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Stayin' Alive - Covid-19 #10


Fragile Bird

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Just now, Fragile Bird said:

Sorry, I was chasing links and came across a news story that researchers in Wuhan looked at 2,000 blood samples and found that people with high cholesterol had better outcomes against Covid-19. I tried to duplicate my search but could not find the article. I had also found a article from the 1990s suggesting cholesterol helped fight the flu. The article pointed out that statins interfere with the flu vaccine.

 

I think you and I have read the same article, and I am similarly unable to recreate my search results.

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1 minute ago, Bonnot OG said:

Wisconsin Republicans are trying to kill black people in Milwaukee with this virus by forcing voting to happen during the pandemic and making sure a city of 600,000 only has 5 polling stations.

The fact that this isn't criminal is just...I don't even fucking know.

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6 hours ago, Jen'ari said:

Thanks for clearing that up, like I say it’s not something I know much about, despite the scar on my arm and it not being pleasant at the time it’s a shot I’d still rather have had than not.

Is the body capable of fighting off TB on its own?, from the little I know about it, I’d always assumed it was fatal, but it killed people off in a very long and slow way pre 20th Century.

My father had TB as a child and spent 2 years in a sanitorium until he got better. That was in the 1930s before antibiotics. 

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4 hours ago, Fragile Bird said:

Sorry, I was chasing links and came across a news story that researchers in Wuhan looked at 2,000 blood samples and found that people with high cholesterol had better outcomes against Covid-19.

eta: the role of cholesterol in fighting infections has been studied for a long time, I gather. I tried searching cholesterol and infections.

Shit, never thought I would be glad to have high cholesterol - granted, it's high but sufficiently under control and never seemed to cause any serious risk to the point I haven't yet bothered to fix my diet; having great results from electrocardiography didn't help. First thing I checked when they listed the usual conditions for "at-risk" people (like diabetes or respiratory problems) was if cholesterol was in, and I was very relieved that it's not.

I've wondered for some time if higher cholesterol wouldn't help for various diseases/infections because it allows for the rapid creation of new cells - either to replace those destroyed by infection or to create white cells faster. But I've really no idea what the biggest bottleneck in cells components would be. (though I really wondered if my cholesterol level would decrease when I had that one nasty flu once).

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33 minutes ago, Clueless Northman said:

Shit, never thought I would be glad to have high cholesterol - granted, it's high but sufficiently under control and never seemed to cause any serious risk to the point I haven't yet bothered to fix my diet; having great results from electrocardiography didn't help. First thing I checked when they listed the usual conditions for "at-risk" people (like diabetes or respiratory problems) was if cholesterol was in, and I was very relieved that it's not.

I've wondered for some time if higher cholesterol wouldn't help for various diseases/infections because it allows for the rapid creation of new cells - either to replace those destroyed by infection or to create white cells faster. But I've really no idea what the biggest bottleneck in cells components would be. (though I really wondered if my cholesterol level would decrease when I had that one nasty flu once).

One of the stories I saw about flu research had graphs showing how cholesterol levels drop as the body fights the flu, but afterwards they rise again.

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3 hours ago, The Great Unwashed said:

Hydroxychloroquine shortages for lupus and arthritis patients due to Trump promoting unproven treatment.

Here's and interesting Youtube about this drug, and a cautionary tale. Seems like interesting potential mechanisms for action against Coronavirus. Still as yet unproven, but definitely a promising avenue. The video says HCQ(?) is FDA approved for hospital use only where patients can be closely monitored, dosing can be tightly controlled and drugs that can make side effects worse be avoided.

If those strictures are properly followed there should not be a shortage for auto-immune patients. So that might suggest irresponsible prescribing, or black market distribution and self-medication.

No idea about the bona fides of the youtuber, but he sounds like he knows what he's talking about and doesn't seem to be talking in extremes either way or looking to get all political.

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2 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

Here's and interesting Youtube about this drug, and a cautionary tale. Seems like interesting potential mechanisms for action against Coronavirus. Still as yet unproven, but definitely a promising avenue. The video says HCQ(?) is FDA approved for hospital use only where patients can be closely monitored, dosing can be tightly controlled and drugs that can make side effects worse be avoided.

If those strictures are properly followed there should not be a shortage for auto-immune patients. So that might suggest irresponsible prescribing, or black market distribution and self-medication.

No idea about the bona fides of the youtuber, but he sounds like he knows what he's talking about and doesn't seem to be talking in extremes either way or looking to get all political.

I'm not coming down on one side or another wrt to hydroxychloroquine (other than wanting it to be prescribed responsibly).

I will say that I have rheumatoid arthritis and was initially prescribed hydroxychloroquine, and as a healthy 39 year old (other than having an autoimmune disorder), the side effects I experienced while taking it were no joke. I had to stop taking it and was then prescribed methotrexate, which worked well for me for a while until my ex-wife was diagnosed with cancer, I found out we were both taking the same medication, and then I read about the black box warning for it and stopped taking it (I'm currently not medicated for my arthritis, due to the current situation).

I've also experienced shortages of medication that I needed to function on a regular basis (for mental and not physical health), and know how debilitating that can be. People who need the drug shouldn't have to go without just because our idiot President got a bug up his ass about a drug that he doesn't understand and that he has a motivated interest in selling.

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7 hours ago, Bonnot OG said:

Wisconsin Republicans are trying to kill black people in Milwaukee with this virus by forcing voting to happen during the pandemic and making sure a city of 600,000 only has 5 polling stations.

In case someone was going to tone police and say you can't attribute the worst motives, let me jump in and frame the absolute best case (which is very unlikely):

They are showing a callous indifference to the loss of life they are causing in the process of attempting to subvert the democratic process by blocking the voting rights of hundres of thousands of people they know are likely to vote Democrat, or in other words while attempting to steal the election. 

Not that the people who would tone police this shit will agree that stealing an election in this fashion is a problem, its all part of the game and both sides do it! Or some shit like that. So yeah, lets go with your framing, these fuckers are trying to kill black people with the same act as attempting to steal an election.

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20 minutes ago, karaddin said:

In case someone was going to tone police and say you can't attribute the worst motives, let me jump in and frame the absolute best case (which is very unlikely):

They are showing a callous indifference to the loss of life they are causing in the process of attempting to subvert the democratic process by blocking the voting rights of hundres of thousands of people they know are likely to vote Democrat, or in other words while attempting to steal the election. 

Not that the people who would tone police this shit will agree that stealing an election in this fashion is a problem, its all part of the game and both sides do it! Or some shit like that. So yeah, lets go with your framing, these fuckers are trying to kill black people with the same act as attempting to steal an election.

Republican actions here are truly heinous, and I desperately hope Wisconsin voters remember where to direct their anger.

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Japan State of Emergency, some bullet points from a confidential source:

Quote

·       PM Abe has declared a state of emergency in Japan, and outlined the implications for citizens in the seven affected prefectures (Tokyo, Chiba, Kanagawa, Saitama, Osaka, Hyogo, and Fukuoka) in a speech to the nation. 

·       There will be some key differences to lockdowns observed elsewhere in the world: restaurants and public baths will be permitted to operate (BUT most other entertainment, sporting, and leisure providers will be asked to close); and roads and public transport will remain open.  There will be no enforcement mechanism or police powers to supervise citizens’ response, but it is generally expected that compliance with the Prime Minister’s requests will be high. 

·       Companies have been slow to actively require working from home, and it is unclear whether the state of emergency will deliver a paradigm shift in commuting behaviour. 

·       There have already been mixed messages from the Central Government and Prefectural Governors on essential services, creating potential for public confusion.

Seems like sort of applying the same approach as Sweden. We'll see how that turns out. Official numbers in Sweden ~1:1300, translated to Japan's population that would be 97,000 cases. Let's hope it doesn't come to that. Japan looked like it might have had things under control right at the end of March, but then it suddenly looks like it's entered an exponential growth phase. If the public transport system remains crowded in the major metro centres things could turn pretty bad pretty quickly. Risky.

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1 minute ago, Triskele said:

Wanted click something hard on this but found that none of the four buttons quite worked for what I was feeling.  Sure, I'm sad.  But I'd rather express rage. 

But remember, you can't accuse it of being racist. They love black people who vote R, and Candace Owens is black, so they can't be racist.

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One day a couple of weeks ago I was shocked at reports from Italy that over 700 people had died in a single day.  Read on CNN a few minutes ago that at least 800 people died in NYC on Tuesday.  Can’t even imagine what that must look like on the front lines.  Really hope NYC is about to turn the corner.  Stay safe out there, y’all.

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1 hour ago, Triskele said:

Props man, on your understanding of the US American right's "we can't be racist" thing....you've got it. 

Don’t you know Lincoln freed the slaves?!

He was a Republican!

:mellow:

 

Edit: Shoot. This is the Covid thread, not U.S. politics. Better make a Covid comment. 

Never mind my math is way too far off right now. 

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50 minutes ago, S John said:

One day a couple of weeks ago I was shocked at reports from Italy that over 700 people had died in a single day.  Read on CNN a few minutes ago that at least 800 people died in NYC on Tuesday.  Can’t even imagine what that must look like on the front lines.  Really hope NYC is about to turn the corner.  Stay safe out there, y’all.

I think it's going to be a while. As you can see from this page, the number of new cases is still increasing about as quickly as it has been in the past couple of weeks. The fundamental problem is this: it's the densest city in the country and while it's not as crowded as usual, it's still pretty packed. The subways and buses are running on a reduced schedule so people who still need to go to work (grocery workers, nurses, firemen, etc.) wind up in rush hour commutes that are nearly as dense as usual (fewer people, but also fewer trains so the density is similar).

Also, even the people who either work from home or don't work at all still have to go out for groceries. In theory, there is a bunch of these online delivery services, but in practice, they're all 2-3 times as expensive as the grocery store and, more importantly, it's very difficult to get a delivery slot -- the last time I tried, all but one of them were booked for as far out as they allow booking. And the grocery stores are pretty crowded too; there's just no way two people passing each other in an aisle are more than 3 feet from each other, never mind 6 feet. Finally, the last time I was at a grocery store, I distinctly heard two of the cashiers coughing under their masks...

The only realistic way New York City gets better is some form of herd immunity, at least among the people who have to go to work every day. If we were better prepared, we could, for example, require that anyone poking their nose outdoors wear an N95 mask, but we currently don't have enough of these masks even for health workers so getting enough for the general population is not realistic.

Nevertheless, thank you for wishing us well. :)

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6 hours ago, maarsen said:

My father had TB as a child and spent 2 years in a sanitorium until he got better. That was in the 1930s before antibiotics. 

That’s a very long recovery time, I’m glad he recovered though, must have been very tough.

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13 hours ago, Jen'ari said:

 

Is the body capable of fighting off TB on its own?, from the little I know about it, I’d always assumed it was fatal, but it killed people off in a very long and slow way pre 20th Century.

There is a great book called The Plague and I by Betty MacDonald about her time in a TB sanitarium in 1937-38. She was lucky and could leave, cured. Her treatment was extreme bedrest for a long period, as they knew in some people the lungs sort of enclosed the infected parts off so it ceased to spread, and they wanted you basically to make minimum use of your lungs and stay very calm. She emerged quite fat. There were a lot of operations they performed also to give relief although they sound extremely gruesome, like basically deflating a lung and stuff like that. The purpose of the santoriums was also it seems, indirectly, from the book, to get people out of circulation. Mothers got priority and while in her case her children could stay with her mother, in other cases the kinds went into a children's home on site. I presume they got priority partly to protect their children from them. There are different types of TB - elsewhere I have seen them described as galloping (like the Brontes) or a slower variety that George Orwell and Katherine Mansfield had. In the book Betty MacDonald mentions a bit about different types but not using that loose classification.

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