M-m-m-my Corona! NCOVID-19 #5

[Fragile Bird]

14 hours ago, Triskele said:

What's the question?

Trisk, my dear, your mailbox is full! Mine is at 83%.

[DMC]

7 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

But to your first part, are you aware of any studies that look at everything collapsing at once globally? I know that’s a bit of an overstatement, but it is a possibility.

Well, no.  Mainly because I don't think there are any examples of "everything collapsing at once" since the Great Depression.  And obviously the Great Depression was before the behaviorist movement that fundamentally changed political science as a discipline (well, there were a few trailblazers during/right before then, but in general).

[Pebble thats Stubby]

Can anyone tell me if blasting a hair dryer down your throat a few times a day is actually going to cause you harm?

 

Yes I'm asking for a friend.

 

really.

 

My friend thinks the hot air will kill coronavirus and any infection they might have picked up in the really early stage before you know you have it.

I know that bollox.  I just want to know if such things will harm my friend so I can inform them of the facts.  not that its likely to help.

[A wilding]

My medical advisor says it is very likely to give you a sore throat ...

(Drying out membranes that are supposed to stay damp, or something like that.)

[Zorral]

From a very old US friend who decamped some years ago to live in Hong Kong:

Quote

 

Yesterday at 6:48 PM ·
Letter to my US friends:

I'm writing this from Hong Kong, where we have been dealing with the coronavirus since the end of January. Hong Kong has been able to fight back the contagion, even though we have an inept, politicized government, and even though we are right on the border with China (which has stayed open through all of this!!!!). Along with Taiwan and Singapore, we have the lowest numbers of cases in Asia (only about 130 in a city of 7.5 million).

You are going through what we went through here in February. Since we're about six weeks ahead of the US on the virus timeline, I'd like to offer a few suggestions about how you can protect each other, based on what Hong Kongers have been doing.

First of all, please try not to panic! But do be ready to (at least temporarily) get very, very OCD about your personal habits. Two major areas of concern:

A: Things you touch.

Basically you don't want to touch ANYTHING with your hands that's been handled by others, and if you have to touch something like a pen, an ATM screen, a door handle, whatever, make it a habit to IMMEDIATELY clean your hands with hand sanitizer. Learn how to open doors with your body or an elbow or a foot. Just be aware of what you put your hands on and try not to touch anything.

Wash your hands several times a day, and not just at home! Get into the habit of doing hand washing "pit stops" whenever you spot a clean public restroom. (Oh--and not to be gross here, but if you do have to use a public restroom, CLOSE THE TOILET LID before flushing. The virus can spread in, um, mist)

My "kit" for when I go out now includes:

1. my own pen (so I don't have to sign things with a communal pen, and it also works for pressing elevator buttons)

2. A small squeeze bottle of alcohol-based sanitizer (it should be 70% alcohol, read the ingredient fine print before purchase and do NOT rely on sanitizer that is made with other chemicals because it isn't as effective--I think Purell is non-alcohol. If the label says "flammable" you have the good stuff.)

3. a bunch of those alcohol prep pads that come in sealed foil packets. These are so I can wipe down my iPhone from time to time, to make sure it's clean. I also use the alcohol pads to clean my computer keyboard, and my KEYS (the virus lingers on metaI). I don't trust the sanitizer wipes, most of them don't have alcohol.

4. A cotton glove--at first I was wearing gloves all the time, but it's actually easier to keep your hands clean than it is to wash contaminated stuff all the time, so I now just keep a glove for situations like a subway, where I might have to hang on to a pole, or the supermarket, where I might have to hold the handle of a basket or cart.

B: Surgical Masks

Yes, I know that our US "experts" have been saying that they are not useful, however this is the ONE practice that we think has made an enormous difference in Hong Kong. Italians didn't put on masks. Hong Kongers, Singaporeans, Taiwanese and most of the rest of Asia are doing it. Here in HK about 99 percent of people are wearing them in public places. I recommend the regular surgical mask, the paper kind. Don't bother with the N95, which is uncomfortable, and kind of overkill.

The experts all say that "masks don't work". It's true that they won't protect you from 100% of virus particles. But in a densely packed city like Hong Kong, or New York, the point of a mask is not to protect yourself--it is a community effort to protect OTHERS. It works if the majority of people cooperate and do it TOGETHER. This virus is spread by carriers who don't have any symptoms, so you have to visualize yourself as a potential carrier and wear it even if you are not feeling ill. Please consider taking up mask-wearing in crowded, closed public places. I hope it catches on in New York City. Personally I would not go on ANY public transport without a surgical mask right now.

IMPORTANT: When you take off the mask, DON"T TOUCH THE OUTSIDE, only handle it by the side loops. It's contaminated! Keep a little plastic baggie on hand to put the mask in after you use it. And DON'T RE-USE a surgical mask--use a new one every time.

Both the obsessive hand hygiene and the mask wearing sound--and at first feel--ridiculous. But seriously it is the major reason why Hong Kong has dodged this bullet against all odds. I've watched in awe these last few weeks as the community came together to protect the people, when the government would not.

The one advantage we have had in Hong Kong is that we have a decent public hospital and health care system. Anyone can go into the ER here, pay about $15 bucks, and get checked and treated and hospitalized if need be. Hospital costs about $15 a day here. What's more Hong Kong has a robust center for disease control that is transparent (we know about EVERY new case as it is discovered, and how it was introduced, and where the sick people have been living and visiting). These are things we don't have in the USA, and it is abominable that we don't. We must demand Medicare for All, nothing less will do. In an epidemic like this we are only as strong and safe as our weakest link.

 

~~~~~~

Ya.  Here we don't have tests, masks, gloves or health care.
 

[Fez]

Bit of a surreal moment here right now. I live in a large apartment building, and pretty much everything is shut down from the virus. Fitness center closed, common rooms closed, gotta get your own packages out of the package room, office staff only available by phone or email, maintenance folks responding only to emergency requests (from residents; they're still doing regular maintenance for the building). So everyone's hunkered down. And just a moment ago I heard a loud engine reving up outside. I go out onto the balcony, and I see that down by the pool there's a maintenance guy. He's taken off the winter pool cover and starting to clean the pool with a power washer.

Which would be the most normal thing imaginable if this were ordinary times. But with everything going on, it strikes me as so odd that the maintenance team still has this on their to-do list and that they're getting started on it. It wouldn't open until Memorial Day even if there weren't a virus. And I suspect it'll be much later in the summer, if at all, that anyone actually gets to use the thing.

[Pebble thats Stubby]

4 minutes ago, A wilding said:

My medical advisor says it is very likely to give you a sore throat ...

(Drying out membranes that are supposed to stay damp, or something like that.)

so its likely to make them think they are coming down with something (a saw throat often happens before any cough) , and make them blast it down even more.  I'm not sure I have the energy needed to talk sense into them.

[Maithanet]

If their throat gets dry, they could always use a cleansing wash, like bleach or something. 

[DMC]

10 minutes ago, Fez said:

Bit of a surreal moment here right now. I live in a large apartment building, and pretty much everything is shut down from the virus. Fitness center closed, common rooms closed, gotta get your own packages out of the package room, office staff only available by phone or email, maintenance folks responding only to emergency requests (from residents; they're still doing regular maintenance for the building). So everyone's hunkered down.

Yeah my apartment complex shut everything down on Monday..I think.  I was curious because there are a lot of old women that live in the complex and they usually congregate in the lounge area of the lobby - wondered if the posted notice would make them stop.  I haven't seen anyone using it since, so it appears the notice worked in that regard.  Last week it was very hard to prevent myself from yelling every time I saw them (which is often since I go outside to the parking lot to smoke) "get away from each other before you all die!"

Surprised they're already starting to open up the pool.  IIRC ours opens up on Memorial Day too, but I don't think they usually start working on that til the beginning of May, or at the earliest mid-April.

[3CityApache]

Ok, dumb question. I keep hearing that expectation the pandemic will die out when it gets warmer on the northern hemisphere makes no sense, and one of the main arguments is that virus comfortably lives inside a human organism, at the temperature of minimum 36,6. But the flu virus also lives inside our bodies, and yet we don't have problems with the flu during summer, do we? Why is that different? Am I missing something?

[Fragile Bird]

2 minutes ago, 3CityApache said:

Ok, dumb question. I keep hearing that expectation the pandemic will die out when it gets warmer on the northern hemisphere makes no sense, and one of the main arguments is that virus comfortably lives inside a human organism, at the temperature of minimum 36,6. But the flu virus also lives inside our body, and yet we don't have problems with the flu during summer, do we? Why is that different? Am I missing something?

Well, it is summer in Australia...

eta: actually first day of fall, but Australia has had cases for weeks, now over 700.

[Darth Richard II]

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/evangeline-lilly-wont-self-isolate-suggests-coronavirus-hoax-election-year-171931821.html

Welp, respect for her just went to 0.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

1 hour ago, maarsen said:

To see how people react think back to 9/11 and all the planes in the air that landed their passengers in a small town of 10,00 called Gander in Newfoundland. Almost 7000 passengers landed there severely straining resources. And yes Gander coped.

I appreciate that.  But a few days is very different from a few months.

[Lollygag]

1 hour ago, Pebble thats Stubby said:

Can anyone tell me if blasting a hair dryer down your throat a few times a day is actually going to cause you harm?

 

Yes I'm asking for a friend.

 

really.

 

My friend thinks the hot air will kill coronavirus and any infection they might have picked up in the really early stage before you know you have it.

I know that bollox.  I just want to know if such things will harm my friend so I can inform them of the facts.  not that its likely to help.

Tell them to use steam instead.

Adding - dryness isn't a good idea.

https://www.cleveland.com/news/2020/03/how-humidity-could-help-fight-coronavirus.html

Quote

Most of the research on this topic has to do with influenza, because of its reemergence during the winter and because of the negative impact it has during the colder months, Dr. Amy Edwards, an infectious disease specialist at UH Rainbow Babies and Children’s Hospital said.

“It is probably specific to some viruses," Edwards said. "Whether this coronavirus is one -- I guess we’ll see in a couple months.”

...

And low humidity can dry out the mucus that normally coats your nose and airways, making it easier to get infected, according to the Cleveland Clinic. It can also dry out the skin on your lips and your eyes.

 

[IheartIheartTesla]

Big jump in Michigan cases to 300, and our medium sized town (~35k) has its first confirmed case. I imagine my employers will be asking us to work from home pretty soon. As for now we are not required to do so, but they will escalate based on a few metrics.

I just set up some experiments that take a few weeks to reach equilibrium, so at least I'll have something waiting for me when I get back in,

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

39 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

Well, it is summer in Australia...

eta: actually first day of fall, but Australia has had cases for weeks, now over 700.

Yeah, but they've got the criminals blood rushing through their veins. Bad sample to extrapolate from.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

24 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I appreciate that.  But a few days is very different from a few months.

As worth noting a key difference, 9/11 didn't directly impact everyone. If this was just in one country, even one of the bigger ones, and wasn't going to spread outside of its borders, the world could collectively handle it fairly easily. The fact that it's hitting us all largely at the same time complicates things greatly.

[Reny of Storms End]

Governor of PA just went from suggesting all non-essential business close to officially ordering that they close. 

[Fragile Bird]

3 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

As worth noting a key difference, 9/11 didn't directly impact everyone. If this was just in one country, even one of the bigger ones, and wasn't going to spread outside of its borders, the world could collectively handle it fairly easily. The fact that it's hitting us all largely at the same time complicates things greatly.

I hate to tell you this, but it did impact the rest of the world.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

3 minutes ago, Reny of Storms End said:

Governor of PA just went from suggesting all non-essential business close to officially ordering that they close. 

How is he defining “Essential”?