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James Steller

Will we ever find out what happened to the Winterfell small folk?

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The last we heard of the various servants of a Winterfell, they were taken to the Dreadfort, and their fate remains unknown. We know how Ramsay treats the women in his captivity, as well as men like Theon. 
Part of me is really hoping that the Winterfell folk are all still alive and healthy, but that seems depressingly unlikely, given how long they’ve been captives of Ramsay. Part of me doesn’t want to know just how gruesomely they died, but I’m still curious and partly hopeful.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on this? 

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I think they are mostly dead. 

I think the younger girls like Beth Cassel and Joseth's daughters, Turnip, might still be alive, working in the Dreadfort. But I think Palla is dead. 

I think Old Nan might be dead too, which is just pretty sad if her long life ended in the dungeons of the Dreadfort.

So this was a depressing exercise.

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I agree w/ @Alexis-something-Rose. Unless if by “mostly dead” she means they’ve all been zombified by Roose ‘Bolt-On’. :eek:

Only joking... but yes, I don’t expect to see many survivors, if any at all. I think it’s also possible the young girls may have been hunted down, which is even worse. 

And Old Nan, the thought that she may have ended her long life in some filthy dungeon at the Dreadfort is just too sad and depressing. :crying:

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1 minute ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

I meant most likely.

My brain stopped working. 

Oh, I know! I was only joking... 

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1 hour ago, James Steller said:

The last we heard of the various servants of a Winterfell, they were taken to the Dreadfort, and their fate remains unknown. We know how Ramsay treats the women in his captivity, as well as men like Theon. 
Part of me is really hoping that the Winterfell folk are all still alive and healthy, but that seems depressingly unlikely, given how long they’ve been captives of Ramsay. Part of me doesn’t want to know just how gruesomely they died, but I’m still curious and partly hopeful.

Does anyone else have any thoughts on this? 

Alive? I am sure most of them are still alive. We know a lot about how Roose Bolton rules from Arya's time in Harrenhal. It wasn't pleasant.

Healthy? LOL....that's hilarious. They are prisoners of the Dreadfort is the seat of Roose Bolton and has been held by Ramsay Bolton. 

I, for one, don't believe Old Nan is dead. Not only do I think she is still alive but she has a part to play in the things to come. Namely the return of Bran Stark and big reveal of Jon Snow's true identity. As a matter of fact, she might be the one character Martin regretted killing and became the cause of one of his many rewrites...

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7 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

As a matter of fact, she might be the one character Martin regretted killing and became the cause of one of his many rewrites...

As much as it would be nice to see Old Nan again, I’m still keeping my fingers crossed that the character GRRM regretted killing Shireen (assuming that she was always meant to die, which is messed up and I refuse to believe Stannis would do that, not until it’s black on white.)

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, James Steller said:

As much as it would be nice to see Old Nan again, I’m still keeping my fingers crossed that the character GRRM regretted killing Shireen (assuming that she was always meant to die, which is messed up and I refuse to believe Stannis would do that, not until it’s black on white.)

Why Shireen? Is Shireen even that important to the plot? There's no reason to believe that she isn't going to die anyways.

Matter of fact...the better question is why do you refuse to believe Stannis would do that? You do remember that this is the same Stannis who was willing to sacrifice Edric Storm just so that he could get the Iron Throne and wanted to kill Davos for preventing said sacrifice? Why would he not sacrifice Shireen if it meant getting the Iron Throne, saving Westeros and preventing a global apocalypse?

Edited by BlackLightning

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8 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

Matter of fact...the better question is why do you refuse to believe Stannis would do that? You do remember that this is the same Stannis who was willing to sacrifice Edric Storm just so that he could get the Iron Throne and wanted to kill Davos for preventing said sacrifice? Why would he not sacrifice Shireen if it meant getting the Iron Throne, saving Westeros and preventing a global apocalypse?

Shireen is his only heir(ess) and "future" of House Baratheon. So it would insane to kill her unless Stannis could be sure that he would somehow find another heir.

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Just now, Loose Bolt said:

Shireen is his only heir(ess) and "future" of House Baratheon. So it would insane to kill her unless Stannis could be sure that he would somehow find another heir.

Now who is saying that Stannis is the one who would kill or otherwise endanger her. Stannis is about a 100 miles away at the moment. Queen Selyse and her men pose a bigger threat to Shireen than Stannis does. And all of them are followers of the red god.

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8 hours ago, BlackLightning said:

Now who is saying that Stannis is the one who would kill or otherwise endanger her. Stannis is about a 100 miles away at the moment. Queen Selyse and her men pose a bigger threat to Shireen than Stannis does. And all of them are followers of the red god.

Exactly. I don’t believe Stannis would sacrifice his heir to the Iron Throne when he clearly doesn’t believe in the gods. Even Mel thinks Stannis isn’t really faithful, married to duty instead. But Selyse? Mel herself? I’d totally see them doing that. Stannis will do a lot, but he won’t kill his own daughter. And Stannis was at his lowest during the Edric Storm situation, clinging to Mel as one of his last loyal followers. Davos’s storyline is literally saving the king from himself and Mel’s domination. It’s no surprise that Stannis’s fortunes grow once he listens to Davos again. And Mel is even utilized into doing useful things, such as burning Orell’s eagle to avoid the wildlings being aware of what’s coming for them.

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Theyre not dead. By and large Im sure theyre almost all alive. Maybe some girls went missing. Old Nans probably alive, no reason to murder her.

Whats the point of rescuing the smallfolk and then torching the castle to hide your crimes? You either kill all the smallfolk (if theyre witnesses) or bring them in as refugees from the "Ironborns massacre", like trophies.

Smallfolk can be useful in their own way, no reason to make them walk from Winterfell if theyre just gonna kill em at home.

41 minutes ago, James Steller said:

Exactly. I don’t believe Stannis would sacrifice his heir to the Iron Throne when he clearly doesn’t believe in the gods. Even Mel thinks Stannis isn’t really faithful, married to duty instead. But Selyse? Mel herself? I’d totally see them doing that. Stannis will do a lot, but he won’t kill his own daughter. And Stannis was at his lowest during the Edric Storm situation, clinging to Mel as one of his last loyal followers. Davos’s storyline is literally saving the king from himself and Mel’s domination. It’s no surprise that Stannis’s fortunes grow once he listens to Davos again. And Mel is even utilized into doing useful things, such as burning Orell’s eagle to avoid the wildlings being aware of what’s coming for them.

Davos' storyline is like that because Mel willed it. He didnt save Stannis, he put it on hold. Stannis doesnt understand the gravity of kinslaying (Hi Renly!), he understood the gravity of the Wall however. 

Why would Mel will it? Idk, but the obvious answer is preparation for a Shireen cook off

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Theon Greyjoy decides that Old Nan is most likely dead. Which has to mean she's alive and well, right? 

TBF, we know what Ramsey does to his captives so I think George is sparing the reader a lot of grief by leaving it be. 

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I'd like to know what happened to Old Nan, specifically, but I assume the others are simply dead, and quite a few might have been flayed, tortured to death, etc. Others may not even have survived the sacking of Winterfell or the march to the Dreadfort.

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2 hours ago, Lord Varys said:

I'd like to know what happened to Old Nan, specifically, but I assume the others are simply dead, and quite a few might have been flayed, tortured to death, etc. Others may not even have survived the sacking of Winterfell or the march to the Dreadfort.

Lord Manderly told Davos that, from time to time, a girl escapes, so I expect there are a handful in White Harbor.  Could be useful for ID purposes if Arya, for example,were to show up.

I expect Ramsay has killed most of the teens and young women.  Some children and older women, like Beth Cassell and Old Nan, may still be alive.

If the series is completed, we will probably find out who survived and who didn't.

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41 minutes ago, Nevets said:

 

 

If the series is completed, we will probably find out who survived and who didn't.

Thing is, I don’t know if we’ll ever know about everyone’s fates, given how GRRM likes to write. Plus, will we even want to know about what poor Beth Cassel probably experienced before she died? Old Nan? It could quite be a bitter pill to swallow. 

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3 minutes ago, James Steller said:

Thing is, I don’t know if we’ll ever know about everyone’s fates, given how GRRM likes to write. Plus, will we even want to know about what poor Beth Cassel probably experienced before she died? Old Nan? It could quite be a bitter pill to swallow. 

Maybe GRRM will include a detail where one of the Bastards' Girls is named Beth, and presumably about several thousand hearts will crack.

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1 hour ago, Canon Claude said:

Maybe GRRM will include a detail where one of the Bastards' Girls is named Beth, and presumably about several thousand hearts will crack.

I'm sure of it.  Another dog will be named Nan.

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