Reach. It would be monumentally stupid of him to do that, with no long term benefit, but we has precedent with him invading the North. This would tie up a lot of Reach forces and clear up Tywin's forces, all in all massively tipping the scales in Robert's favor.

5. Robert doing Fabian strategies, refusing to battle on the Roseford, letting Viserys gave KL and quickly dealing with Balon in the Westerlands, but in return having the full force of the North, Vale, Riverlands, Westerlands and Stormlands behind him. This would be the wisest thing to do, but it doesn't really seem to be Robert's style.

And that's pretty much it. After a decisive battle on the Roseroad and the capture of KL it would only be a matter of time till Viserys takes it all. The Stormlands will hold out but most smaller castles will bend the knee after seeing a massive host with no way of getting relieved, with only SE remaining, and after that only the IE and the North will remain, which though they'll both take a long time to control, can also not really pose a significant threat.

And i'm saying that for your plan to work, everyone needs to be either incompetent, disloyal or both. That and the fact that you're giving Viserys, not only superior numerical advantage but also the quality of troops. I find it rather curious. I never really bought the what if with Viserys or Aegon, for that reason, Dany has the clearer way.

 

 

 

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On 3/14/2020 at 3:54 AM, Yucef Menaerys said:

Assuming this was just before the events of AGOT. Viserys thought that 10,000 screamers would be enough to retake the iron throne but I very much doubt those would be sufficient. How would you approach the problem were you in his shoes? 

Edit: after having some time to think of it I've come up with my own 10 point plan

Personally here's what I'd do. 

1. My primary focus will be to get the Reach on my side, I'll do everything towards that end at the beginning. I'll secretly establish contact with the Tyrells, offer to marry Margaery and make Mace hand of the king and whatever resanobale demands that they have. It shouldn't be extremely difficult, after all the Tyrells fought for the Targaryens during Robert's rebellion 

2. Offer the hand of Daenerys to Quentyn Martell, send my messengers to Oberyn especially and rouse him towards his quest for vengeance, that'll likely make him convince Doran to declare for Viserys. 

3. Once this is set in motion I'll arrive at the Reach, declare my banners and gather a huge combined Reahcer and Dornish force, I'll use tyrell gold to hire the golden company and any other mercenary company I can afford to hire to unleash chaos on the coast of the Stormlands so as to prevent them from giving Robert any meaningful help, I won't try winning them over since they're fiercely loyal to the Baratheon regime instead I'll seek to keep them out of the conflict with raids, naval blockades (with the Redwine fleet) and so on.

4. At this stage I'll order a mad rush and bet everything towards a swift capture of King's Landing with overwhelming number Reacher/Dornish forces, all of these steps will happen successively and rapidly so as not to give royal forces enough to organise a good defense and a big army of their own. Once King's Landing is captured Viserys will have legitimacy on his hands, I'll have a coronation and immediately offer a full pardon to all rebels and those who have not joined my forces yet (Westerlands, Vale, Riverlands, North) 

5. Next I'll turn my focus on the Riverlands and cajole them with a series of carrots and threats, I'll offer them two terms, either clemency or a massive punitive campaign a la the Lannister campaign of destruction during the WoT5k, given how exposed their lands are I think they'll be wise enough not to resist. 

6. The Vale is very unlikely to side with the Targs, if they stayed out of the war I'd leave them alone but if they do join the war on Robert's side I'll order the golden company and redwine fleet to expand their naval campaign towards the Vale coast and wreck havoc with the intention of forcing them to back down.

 7. I'll finally turn my attention towards the most dangerous foes in the entire conflict, the Lannisters. Like the Vale I don't think they'd side with Viserys too, they know the Targaryens have it against them for their betrayal, sacking of Kings landing and murder of Rhaegars children. I'll order a full and three pronged invasion of the Westerlands with Rivermen from the North, Reachermen from the south, and possibly another one from the coast by the Ironborn. I won't offer them independence but I'll give them the chance to cause carnage on the Westerlands coast and take loot, even if they decline it won't be a big deal but I doubt they will. 

8. At this point there are only 3 kingdoms left to subjugate, after conquering the Westerlands I'll finally order an invasion of a softened up Stormlands, I'll offcourse have left a large contingent in Kings Landing and the Crownlands of Dornish troops (most of the force) incase the stormlanders attempt an assault against the city during my Westerland's campaign. With 5 kingdoms behind me it should be easy to conquer the Stormlands. 

9. I'll lay siege and a total bloakcade on the Vale until they surrender, I won't try a ground invasion (that is folly) 

10. Only the North and Iron Isles are left, at this point they'll have no choice but to surrender. 

 

 

King Viserys III did everything he could.  He didn't have much in the way of resources though.  A lof of people knock Viserys but he did better than a lot of people would have in his situation.  Take the likes of Joffrey, Tommen, Samwell,  and Sansa, toss them out into the streets.  Let's see how well they do.  

 

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3 hours ago, frenin said:

That's easy to say, the Reach is not exactly small and to properly rush the Reach with their spped to prevent any armies from Merging, you have to know exactly where to go. It's virtually impossible to do that. It would require a knowledge that neither Viserys, who left Westeros when he was 8, nor the Dothraki have.

You don't need to destroy all Reach armies, just the ones between Highgarden and Prince's Pass such as the Tarly's.

3 hours ago, frenin said:
16 hours ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

There is quite a lot of proof, mut it's more meta proof, having to do with FAegon's path towards the Iron Throne. When analyzing that coupled with the few nuggets of proof we have in text, it is pretty safe to assume he's a Targ loyalist, though I do agree with you that the in text proof is very weak.

No there isn't. We know he dislikes the Lannisters and would rather see Jaime dead and we know that he does not like the charade over Rhaegar's kids deaths Tywin pulls... That's exactly the same we know about Ned...

As I said the in text proof is very weak. However given that he's the closest commander to FAegon and the fact that we know that the battle will be with Mace, then we can guess that he probably already turned cloak after the fall of SE.

3 hours ago, frenin said:

But then you aren't a problem, the only thing Mace needs to do is holing up and sooner or later you'll be trapped, razing keeps to show you mean business will only going to make you hated, besides Loras is Renly constant companion.

That's what marrying Margery is for. The promise of Margery becoming the queen should be enough for Lord Oaf.

3 hours ago, frenin said:

As i say, LF is only a factor if there isn't someone the Vale lords have a higher alligiance to or have more ties with... If Robert is alive and Ned is alive... both Lysa and to that extent Petyr become pretty much irrelevant. I don't know how 30k would not be significant.

He can stall quite a lot. Just insist that the Vale host wait for the lord of the Peebles to arrive. Stalling is very easy.

3 hours ago, frenin said:

They should have more than that regardless. The River host seemed little because Edmure had lost a good deal while spreading his forces and Tywin pretty much destroyed him piece a meal while Jaime smashed him.

Yeah, I forgot about Golden Tooth. You're probably right.

3 hours ago, frenin said:

And i'm saying that for your plan to work, everyone needs to be either incompetent, disloyal or both

I wouldn't go so far, but I do agree that it would take a lot of luck. However this is Viserys. His chances are incredibly slim. He has 10k screamers and Dorne against the rest of the realm. There isn't really any way in which he could win without a shit ton of luck.

3 hours ago, frenin said:

I never really bought the what if with Viserys or Aegon, for that reason

Again I do agree on Viserys, however you do know that FAegon will probably win. The foreshadowing is too great for the battle with Mace not to be an Agincourt. After that Dorne and Randyl Tarly will join FAegon (remember, Randyl has 20k men at Maidenpool) and the Faith having to choose between FAegon and Tommen, who they know comes from incest, well it's not hard to decide who they will chose.

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3 minutes ago, Prince Rhaego's Soul said:

A lof of people knock Viserys but he did better than a lot of people would have in his situation.

He didn't though. If he just shut up and forget about his rights for a second maybe he could have gotten 40k Dothraki screamers instead of a pot of molten gold.

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20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

You don't need to destroy all Reach armies, just the ones between Highgarden and Prince's Pass such as the Tarly's.

You need to destroy several of them, in order to stop the Reach armies from merging.

 

20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

As I said the in text proof is very weak. However given that he's the closest commander to FAegon and the fact that we know that the battle will be with Mace, then we can guess that he probably already turned cloak after the fall of SE.

Or that Mace is an incompetent leader.

 

20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

That's what marrying Margery is for. The promise of Margery becoming the queen should be enough for Lord Oaf.

Not if his favourite son is with the enemy and in love of the enemy. While he himself and most of his bannermen are in pretty good  terms with Renly.

 

20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

He can stall quite a lot. Just insist that the Vale host wait for the lord of the Peebles to arrive. Stalling is very easy.

I will repeat myself. LF has no sway if Lysa has no  sway. The Vale lords would not even look twice at him. Why would they.

 

20 minutes ago, Alyn Oakenfist said:

Again I do agree on Viserys, however you do know that FAegon will probably win. The foreshadowing is too great for the battle with Mace not to be an Agincourt. After that Dorne and Randyl Tarly will join FAegon (remember, Randyl has 20k men at Maidenpool) and the Faith having to choose between FAegon and Tommen, who they know comes from incest, well it's not hard to decide who they will chose.

Aegon is different in a completely different scenario (a wartorn Westeros in which everyone hates the Lannisters and are willingly to throw themselves to first pretender) and to different opponent (Mace who is renownedfor his incompetency)

Viserys is facing a stable realm, united under a well loved King and the most of the best commanders and more powerful men (Tywin, Stannis, Ned, Robert) against him and arguably the most loved lord in the entire Realm (Renly) Agincourt worked for many different factors that may apply to Aegon but don't apply at all to Viserys. Or to Aegon had he tried to try his luck against Robert and not against Tommen and Mace, there is a reason why Kevan was taken out of the picture, even now Aegon chances are not incredibly good, under a competent leader ie Kevan (the Golden Company wouldn't have even tried had Tywin been alive) they would've been defeated regardless.

 

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Not sure if I(Viserys) would be successful but it’s to say what I would do in his place as 1. We have more information on future events and 2. I’m not crazy.....as he is.

 

As soon as I arrived in Braavos with Ser Willem and Dany, I would order Ser Willem as my royal subject to write to

“Silveraxe” Fell, Ser Bonifer Hasty, Ser Ronald Connington, Ser Richard Lonmouth and

Lord Gerold Grafton and

Mace Tyrell, Randyll Tarly, Leyton Hightower, Mathis Rowan, Paxter Redwyne, Lords Fossoways(both branches) Lord Oakenshield, Lord Humfrey Hewett and

Lord Darry, Lord Goodbrook, Lord Mooton, Lord Ryger and

Lord Rykker, Lord Staunton, Lord Chelsted, Lord Velaryon, Lord Ardrian Celtigar and

Prince Doran Martell, Prince Oberyn, Lord Yronwood and 

Mellario of Norvos, Owen Merryweather, Jon Connington and Myles Toyne(or whoever is the Golden Company Captain-General)

apologise for Aerys and vow to retake the throne and be a better King etc etc try to build a network of loyal houses until an opportunity arose to cross the narrow sea.(Hopefully no one will betray and won’t get assassinated)

The first opportunity would be the Greyjoy’s Rebellion and if I was Viserys with The whole of Westeros aiming West I would use this to attack Kings Landing, if I had good terms with Golden Company I would use them even if I had to promise Dany’s Hand in marriage when old enough to the Captain General.

I don’t foresee King’s Landing repelling the Golden Company with or without the advantage of surprise.

Then once I’m in, fortify the City and resend letter to all the aforementioned Houses to try and rally loyal troops. Worse case no one comes, King Robert besieges Kings Landing I hold out until no choice but to escape Essos where I’m back to where I’ve started but I know who my friends are.

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I used this map of Westeros for my plan.
1. Don’t give Dany to Drogo. For only 10k Dothraki it’s a bit of waste when you could use her in a marriage pact to bind an entire kingdom of Westeros. Also there was a quote from Jorah “Nothing knits a broken realm together so quick as an invading army on its soil." Seems to me invading with a Dothraki horde, who Westeros would view as savages, would drive people away from Viserys’ cause.

2. Make friends with Oberyn and other Targ loyalists in Dorne. Might need to offer Dany for marriage but the Martells might come over just because of their hatred of the Baratheons/Lannisters.

3. Either offer myself for Margaery or Dany for Garlan/Loras/Willas to make an alliance with the Tyrells. Hire the Golden Company and maybe some other mercenaries.

4. Hopefully now I will have at least half of the Reach and most if not all of Dorne. The Florents will probably side with Robert and I’m not sure about the Hightowers. I should have 15k-25k Dornishmen, depending on whose estimate you use for Dorne’s military strength, but I think it is nowhere near as high as Doran says it is (50k). I should have 30k+ Reachmen, depending on how many are Targ loyalists. Then take over any bits of Dorne or the Reach I haven’t got already. In Oldtown, get crowned in the Starry Sept like Aegon I did.

5A. Use the Dornishmen (15K of them) to attack the Marches (going up Prince’s Pass and Boneway), raiding and burning small towns and villages so they can’t send troops to the Marcher lords (Dondarrion, Caron etc) in their castles (Blackhaven, Nightsong etc). Keep the lords penned up in their castles and either siege them or assault them. Have ~5K Reach troops from Ashford and Grassy Vale to attack Marcher lords as well. Use some of the Redwyne fleet to land ~7K Reachmen and Dornish on Cape Wrath, plus Tarth and Estermont. Send about 25 ships to patrol the Slayne River and take Stonehelm and Red Watch along the way. This will cut off the Marches from the Rainwood, or at least force Stormland troops from either side to go round past Grandview instead of just crossing the river, slowing them down. Send 3K Reachmen from Tumbleton into the Kingswood. Now the remaining Stormlords will be surrounded on all fronts, save the east, which is sea anyway. Also, the Stormlands troops won’t be able to rescue the Marches and Cape Wrath since the troops in the Kingswood are threatening King’s Landing directly and they will have to go fight them first. The ~3K in the Kingswood will be raiding across to target the northern Stormlands, so the remaining stormlords won’t be able to ignore them.
 

5B. Offer the Ironborn Cape Kraken, Cape of Eagles, Fair Isle, and some other bits of the Westerlands in exchange for attacking it. Use ~15K Reachmen to attack Westerlands and 5K to raid and loot in the Riverlands. 
 

5C. Defeat Stannis’ fleet with the Redwyne’s and sellsails. Land the Golden Company and any other sellswords on Crackclaw Point and the islands of the Narrow Sea. Send 1K or 2K sellswords down Massey’s Hook to attack the stormlands. Send the rest through Crackclaw Point to Maidenpool, and split in two. One half to go down Rosby Road to King’s Landing. Another half to go down and meet the Kingsroad, taking Antlers and Sow’s Horn on the way. They will meet outside King’s Landing and lay siege to it.

6. The Riverlands are in disarray, I have taken Stormlands and Crownlands will mostly ally with me, and King’s Landing will fall to siege, then I can crown myself and sit the Iron Throne. Arrange marriages between my allied lords to make sure of their loyalty. Lysa will probably stay out of the fight, and I will make friends with her lords so they will convince her to stay neutral. Troop numbers are probably ~50K left for the campaign. (Troops from Reach, Dorne, Crownlands total ~100K. Take off ~20K for those who didn’t follow me and ~15K who died fighting for me. Then another ~15K to police territory.)

7. Send 10K troops to up the Kingsroad to take the Twins and Fairmarket. Send some ships up the three Forks. This will cut off the Westerlands from their allies the Starks and possible allies the Arryns. Tywin is smart enough to surrender at this point, but even if he doesn’t, Greyjoy raids from the north and west and attacks from the south and east will force him into submission. Send another 10K or so to subjugate Riverlands too. 
 

8. Send the wildlings equipment and supplies and help them in their attack on the Wall. Ally with the Boltons and use them and the wildlings to take Karhold and Last Hearth. Capture Bear Island and Skagos. Take out the Manderly fleet. Have the Ironborn reave Stony Shore and Blazewater Bay. 
 

9. March south from the Dreadfort to take Widow’s Watch, Ramsgate, and Oldcastle, and lay siege to White Harbour. Ally with the Dustins and have them take over the Rills and Torrhen’s Square, and take Moat Cailin from the North. 
 

10. Land the main force at different points (Sea Dragon Point, Cape Kraken, Ramsgate). From Cape Kraken take Flint’s Finger and the Flint Cliffs, then move into the Neck. From Sea Dragon Point move into the Wolfswood and take Deepwood Motte. After White Harbour falls move ships into the White Knife to cut off any Stark forces from Winterfell. Use the wildlings and attack the mountain clans from the Gift and from Bear Island.

11. Siege out Cerwyn and Winterfell. Fake attacks on the Bloody Gate and on Gulltown and Runestone to draw Vale forces. Send ships raiding down the river to Strongsong to draw forces from the Fingers there.

12. From White Harbour, capture the Sisters, Pebble, and the Paps. Attack the Fingers and capture Snakewood, Coldwater Burn, Heart’s Home, and Longbow Hall. Attack Old Anchor and Ironoaks. 

13. Take over the rest of the Vale, and try to capture the Gates of the Moon before winter. This will mean that when winter comes either the Arryns in the Eyrie will stay up there and freeze, or surrender.

14. Victory! Probably the weakest part of my plan is getting the Reach on my side, since Loras Tyrell is friends with Renly and the Reach is closely knit with the Stormlands. Thanks for reading!

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