Boarders writing a novel

[The Grey Wolf]

7 hours ago, Kyoshi said:

Also prefer version 2.

Thanks for letting me know!

[Derfel Cadarn]

On 10/4/2020 at 1:42 AM, Lord Patrek said:

The problem with small presses is that they have little to no distribution, which makes it extremely hard to get any exposure. Whatever you can get is what you put into it, and it can be very difficult to get the word out and raise awareness in your works and pique potential readers' curiosity.

You've written a few novels. If it's not too indiscreet, have you sold many copies of each?

An advsntage of ebooks is, if a small press author can promote well, logistics arent a problem. But yes, it’s very hard to get ‘out there’.

Getting reviewer interest is difficult; I sent, at no small expense, two of my books to Locus magazine in America, but not yrt had either reviewed. I sent one book to British Fantasy Society and got a good review.

I’ve sold between 15-20 (that I know of) books to people on this site, but it helped being a longstanding member. Had i joined just to pimp my books, I suspect I’d hsvr been ignored.

A lot of the time, it’s an author no one’s heard of being reviewed by a blogger no one reads; but if they copy the review onto Goodreads/Amazon, it at least make a small differennce.

Resurrection Men has sold roughly 150 copies (ebook and paperback). Not sure exactly.

Thorns of a Black Rose is maybe about 75/80.

Lord of the Hunt is maybe about 50-55 so far, in the 6 months since launch.

But covid hasnt helped sales; another small press, Inspired Quill (eho published Roose Bolton’s Pet Leech’s Wise Phuul) reported a drop in sales of 75%.

Some reckon the drop in sales (affecting everyone) is due to financial insecirity and people working through tbr piles; my theory is that many people no longer have a 10+ hour commute every week, they no longer need so many books.

 

Edited October 5, 2020 by Derfel Cadarn

[Lord Patrek]

Holy crap, that's much worse than I thought.

I've always been extremely reticent to go down the small press/self-published route and your numbers show that it's incredibly hard to get the word out and entice potential readers to give your books a shot.

Book sales are up, actually. Maybe not for small presses, but it appears that the pandemic was good for business for traditional publishing houses. . .

Good luck raising awareness for your novels.

[Derfel Cadarn]

2 minutes ago, Lord Patrek said:

Holy crap, that's much worse than I thought.

I've always been extremely reticent to go down the small press/self-published route and your numbers show that it's incredibly hard to get the word out and entice potential readers to give your books a shot.

Book sales are up, actually. Maybe not for small presses, but it appears that the pandemic was good for business for traditional publishing houses. . .

Good luck raising awareness for your novels.

I’m an unknown and two of my books are about vampires (fuck you very much, Twilight). You’ve your own site which wpukd help. A recent novel from my publisher, Million Eyes, seems to have been fairly successful and had a successful event at a Waterstones. That author also has his own website and followers.

I believe my publisher’s bestseller has sales in the 5 figures, so it’s not all doom and gloom. JKR’s first Strike book sold about 1200 books before she was outed as author.

Imm on my phone so apologies for typos. Will goninto bit more detail tomorrow when on laptop.

[The Grey Wolf]

@Derfel Cadarn @Lord Patrek

What if your book is very niche?

[The Marquis de Leech]

15 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Resurrection Men has sold roughly 150 copies (ebook and paperback). Not sure exactly.

If it's any consolation, that's about the figure for Wise Phuul.

The promotion obstacle was a key reason for temporarily switching to short stories. That doesn't seem to have worked, though I do get a fair bit of online readership as a Tolkien blogger. Well, that, and the past six months have seen a 3230% increase in readership of my article on the best order to read Plato. Yes, really. People this year aren't reading small press fantasy novels. They're reading Plato, for some reason*.

*My hypothesis is that COVID Lockdown has spurred an interest in the classics, rather than contemporary stuff.

Edited October 6, 2020 by The Marquis de Leech

[Lord Patrek]

10 hours ago, The Grey Wolf said:

@Derfel Cadarn @Lord Patrek

What if your book is very niche?

Makes it harder, of course. Unless you can pitch it directly to that niche market.

[Derfel Cadarn]

13 hours ago, The Grey Wolf said:

@Derfel Cadarn @Lord Patrek

What if your book is very niche?

Find an agent/publisher that specialise in that niche, if possible.

My publisher deals with any speculative fiction, which covers a broad church from sci-fi to fantasy to horror. 

An agent may be difficult as I think they tend to stick to what has a broader appeal

[The Grey Wolf]

@Lord Patrek @Derfel Cadarn

Thanks for answering.

[Lord Patrek]

20 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

I’m an unknown and two of my books are about vampires (fuck you very much, Twilight). You’ve your own site which wpukd help. A recent novel from my publisher, Million Eyes, seems to have been fairly successful and had a successful event at a Waterstones. That author also has his own website and followers.

I believe my publisher’s bestseller has sales in the 5 figures, so it’s not all doom and gloom. JKR’s first Strike book sold about 1200 books before she was outed as author.

Imm on my phone so apologies for typos. Will goninto bit more detail tomorrow when on laptop.

I've you given any thought about offering one of your books for free? That way, readers could sample the quality of your writing and perhaps they'd buy your other novels. At least it would put you out there.

[Derfel Cadarn]

On 10/6/2020 at 7:45 PM, Lord Patrek said:

I've you given any thought about offering one of your books for free? That way, readers could sample the quality of your writing and perhaps they'd buy your other novels. At least it would put you out there.

It's tricky. The publisher controls prices and giving it away for free would only be viable if they could be sure they'd earn the money back by sellign the sequel, which I doubt they would. I did suggest a year or so ago reducing the kindle price for a couple of books over the festive period, but that can be complicated due to it being on multiple platforms; it would have to be changed on every platform it's on, which is quite a few. 

And I'm not sure if it would have an impact. At the start of covid I offered to 'gift' (UK only as I can only gift from Amazon UK) copies of  my first two books on Kindle, but only got a couple of interested people. Even had there been more interest, I susepct the gifted copies would largely gather dust on a kindle for a year or so rather than being read quickly and compelling the reader to get my other books.

Offering the paperbacks 'at cost' (I get copies cheaper from the publisher) is a possibility (roughly £7 instead of £10 if I include the postage I paid to get sent the books) but I'd need to add a further £4 or thereabouts just for UK postage. People would probably be cheaper just going into a bookshop and ordering it.

There is one option I'm considering. The author of Million Eyes (same publisher) had a collection of short stories in the same 'world' as Million Eyes, and the publisher edited and launched it for free. Whether that helped, I don't know, though Million Eyes seems to done fairly well from what I saw (compared to my releases). It probably helps that the author has his own website.

What I'm thinking of doing is writing a novella prequel to The Blood Hour and either seeing if the publisher would do the same, or self-publishing it myself on kindle as cheaply as they'll allow. The advantage of the former is that it would be edited , properly formatted and have a proper cover. But it wouldn't be on kindle, it would just be a pdf available for download.

If I do it myself, I can make it a kindle exclusive. The problem is, I'd either have to release it unedited, or pay money to get it edited which can be costly. 

There are advertising options, such as Bookbub, which I dabbled in a little with almost no results. The problem is, to even break even, you're relying on getting almost everyone who clicks on an ad to buy the book. I found I got maybe a dozen clicks a day, but no notable boost to sales. From what I've read, bookbub works best for free or cheap books, which is maybe better suited for self-publishers with the freedom to do regular discounts and freebies. And even then, it's hit or miss.

I do promote  my books on book pages on Facebook (not as paid ads, just posting on relevant pages), but it's not ideal, largely because like Twitter, the trick is to advertise to interested readers, not other writers. It has kept my sales ticking over, so it's not been a waste of time. But it's not very effective or efficient so I need to do better. I'd hoped Goodreads would be good, but has only maybe accounted for a couple of sales. 

I do post on Instagram but with no discernable impact other than likes. In theory it should work well with my Sooty Feather books, as I use a lot of real places and have posted photos of them, places that were around in Glasgow in 1893 and still around today (cemeteries and old buildings). In Lord of the Hunt, for example, I have a couple of scenes with the demon antagonist in Glasgow's Fossil Grove, an actual fossilised swamp from when Scotland was in the tropics, discovered in the 19th century and preserved with a building built around it, still there today and free to visit. Putting photos of it up hopefully helps garner interest. It's possible (well, until lockdown hit again) to sit in the same spot at a bar as my main protagonists did in Resurrection Men, a pub with many of the same fittings it had in 1893.

I should really push that angle again, especially locally. I did contact newspapers and reviewers (paper and online) but there's so much coming out now, by big readers too, that it's hard even to find reviewers willing to take a free copy to review. I did a blog tour a couple of months ago which gave me quite a few reviews, but it cost money. Again, these bloggers are generally quite small but the reviews appearing on the likes of Goodreads and Amazon always help.

A bit ramblier than I expected, I'm on my lunch break. One bit of advice I have for new writers is, don't wait until you get a publisher or agent before building your online presence; start immediately, so you've hopefully got a a base of 'fans' interested in your work if when your work comes out.

[Derfel Cadarn]

On 10/6/2020 at 1:16 PM, The Marquis de Leech said:

If it's any consolation, that's about the figure for Wise Phuul.

The promotion obstacle was a key reason for temporarily switching to short stories. That doesn't seem to have worked, though I do get a fair bit of online readership as a Tolkien blogger. Well, that, and the past six months have seen a 3230% increase in readership of my article on the best order to read Plato. Yes, really. People this year aren't reading small press fantasy novels. They're reading Plato, for some reason*.

*My hypothesis is that COVID Lockdown has spurred an interest in the classics, rather than contemporary stuff.

I'd have hoped/thought fantasy would be a good genre for indie authors, given that that the big authors often have years in between releases. But such doesn't seem to have been the case :/

[Lord Patrek]

1 hour ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

It's tricky. The publisher controls prices and giving it away for free would only be viable if they could be sure they'd earn the money back by sellign the sequel, which I doubt they would. I did suggest a year or so ago reducing the kindle price for a couple of books over the festive period, but that can be complicated due to it being on multiple platforms; it would have to be changed on every platform it's on, which is quite a few. 

And I'm not sure if it would have an impact. At the start of covid I offered to 'gift' (UK only as I can only gift from Amazon UK) copies of  my first two books on Kindle, but only got a couple of interested people. Even had there been more interest, I susepct the gifted copies would largely gather dust on a kindle for a year or so rather than being read quickly and compelling the reader to get my other books.

Offering the paperbacks 'at cost' (I get copies cheaper from the publisher) is a possibility (roughly £7 instead of £10 if I include the postage I paid to get sent the books) but I'd need to add a further £4 or thereabouts just for UK postage. People would probably be cheaper just going into a bookshop and ordering it.

There is one option I'm considering. The author of Million Eyes (same publisher) had a collection of short stories in the same 'world' as Million Eyes, and the publisher edited and launched it for free. Whether that helped, I don't know, though Million Eyes seems to done fairly well from what I saw (compared to my releases). It probably helps that the author has his own website.

What I'm thinking of doing is writing a novella prequel to The Blood Hour and either seeing if the publisher would do the same, or self-publishing it myself on kindle as cheaply as they'll allow. The advantage of the former is that it would be edited , properly formatted and have a proper cover. But it wouldn't be on kindle, it would just be a pdf available for download.

If I do it myself, I can make it a kindle exclusive. The problem is, I'd either have to release it unedited, or pay money to get it edited which can be costly. 

There are advertising options, such as Bookbub, which I dabbled in a little with almost no results. The problem is, to even break even, you're relying on getting almost everyone who clicks on an ad to buy the book. I found I got maybe a dozen clicks a day, but no notable boost to sales. From what I've read, bookbub works best for free or cheap books, which is maybe better suited for self-publishers with the freedom to do regular discounts and freebies. And even then, it's hit or miss.

I do promote  my books on book pages on Facebook (not as paid ads, just posting on relevant pages), but it's not ideal, largely because like Twitter, the trick is to advertise to interested readers, not other writers. It has kept my sales ticking over, so it's not been a waste of time. But it's not very effective or efficient so I need to do better. I'd hoped Goodreads would be good, but has only maybe accounted for a couple of sales. 

I do post on Instagram but with no discernable impact other than likes. In theory it should work well with my Sooty Feather books, as I use a lot of real places and have posted photos of them, places that were around in Glasgow in 1893 and still around today (cemeteries and old buildings). In Lord of the Hunt, for example, I have a couple of scenes with the demon antagonist in Glasgow's Fossil Grove, an actual fossilised swamp from when Scotland was in the tropics, discovered in the 19th century and preserved with a building built around it, still there today and free to visit. Putting photos of it up hopefully helps garner interest. It's possible (well, until lockdown hit again) to sit in the same spot at a bar as my main protagonists did in Resurrection Men, a pub with many of the same fittings it had in 1893.

I should really push that angle again, especially locally. I did contact newspapers and reviewers (paper and online) but there's so much coming out now, by big readers too, that it's hard even to find reviewers willing to take a free copy to review. I did a blog tour a couple of months ago which gave me quite a few reviews, but it cost money. Again, these bloggers are generally quite small but the reviews appearing on the likes of Goodreads and Amazon always help.

A bit ramblier than I expected, I'm on my lunch break. One bit of advice I have for new writers is, don't wait until you get a publisher or agent before building your online presence; start immediately, so you've hopefully got a a base of 'fans' interested in your work if when your work comes out.

Well, unless you find a way to showcase your work, everything else is rather pointless. Writing a prequel novella for a series that no one has read or heard about and then offering it for free is not necessarily a recipe for success.

I know this is brutally honest, but there's no denying the fact that most self-published/indie author novels are not very good. Could there be something missing to your novels, something that prevented you from getting an agent and get published traditionally? Maybe your works are too niche?

As a rule, after being burned in the past, as a reviewer I don't read self-published books or work from small presses. I know most reviewers feel the same. So I understand how hard it can be to find some willing to give your material a shot. And with Netgalley, even small fry reviewers now often have access to big titles. So those who used to give lesser known authors a shot now prefer to read the new Jim Butcher novel instead of indie works.

Have you tried to get on Netgalley, by any chance? Don't know how to do that, but maybe you'd get a few reviews on Goodread?

After speaking against self-published authors a few years back, I received hundreds of angry comment coming from various message boards dedicated to such books. Don't remember what they are, but perusing them I realized that there were like a sect. Everyone reads everyone else's books and leaves rave reviews everywhere. Perhaps you could try to become part of that sect?

That's the biggest problem with self-published writers and those published by small presses. All the marketing amounts to what you can put into it. So it's a lot of legwork, lots of efforts, and often very little success in the long run.

If your publisher won't help, maybe consider sending a pdf or word file to any reviewers willing to give your stuff a go. Or maybe try to get them to lower the price of your books to 0.99$ for like a week or so. Since they're not selling anyway, it's not like they're losing money. And if this can help get the ball rolling, why not?

Good luck to you, whatever you decide to do!

[Starkess]

4 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

I'd have hoped/thought fantasy would be a good genre for indie authors, given that that the big authors often have years in between releases. But such doesn't seem to have been the case :/

I'm not an expert, but I believe romance is the best genre for self pub and science fiction is also a good one. Fantasy not as much. Not sure if that translates to indie as well.

[Lord Patrek]

13 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

I'd have hoped/thought fantasy would be a good genre for indie authors, given that that the big authors often have years in between releases. But such doesn't seem to have been the case :/

With other big authors out there happy enough to fill the "void" and plenty of ebook deals every week featuring novels by established SFF writers, great and small, I figure that it will always be hard for indie authors and small press books, no matter what genre you write in.

[Derfel Cadarn]

22 hours ago, Lord Patrek said:

Well, unless you find a way to showcase your work, everything else is rather pointless. Writing a prequel novella for a series that no one has read or heard about and then offering it for free is not necessarily a recipe for success.

I know this is brutally honest, but there's no denying the fact that most self-published/indie author novels are not very good. Could there be something missing to your novels, something that prevented you from getting an agent and get published traditionally? Maybe your works are too niche?

As a rule, after being burned in the past, as a reviewer I don't read self-published books or work from small presses. I know most reviewers feel the same. So I understand how hard it can be to find some willing to give your material a shot. And with Netgalley, even small fry reviewers now often have access to big titles. So those who used to give lesser known authors a shot now prefer to read the new Jim Butcher novel instead of indie works.

Have you tried to get on Netgalley, by any chance? Don't know how to do that, but maybe you'd get a few reviews on Goodread?

After speaking against self-published authors a few years back, I received hundreds of angry comment coming from various message boards dedicated to such books. Don't remember what they are, but perusing them I realized that there were like a sect. Everyone reads everyone else's books and leaves rave reviews everywhere. Perhaps you could try to become part of that sect?

That's the biggest problem with self-published writers and those published by small presses. All the marketing amounts to what you can put into it. So it's a lot of legwork, lots of efforts, and often very little success in the long run.

If your publisher won't help, maybe consider sending a pdf or word file to any reviewers willing to give your stuff a go. Or maybe try to get them to lower the price of your books to 0.99$ for like a week or so. Since they're not selling anyway, it's not like they're losing money. And if this can help get the ball rolling, why not?

Good luck to you, whatever you decide to do!

 

I'd put any of my books against Butcher's Peace Talks any day!

Not sure how Netgalley works, will look into it.  

Reducing the price is a bit of work, as has to be done on all platforms apparently; I asked about it last year with a view to doing it over the festive period but by the time I asked, it wouldnt have taken in time. In hindsight it would only really gain me something if it encouraged people to buy the next book in the series. More likely it would sit on a kindle forgotten. I'll maybe ask about it again nearer the launch of the next book in the series.  

Review-wise, the publisher is happy to send me a pdf to send to reviewers (they watermark the first page so if it ends up on pirate sites, they can tell who released it). The trick is finding reviewers! The blog tour helped me get a bunch for Resurrection Men.

With Resurrection Men, I've heard there isn't much of an urban fantasy market (beyond the big hitters). It's also possible my query letters weren't up to spec. Quality isn't necessarily an issue with getting an agent, there's plenty of dreck that finds an agent and big-5 (or big 4 now I think?) publisher. The reviews (all genuine, none by family!) have all been good, most either 4 or 5 stars. Hopefully doing another blog tour will help garner more reviews for Lord of the Hunt and Thorns of a Black Rose. 

Small press-published books do suffer a bit, being regarded as not much better than self-published. I'd regard myself as trad-pubbed even if it's not by one of the Big 5; my books are edited and proof-read and professionally laid-out, and the paperback quality is very good, certainly a better quality than the cheap-feeling US books I occasionally saw in Borders and Forbidden Planet. Unfortunately with self-pubbed books, one could either end up with a professionally edited and formatted book, or a typo-riddled word document uploaded to Amazon Kindle. Not that the Big 5 books are a guarantee of quality, even (or especially) with the big authors.

If anything, there appears to be a feeling that they can publish any old crap by a popular author and it'll sell.. And not just in actual story quality (which can be subjective) but in writing quality. I believe editing is being sacrificed to save money. Robin Hobb's Golden Fool launched with a chapter missing (I was confused to read mention of a fight that happened earlier in the book, which wasn't actually in the book!)

Leaving aside the numerous continuity issues with earlier books, Raymond E Feist's later books suffered with poor editing; a dwarf character changes name mid-book. His penultimate Riftwar book had the main character in two places at the same time apparently due to part of an early draft making it into the final text.  And these are books written by popular authors published by big publishers.  And then there are the big authors who have the clout to tell their editors to go jump (Anne Rice). Goodkind too, I think. Or the big authors whose later books follow the same formula over and over, published in hardback with large margins and fonts to hide their brevity.

I've a few planned novels in other genres that will hopefully have more luck in getting me an agent. Just need to find the time to write them!

 

[Lord Patrek]

10 hours ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

 

I'd put any of my books against Butcher's Peace Talks any day!

Not sure how Netgalley works, will look into it.  

Reducing the price is a bit of work, as has to be done on all platforms apparently; I asked about it last year with a view to doing it over the festive period but by the time I asked, it wouldnt have taken in time. In hindsight it would only really gain me something if it encouraged people to buy the next book in the series. More likely it would sit on a kindle forgotten. I'll maybe ask about it again nearer the launch of the next book in the series.  

Review-wise, the publisher is happy to send me a pdf to send to reviewers (they watermark the first page so if it ends up on pirate sites, they can tell who released it). The trick is finding reviewers! The blog tour helped me get a bunch for Resurrection Men.

With Resurrection Men, I've heard there isn't much of an urban fantasy market (beyond the big hitters). It's also possible my query letters weren't up to spec. Quality isn't necessarily an issue with getting an agent, there's plenty of dreck that finds an agent and big-5 (or big 4 now I think?) publisher. The reviews (all genuine, none by family!) have all been good, most either 4 or 5 stars. Hopefully doing another blog tour will help garner more reviews for Lord of the Hunt and Thorns of a Black Rose. 

Small press-published books do suffer a bit, being regarded as not much better than self-published. I'd regard myself as trad-pubbed even if it's not by one of the Big 5; my books are edited and proof-read and professionally laid-out, and the paperback quality is very good, certainly a better quality than the cheap-feeling US books I occasionally saw in Borders and Forbidden Planet. Unfortunately with self-pubbed books, one could either end up with a professionally edited and formatted book, or a typo-riddled word document uploaded to Amazon Kindle. Not that the Big 5 books are a guarantee of quality, even (or especially) with the big authors.

If anything, there appears to be a feeling that they can publish any old crap by a popular author and it'll sell.. And not just in actual story quality (which can be subjective) but in writing quality. I believe editing is being sacrificed to save money. Robin Hobb's Golden Fool launched with a chapter missing (I was confused to read mention of a fight that happened earlier in the book, which wasn't actually in the book!)

Leaving aside the numerous continuity issues with earlier books, Raymond E Feist's later books suffered with poor editing; a dwarf character changes name mid-book. His penultimate Riftwar book had the main character in two places at the same time apparently due to part of an early draft making it into the final text.  And these are books written by popular authors published by big publishers.  And then there are the big authors who have the clout to tell their editors to go jump (Anne Rice). Goodkind too, I think. Or the big authors whose later books follow the same formula over and over, published in hardback with large margins and fonts to hide their brevity.

I've a few planned novels in other genres that will hopefully have more luck in getting me an agent. Just need to find the time to write them!

 

Hmm, reducing the price of your ebooks can't be that difficult, no matter how many platforms they're on. Self-published authors and mainstream publishers do it all the time. 

Based on your responses, I think that your biggest problem might be that you're not proactive enough. Indie writers are hustling all the time, active on numerous message boards and Goodreads, etc. If you rely on providence, you'll never raise awareness on your works and sell more books. If you just hang out here on Westeros, you're probably missing out on a lot of things. Are you a member of urban fantasy online communities? These people would likely be more receptive to your books.

Being published by a small press doesn't seem to give you much, really. You say your books are edited and proof-read and profesionally laid out, but what has that done for you? With less than 500 sales across multiple novels, it's not like they do anything to help pimp you or your books. Maybe being self-published would give you more flexibility?

If you believe in your books and you're persuaded that they're great read that could appeal to lots of readers, then you need to hustle. If you keep sitting back and hope for things to fall in your lap, given how hard to is to get the word out, it will likely never change for you in that regard. I think you need to market yourself more "aggressively" and not wait for your publisher. Contact reviewers directly and pitch your stuff, and offer to send them the pdf file yourself. Forget about the watermark. You're not Stephen King, it doesn't matter!

I guess you have to think outside the box, so to speak. Whatever you've been doing up until this point hasn't been working for you. So don't be afraid to try other things!

[Lord Patrek]

Also, if you're not a member already, the r/fantasy forum on Reddit is a hive of indie authors. Mingle and see if you can get some people interested in your stuff. Plenty of people read lots of self-published works there, so there's no reason why they wouldn't give small presses the cold shoulder. . .

[The Marquis de Leech]

Speaking as another small press author... I think it really depends on knowing what you're in for. Small presses have advantages over self-publishing, in that you don't have to organise (and pay for) cover or edits, and even if the book doesn't sell more than three copies, you aren't losing any money. Sure, you have to do significant promotional leg-work, but it's arguably a less risky (and arguably slightly more respectable) option than self-publishing, where you are putting your own money on the gamble. Self-publishing requires one to be business minded, whereas with a small press, one can treat writing as a risk-free hobby. I personally consider royalties (and the money I get via short stories) to be a happy bonus.

With the Big Five, sure, you're going to have far more promotion, but they're also much less likely to treat you as a human being (and you get zero say over the cover art).

Incidentally, I have just requested that my local library stock Resurrection Men. I'll let you know if they decide to stock it.  

Edited October 10, 2020 by The Marquis de Leech

[The Marquis de Leech]

Anyway, here's what I consider to be the various pluses and minuses:

Traditional Publishing vs Self Publishing vs the Crooks