was Margaery's bride cloak a Lannister cloak?

[Brother Seamus]

I'm rereading SoS and it seems pretty clear that the bride cloak Joffrey puts on Margaery at their wedding is a Lannister cloak; it says it was given to him by Cersei but belonged to her mother before her.

Any explanation? Did I misunderstand?

[Vaith]

Cersei's mother, Joanna Lannister, was herself born a Lannister and was a first cousin of Tywin. So she was both born and married a Lannister.

[kissdbyfire]

24 minutes ago, Vaith said:

Cersei's mother, Joanna Lannister, was herself born a Lannister and was a first cousin of Tywin. So she was both born and married a Lannister.

I thought the question is, why wasn’t it a Baratheon cloak, since Joffrey is supposed to be Joffrey Baratheon, first of his name, yadda yadda yadda.

[Vaith]

1 minute ago, kissdbyfire said:

I thought the question is, why wasn’t it a Baratheon cloak, since Joffrey is supposed to be Joffrey Baratheon, first of his name, yadda yadda yadda.

Ah, okay. Well, it seems to be down to Cersei's preferences, and her personal sentimentality about the cloak.

In AFFC a Baratheon cloak is used, because Olenna notes how using the Lannister cloak would not be seen as customary.

Quote

When it was time for the changing of the cloaks, the bride sank gracefully to her knees and Tommen covered her with the heavy cloth-of-gold monstrosity that Robert had cloaked Cersei in on their own wedding day, with the crowned stag of Baratheon worked upon its back in beads of onyx. Cersei had wanted to use the fine red silk cloak Joffrey had used. "It was the cloak my lord father used when he wed my lady mother," she explained to the Tyrells, but the Queen of Thorns had balked her in that as well. "That old thing?" the crone had said. "It looks a bit threadbare to me . . . and dare I say, unlucky? And wouldn't a stag be more fitting for King Robert's trueborn son? In my day a bride donned her husband's colors, not his lady mother's."
Thanks to Stannis and his filthy letter, there were already too many rumors concerning Tommen's parentage. Cersei dared not fan the fires by insisting that he drape his bride in Lannister crimson, so she yielded as gracefully as she could. But the sight of all that gold and onyx still filled her with resentment. The more we give these Tyrells, the more they demand of us.

 

[frenin]

1 hour ago, kissdbyfire said:

I thought the question is, why wasn’t it a Baratheon cloak, since Joffrey is supposed to be Joffrey Baratheon, first of his name, yadda yadda yadda.

I don't remember well that scene but it's perfectly explainable. Asos  was the height of Lannister's power, it really didn't matter who Joffrey was, Tywin was alive and had won, he was firmly on the drivers seat now, so... People could forgive an slip here and there. Cersei and Tommen aren't in a similar position in AFFC, they are clearly holding Robert on because the Throne seems so slippery without it. 

Had Tywin lived, the time may have come for the Lannisters to go public... So, Thanks Tyrion??

[kissdbyfire]

1 minute ago, Vaith said:

Ah, okay. Well, it seems to be down to Cersei's preferences

Definitely agree. 

[kissdbyfire]

And Joffrey’s coat of arms are both, right? 

[frenin]

4 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

And Joffrey’s coat of arms are both, right? 

True but there is only one cloak per  family and his last name isn't Lannister. I feel like that was a clear declaration  of intentions  and everyone budged.

[kissdbyfire]

7 minutes ago, frenin said:

True but there is only one cloak per  family and his last name isn't Lannister. I feel like that was a clear declaration  of intentions  and everyone budged.

I agree. No one is more power hungry and grasping than Cersei, and what you said, back then Tywin was on a roll. 

[Alexis-something-Rose]

Got to love Cersei for this, though. Her pride knows no bounds. That exchange with Olenna quoted above with her putting the screws to Cersei was fun.

Stannis's filthy letter. Never change, Cersei.

[kissdbyfire]

1 minute ago, Alexis-something-Rose said:

Got to love Cersei for this, though. Her pride knows no bounds. That exchange with Olenna quoted above with her putting the screws to Cersei was fun.

Stannis's filthy letter. Never change, Cersei.

Yeah, so true! 

[frenin]

12 minutes ago, kissdbyfire said:

I agree. No one is more power hungry and grasping than Cersei, and what you said, back then Tywin was on a roll. 

Her father sure is, i think that it's more Tywin's thing than Cersei's, he was the one trying to severe any ties his grandkids could have with their Baratheon "ancestry" and he wanted them fully Lannister. And Cersei's only power during ASOS only was fucking with his brother... The little one... Metaphorically.

 

[kissdbyfire]

36 minutes ago, frenin said:

Her father sure is, i think that it's more Tywin's thing than Cersei's, he was the one trying to severe any ties his grandkids could have with their Baratheon "ancestry" and he wanted them fully Lannister. And Cersei's only power during ASOS only was fucking with his brother... The little one... Metaphorically.

 

I wasn’t clear. Tywin has actual power, Cersei wants it. 

[Seams]

I've always been intrigued in the descriptions of Renly that there is an integration of Baratheon gold with green:

Quote

In their midst, watching and laughing with his young queen by his side, sat a ghost in a golden crown.

Small wonder the lords gather around him with such fervor, she thought, he is Robert come again. Renly was handsome as Robert had been handsome; long of limb and broad of shoulder, with the same coal-black hair, fine and straight, the same deep blue eyes, the same easy smile. The slender circlet around his brows seemed to suit him well. It was soft gold, a ring of roses exquisitely wrought; at the front lifted a stag's head of dark green jade, adorned with golden eyes and golden antlers.

The crowned stag decorated the king's green velvet tunic as well, worked in gold thread upon his chest; the Baratheon sigil in the colors of Highgarden. The girl who shared the high seat with him was also of Highgarden: his young queen, Margaery, daughter to Lord Mace Tyrell. Their marriage was the mortar that held the great southron alliance together, Catelyn knew. Renly was one-and-twenty, the girl no older than Robb, very pretty, with a doe's soft eyes and a mane of curling brown hair that fell about her shoulders in lazy ringlets. Her smile was shy and sweet.

The mother of Robert, Stannis and Renly was Cassana Estermont, and House Estermont is heavily associated with green (green on green sea turtle sigil and the family's seat is at Greenstone). But I don't see the green connection as strongly with Stannis or Robert, so I'm thinking that the Tyrell connection gave Renly an especially strong green identity.

There are several references to the walls of green silk of his pavilion (where he dies) and to his (magical) green armor. He also pulls a peach from his cloak when he is talking to Stannis, and we associate peaches with Highgarden because Robert sings the praises of peaches from the Reach when he goes into the Winterfell crypt with Ned.

I bring this up because it seems as if Renly wears the "cloak" of House Tyrell after his marriage.

Before the Tommen wedding, the imagery of Margaery dressed in Baratheon gold seems non-existent. At her wedding to Joffrey, she wears an ivory gown and she changes into a green samite gown for the feast.

[Minsc]

17 hours ago, Seams said:

I've always been intrigued in the descriptions of Renly that there is an integration of Baratheon gold with green:

The mother of Robert, Stannis and Renly was Cassana Estermont, and House Estermont is heavily associated with green (green on green sea turtle sigil and the family's seat is at Greenstone). But I don't see the green connection as strongly with Stannis or Robert, so I'm thinking that the Tyrell connection gave Renly an especially strong green identity.

There are several references to the walls of green silk of his pavilion (where he dies) and to his (magical) green armor. He also pulls a peach from his cloak when he is talking to Stannis, and we associate peaches with Highgarden because Robert sings the praises of peaches from the Reach when he goes into the Winterfell crypt with Ned.

I bring this up because it seems as if Renly wears the "cloak" of House Tyrell after his marriage.

Before the Tommen wedding, the imagery of Margaery dressed in Baratheon gold seems non-existent. At her wedding to Joffrey, she wears an ivory gown and she changes into a green samite gown for the feast.

While Renly seems to like green as a clothing choice it still seems that he used the traditional Baratheon standard for his own standard.

"Renly's own standard flew high over all. From the top of his tallest siege tower, a wheeled oaken immensity covered with rawhides, streamed the largest war banner that Catelyn had ever seen—a cloth big enough to carpet many a hall, shimmering gold, with the crowned stag of Baratheon black upon it, prancing proud and tall."

 

"Renly had chosen a woman to carry his banner as well, though Brienne hid face and form behind plate armor that gave no hint of her sex. Atop her twelve-foot lance, the crowned stag pranced black-on-gold as the wind off the sea rippled the cloth."

[Brother Seamus]

OK. So it definitely not a GRRM mistake, and apparently the "rules" of westeros are flexible enough that Cersei wasn't worried about using Joffrey's mother's family's cloak, even after Stannis' letter. 

 

Question answered. Thanks.