Star Trek: The Wrath of Fans

[DaveSumm]

Yea I just watched the whole thing recently. Archer is a fairly large weakness for the show, they never really settled on exactly who he was. Sometimes he’s an enthusiastic explorer, sometimes he’s angry in a vaguely Kirk kinda way. It’s like they tried to amalgamate all the previous captains and it just ended up a bit wishy washy. Also, Malcolm and the pilot (holy shit I watched it a few months ago and I still don’t know his name) are really weak actors. 

[williamjm]

On 9/22/2020 at 2:21 PM, Caligula_K3 said:

I recently saw an amazing episode that pitted two Weyoun clones against each other. My only regret is that both Weyoun clones didn't survive the episode; it would have been so great to have one Weyoun on DS9 and one on Cardassia.

The Weyouns were good antagonists and they did help the Dominion become more than just a rarely-seen enemy. Jeffrey Coombs has played a lot of different Trek characters in various shows (I remember there's a DS9 episode where he is playing both Weyoun and Brunt) and they do tend to be fun characters, Weyoun is probably the best of them although Shran was one of the more entertaining supporting characters on Enterprise as well.

[RumHam]

2 minutes ago, DaveSumm said:

Yea I just watched the whole thing recently. Archer is a fairly large weakness for the show, they never really settled on exactly who he was. Sometimes he’s an enthusiastic explorer, sometimes he’s angry in a vaguely Kirk kinda way. It’s like they tried to amalgamate all the previous captains and it just ended up a bit wishy washy. Also, Malcolm and the pilot (holy shit I watched it a few months ago and I still don’t know his name) are really weak actors. 

Travis. I just spent ten minutes wracking my brain but his name was Travis. His parents were commercial space explores and beyond that I couldn't tell you a thing about him. 

[Werthead]

Enterprise was solid, a few great episodes but nothing too hot. It didn't have the absolute bottom-of-the-barrel awful eps like Voyager but it's best episodes weren't quite as good. Both shows suffered from really not fleshing out the secondary cast at all. Completely baffling when they had so many episodes, but they had like one episode about Travis and maybe one about Hoshi and that was it for the entire series, whilst T'Pol and - utterly inexplicably - Trip get several multi-episode arcs apiece.

For Voyager I think frigging Naomi Wildman had more characterisation and a more solid arc than Harry or Kes, and she was in less than a dozen episodes. Torres didn't have much more.

[Jaxom 1974]

It's a travesty that they ended Enterprise when they did.  The third season was novel, if not completely solid and the fourth season was finally bringing the show into what it wanted to be, telling the story of the Federation coming together.  

The brilliance of the Mirror Universe 2 parter was that it essentially had nothing to do with the prime Universe.

[sifth]

1 hour ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

It's a travesty that they ended Enterprise when they did.  The third season was novel, if not completely solid and the fourth season was finally bringing the show into what it wanted to be, telling the story of the Federation coming together.  

The brilliance of the Mirror Universe 2 parter was that it essentially had nothing to do with the prime Universe.

I agree, season 4 of Enterprise was really good, IMO

[SpaceChampion]

14 hours ago, sifth said:

I agree, season 4 of Enterprise was really good, IMO

Was that the gas leak year?  Oh, I mean the Xindi arc...     I actually want to go back and watch that because I think i bailed after season one due to grad school.

[sifth]

19 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Was that the gas leak year?  Oh, I mean the Xindi arc...     I actually want to go back and watch that because I think i bailed after season one due to grad school.

I'm not sure if season 4 had any major story arcs. I just remember a lot of stand alone episodes, that were fun.

[RumHam]

1 hour ago, SpaceChampion said:

Was that the gas leak year?  Oh, I mean the Xindi arc...     I actually want to go back and watch that because I think i bailed after season one due to grad school.

Season three was the season long serialized Xindi arc. In season four they basically threw out the whole temporal cold war thing after the premier. 

[Corvinus85]

39 minutes ago, sifth said:

I'm not sure if season 4 had any major story arcs. I just remember a lot of stand alone episodes, that were fun.

Even though there are a lot of smaller, self-contained arcs, season 4 overall had the feel of humanity starting to emerge as a major interstellar power, and things were being setup for the formation of the Federation. There was the arc with that mad scientist played by Peter Weller who was speciest/racist, and didn't want humanity to integrate with other species. There is the 3-parter arc with Arik Soong and his Khan-like augments. Season 4 was also setting up the First Romulan War, which probably would have taking place in season 5 if the show hadn't been cancelled.

[Jaxom 1974]

Season Four essentially threw the baby out with the bath water and essentially reinvented itself by actually looking at existing canon and attempting to make the narrative fit what had come before without shoe horning things in for reasons (looking at you, Borg or Ferengi episodes).  Did absolutely everything work? No, but it was good faith efforts that tried to take the misshapen lump of clay that started with and transform it into what the show should have been to start with...

[Aemon Stark]

I follow a podcast that's getting close to being done DS9 and will (probably) start Voyager after. It's a weekly thing, so another 20 weeks or so of DS9 then 170-odd of Voyager. Then probably Enterprise. So I guess I'll start my rewatch in just over three and a half years. Just in time for the Bell Riots!

[Toth]

2 hours ago, Corvinus85 said:

Season 4 was also setting up the First Romulan War, which probably would have taking place in season 5 if the show hadn't been cancelled.

It would have been so amazing to see the Romulan War and the formative years of the Federation in action...

[RumHam]

They should do an new show that's entirely Riker viewing important historical moments in the holodeck because he has to make a tough decision. 

[Werthead]

50 minutes ago, RumHam said:

They should do an new show that's entirely Riker viewing important historical moments in the holodeck because he has to make a tough decision. 

I have this idea for a show where he's showing a bunch of cadets various Star Trek adventures and they have to guess whether it's a real story or not. Then Riker denies or confirms. Or, after presenting them with the events of Sub Rosa and they uniformly say it was made-up, he inexplicably replies, "A similar thing happened to a teacher in the Florida area."

[SpaceChampion]

Do the Andorians have their own Starfleet ships with diverse crews from all Federation species?  Or was Starfleet just Earth saying "we're building this fleet, we'll accept other species and you're welcome to do the same" but the Andorians just kept to themselves with their own Andorian-only ships?

[sifth]

27 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Do the Andorians have their own Starfleet ships with diverse crews from all Federation species?  Or was Starfleet just Earth saying "we're building this fleet, we'll accept other species and you're welcome to do the same" but the Andorians just kept to themselves with their own Andorian-only ships?

In the baseball episode, the Vulcan captain Sisko plays against has a crew that's all Vulcan. So this does seem to be the case.

[Aemon Stark]

3 hours ago, Werthead said:

I have this idea for a show where he's showing a bunch of cadets various Star Trek adventures and they have to guess whether it's a real story or not. Then Riker denies or confirms. Or, after presenting them with the events of Sub Rosa and they uniformly say it was made-up, he inexplicably replies, "A similar thing happened to a teacher in the Florida area."

That's a great idea!! What about the title? Truth or Truthy?

[Werthead]

3 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

Do the Andorians have their own Starfleet ships with diverse crews from all Federation species?  Or was Starfleet just Earth saying "we're building this fleet, we'll accept other species and you're welcome to do the same" but the Andorians just kept to themselves with their own Andorian-only ships?

We see Andorians serving in post-Enterprise Starfleet as single officers in ships and at Starfleet Headquarters. So it might have been that way to start with but over the centuries it looks like they integrated more and more.

There were some oddities though, like the Starfleet vessel which seemed to have a predominantly not just human but Samoan, Hawaiian and Polynesian crew (the USS Sutherland) and the all or mostly Vulcan crew of the USS T'Kumbra (in Take Me Out to the Holosuit). The USS Intrepid in TOS also had an all-Vulcan crew. The USS Hera in TNG's Interface had a mostly Vulcan crew, but some human and other Federation crewmembers (including the captain, LaForge's mother).

I believe the Vulcans have special dispensation to have sole or majority-Vulcan crews because of the pon farr situation, which makes having solitary Vulcans on ships ill-advised (Tuvok's mission in Voyager was supposed to be short-term, and it looks like Spock in TOS chose to serve on the Enterprise as the awkwardness of being the only half-Vulcan on a mostly human ship was preferable to be being the only half-Vulcan on a Vulcan ship).

[Jaxom 1974]

It would make sense in the early days of the Federation, as Starfleet integrated the with the fleets of the founding member worlds, that there would be more ships with less variety of species.

 

Side note: CBS showing Discovery Season 1 starting tonight...and I realize it might get better, but I'm struck by my decision to skip this series as it really isn't well done, as far as being Trek is concerned.  Just too much trying to be rewritten.  Putting a show between Enterprise and TOS is just such a tactical error...