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Police #2: Burning down the house


Fragile Bird

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5 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

Maybe here they are, but everwhere else they are smashing all cars. I watched a bit this morning from San Jose where protestors stopped traffic on a highway and started smashing the windows of the cars in the front of the line.

I don't know if this is related to that, but it looks like an SUV drove into protesters.

 

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2 minutes ago, The Great Unwashed said:

I don't know if this is related to that, but it looks like an SUV drove into protesters.

 

No, that sounds like a city street, what I saw was definitely a highway. All the cars were stopped, there were maybe 50 people on the road, and then somebody took a baseball bat or something to the windows of the first car, and I turned it off. Too much craziness for the morning. There were reports from across the country about cars being vandalized, because, I guess, it's so satisfying to smash something.

For that matter, I took a walk through the neighbourhood the other morning and 4 blocks away someone had gone down the street and smashed at least one car window in a dozen cars in the middle of the night. There aren't even any bars open. Presumably they were stealing stuff, but I don't know. And there wasn't even a riot going on.

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7 minutes ago, The Great Unwashed said:

I don't know if this is related to that, but it looks like an SUV drove into protesters.

 

That's not the first incidence of this happening, I've seen three others, and heard of like 10. This quite frankly is the most likely evidence of white supremacist involvement given what happened to Heather Heyer.

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1 minute ago, TrueMetis said:

That's not the first incidence of this happening, I've seen three others, and heard of like 10. This quite frankly is the most likely evidence of white supremacist involvement given what happened to Heather Heyer.

Yeah, I've heard numerous reports, plus protesters being shot in Louisville, Denver, and Detroit.

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44 minutes ago, DanteGabriel said:

The reports I see from protesters disavow the violence. They say the people breaking windows and starting fires are mostly young white guys with backpacks, and some of this is happening in areas without protesters. Obviously there's something of a fog of war effect going on, but I don't trust the feds at all and it's easy to believe there are white supremacists agitators involved.

This is what my friends who are there are telling me too. 

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1 hour ago, TrueMetis said:

Oh sure there's definitely a couple, I follow people who've tracked and identified some. But the Governor claimed that 80% of those arrested were from out of town/state, something that is easily and verifiably a lie. Thing is, the white nationalists and cops hiding in plain clothes are not subtle, they are easily identified and they very clearly aren't a large number. So again, this is and clear attempt at delegitimizing the protesters, and it's not like it's a new line, except for the part about white nationalists this is exactly the line given during Ferguson.

As for disavowing violence, plenty of protesters, and even some of the local business owners who have been effected, have been like "this is the price you pay for trying to prevent justice." So let's not throw a bunch of people under the bus by trying to claim that none of the violence is legitimate.

ETA: Especially when so much of the violence comes in response to how the police escalate things.

I think it's complicated, I think the rioting and damage where done by the actual protestors is an inevitable and understandable response to injustice that is as old as the USA is, and the awareness of it has been shoved in everyone's faces with the proliferation of camera phones. 

However there are A LOT of groups that, as you say, want to delegitimize the protests or view them as an opportunity to kick off the violence they want and these groups are absolutely acting as agent provocateurs. And there are a lot of them. One of the clips I was seeing yesterday was showing a pile of bricks which had suddenly appeared and wasn't near any construction sites.

I know we have some intersection of Twitter followers as I see you on there sometimes, but even if you already know about them I'm sure there's plenty of people in the thread that don't know of the bugaloo groups. They're a new faction of racist fucks that aren't necessarily aligned with Trump, but that see a second civil war (normally a race war) as inevitable and desirable and are trying to cause it. They pretty openly see the current situation as a perfect opportunity to incite the situation with their posts on 4chan etc.

I think the biggest difference you can see in the violence is that most of what I've seen from the legit protestors is relatively targeted and avoids things like local business etc wherever possible, the white agent provocateurs smash up whatever shit they think will make protestors look bad.

There was also a Nazi, goes by WarHippie, that had been posting suggestions that he was going to be doing a mass shooting in Texas yesterday, anti fascist researchers managed to identify who he is along with where he was and then followed him around filming him. Unclear if he would have actually gone through with it, but he didn't once he was being followed like that. If you've seen the video of the dipshit Nazi dramatically sitting on a wall and taking a sip of water through his mask only to have his mask fall off and expose his face... That's him.

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2 hours ago, TrueMetis said:

Oh sure there's definitely a couple, I follow people who've tracked and identified some. But the Governor claimed that 80% of those arrested were from out of town/state, something that is easily and verifiably a lie. Thing is, the white nationalists and cops hiding in plain clothes are not subtle, they are easily identified and they very clearly aren't a large number. So again, this is and clear attempt at delegitimizing the protesters, and it's not like it's a new line, except for the part about white nationalists this is exactly the line given during Ferguson.

As for disavowing violence, plenty of protesters, and even some of the local business owners who have been effected, have been like "this is the price you pay for trying to prevent justice." So let's not throw a bunch of people under the bus by trying to claim that none of the violence is legitimate.

ETA: Especially when so much of the violence comes in response to how the police escalate things.

Some of the violence is legitimate- BUT most of the burnings (not the 3rd precinct) are not POC. People I know on the ground have seen boogaloo boys (heard some white dudes yell it out this afternoon while I was helping board up a local comic book shop that got busted into), proud boys, and white militias. It has been more every night, and we are all seeing A LOT of out of state plates and cars without plates at all. The guy who started the looting and burning was identified by the community as a Saint Paul cop (which the police deny but there hasn’t been time or resources for them to investigate and they don’t exactly have credibility on police officer conduct). I chased a white guy in tactical gear off my block for suspicious loitering after 3am last night. This is not an either or situation. There are MANY people from outside Minneapolis instigating trouble and starting fires, that is true and obvious to anyone protesting or living here. There are also people legitimately exercising civil disobedience by burning things. In Saint Paul, every arrest last night was someone from elsewhere. In North Minneapolis, where there are not protests and it has been quiet previously, there were fires and looting at beloved neighborhood places. This is a very poor very black neighborhood. Residents and protestors aren’t hurting Northside. That’s someone else. I live right in the hot zone. I can tell you both of these things are true at the same time. That’s why infiltration works.

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35 minutes ago, karaddin said:

I know we have some intersection of Twitter followers as I see you on there sometimes

This right here is a reminder that maybe using a somewhat recognizable name isn't the best idea. I'm pretty careful on the internet, try and avoid embarrassing stuff, keep my private information private, try to avoid to much scrutiny. Generally I've done a pretty good job, but this is a reminder that keeping the same name and avatar across multiple sites does carry the risk of being recognized.

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5 minutes ago, Fury Resurrected said:

a Saint Paul cop (which the police deny but there hasn’t been time or resources for them to investigate and they don’t exactly have credibility on police officer conduct). 

2008, all over again.

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13 minutes ago, Fragile Bird said:

What does 'bugaloo' mean?

It's a shortening for "civil war 2: electric bugaloo" and is the group I was describing - people that expect and desire a second civil war that is a race war and are agitating to start it. They're distinct from some of the other right wing types and I think they're anti Republicans and anti cop. The Trump allied klan and Nazis frequently are the cops.

3 minutes ago, TrueMetis said:

This right here is a reminder that maybe using a somewhat recognizable name isn't the best idea. I'm pretty careful on the internet, try and avoid embarrassing stuff, keep my private information private, try to avoid to much scrutiny. Generally I've done a pretty good job, but this is a reminder that keeping the same name and avatar across multiple sites does carry the risk of being recognized.

Sorry I didn't mean to spook you. I do have a different name and pic so you wouldn't know its me, I don't follow you - doing so just because I recognized you from here would be a bit creepy and I'd make no criticisms or complaints of anything I've seen you say. My only point was just that at least some of our feeds would have an overlap.

For what it's worth I think it's mostly more on pop culture discussions that I've noticed you anyway. Which probably identifies the people we have in common lol.

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17 minutes ago, Fury Resurrected said:

Some of the violence is legitimate- BUT most of the burnings (not the 3rd precinct) are not POC. People I know on the ground have seen boogaloo boys (heard some white dudes yell it out this afternoon while I was helping board up a local comic book shop that got busted into), proud boys, and white militias. It has been more every night, and we are all seeing A LOT of out of state plates and cars without plates at all. The guy who started the looting and burning was identified by the community as a Saint Paul cop (which the police deny but there hasn’t been time or resources for them to investigate and they don’t exactly have credibility on police officer conduct). I chased a white guy in tactical gear off my block for suspicious loitering after 3am last night. This is not an either or situation. There are MANY people from outside Minneapolis instigating trouble and starting fires, that is true and obvious to anyone protesting or living here. There are also people legitimately exercising civil disobedience by burning things. In Saint Paul, every arrest last night was someone from elsewhere. In North Minneapolis, where there are not protests and it has been quiet previously, there were fires and looting at beloved neighborhood places. This is a very poor very black neighborhood. Residents and protestors aren’t hurting Northside. That’s someone else. I live right in the hot zone. I can tell you both of these things are true at the same time. That’s why infiltration works.

Thank you.  I was trying to put this in words, but I only had second hand accounts from friends that live there.  On NPR today, an ex-military analyst called in and the way that the Umbrella man was dressed, his manner and whatnot is pretty much what they teach for counter-assessment.  That it makes it hard to figure it out who it is via picture, video and drone.  It is very strategic.

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3 minutes ago, karaddin said:

Sorry I didn't mean to spook you. I do have a different name and pic so you wouldn't know its me, I don't follow you - doing so just because I recognized you from here would be a bit creepy and I'd make no criticisms or complaints of anything I've seen you say. My only point was just that at least some of our feeds would have an overlap.

For what it's worth I think it's mostly more on pop culture discussions that I've noticed you anyway. Which probably identifies the people we have in common lol.

Not spooked, don't worry. Just a good reminder for myself.

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12 minutes ago, Guy Kilmore said:

Thank you.  I was trying to put this in words, but I only had second hand accounts from friends that live there.  On NPR today, an ex-military analyst called in and the way that the Umbrella man was dressed, his manner and whatnot is pretty much what they teach for counter-assessment.  That it makes it hard to figure it out who it is via picture, video and drone.  It is very strategic.

There was something profoundly disturbing about the man with the umbrella. 

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12 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

There was something profoundly disturbing about the man with the umbrella. 

Agreed.

And it looks like they closed down the interstates about the cities.  Be safe!

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