Luzifer's right hand Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 55 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: It's interesting. As the internet and social media make reaching out over long distances an easier prospect it seems that you are correct. The cultural cohesive regions that have evolved start breaking down. That could end up making future civil wars more difficult to start, and much bloodier if they do start. When we're fight the guy we see walking his dog every afternoon it's harder to get up the nerve to fight. If we do get up the nerve to actually start fighting I suspect it will be harder to put down the clubs once we've taken them up as well. I don't think you get how hate works and how quickly it spreads. I suggest reading a bit about recent civil wars like the one in Yugoslavia. The civil war the US had has very little to do with how civil wars work nowadays. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IheartIheartTesla Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Yeah, recent conflicts in Rwanda and the erstwhile Yugoslavia have shown being neighbors means nothing when compared to an overarching tribal group you are part of. In fact, with the rise of social media that local connection communities had has probably eroded further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 44 minutes ago, Underfoot said: Divide the country based on where people say pop, soda, or coke. Make the places that say “Tonic” gerontologicly based city-states? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 16 minutes ago, Luzifer's right hand said: I don't think you get how hate works and how quickly it spreads. I suggest reading a bit about recent civil wars like the one in Yugoslavia. The civil war the US had has very little to do with how civil wars work nowadays. I’ve actually read quite a bit about the Yugoslav Civil War. If religious and ethnic differences come into play... bad things result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 22 minutes ago, IheartIheartTesla said: Some recent polls out from Change Research (a C- pollster as per 538) show more modest numbers for Biden compared to the average (+7 national, -4 PA, even WI, -1 AZ, and some of the other battlegrounds in the +1to 4 range). It doesnt seem to be a partisan pollster, so maybe their methodology is simply not the best according to the aggregators. It seems to be LV based, so that is part of a worrying trend for me. Yeah, I don't love that, but I don't know anything about Change Research, and while those aren't great polls for Biden, he'd still win the election winning FL and MI, so it's hardly a disaster. On better news, an actually good pollster (Monmouth) just came out with Biden leading Trump 52-41. That's a great result, because Monmouth is a quality pollster and that isn't a ton of undecideds. That's up 2 points from last month and up 8 points since March. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luzifer's right hand Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Just now, Ser Scot A Ellison said: I’ve actually read quite a bit about they Yugoslav Civil War. If religious differences come into play... bad things result. You live in a country with an incredible high number of people belonging to different sects of the most deadly religion in human history... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, Luzifer's right hand said: You live in a country with an incredible high number of people belonging to different sects of the most deadly religion in human history... I take your point. That said religious differences have very rarely led to bloodshed here in the US. Our civil conflicts have been over political, economic, and regional differences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry of the Lawn Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: I take your point. That said religious differences have very rarely led to bloodshed here in the US. Our civil conflicts have been over political, economic, and regional differences. And racism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 10 minutes ago, larrytheimp said: And racism. Indeed. Absolutely true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sologdin Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 hellfire nation argues that the US civil war is a deeply religious conflict, and that the grand army of the republic was one of the holiest armies that ever marched. the text is not bad--though it skips over the constitutional convention, which is a bit a blind spot. the curious thing about this text is that racism and anti-racism both burn with zeal. the abolitionists won their crusade and immediately launched another for temperance. the text may overstate the point, but it is worthy of one's attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Quote Trump and other top officials, including national security adviser Robert O'Brien, are "not happy" with Esper after his Wednesday remarks, three people familiar with the White House's thinking said. In the press conference, Esper also distanced himself from a maligned photo-op outside St. John's Church. One White House official said aides there did not get a heads up about the content of Esper's remarks, including most notably Esper's decision to publicly break with the President on the use of the military to address unrest in US cities. Esper's comments Wednesday came after defense officials told CNN this week that there was deep and growing discomfort among some in the Pentagon even before Trump announced Monday that he is ready to deploy active duty forces if local leaders fail to ramp up enforcement efforts. Pentagon chief on shaky ground with White House after breaking with Trump over protest response https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/03/politics/esper-insurrection-act-protests/index.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Getting back to evangelics, there's footage of Joel Osteen (he of the mega church that kept its doors closed during the Harvey flooding) marching in a BLM protest in Houston yesterday. I don't think he has any firmly held convictions; but I think he does have a good sense of the way his congregation is thinking. Going to be very curious to see if there's any further signs of Trump losing support in the coming weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maarsen Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 7 minutes ago, Fez said: Getting back to evangelics, there's footage of Joel Osteen (he of the mega church that kept its doors closed during the Harvey flooding) marching in a BLM protest in Houston yesterday. I don't think he has any firmly held convictions; but I think he does have a good sense of the way his congregation is thinking. Going to be very curious to see if there's any further signs of Trump losing support in the coming weeks. I am old enough to remember the riots and protests of the 60's. This time things feel different. There is a lot more of a groundswell of support for the protests. The extreme reaction of Trump is also not the same reaction that Johnson and Nixon had in that Johnson refused to run for a second term and Nixon, knowing he had the election in the bag still tried to burgle Democrat headquarters and escalate the war. At the time lots of people still thought the Vietnam war was winnable. Today I doubt very many people think every thing will be bunnies and rainbows if Trump gets a second term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanteGabriel Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 14 hours ago, OldGimletEye said: Might work, so long as Europe and other parts of the world were willing to send troops to North America for about 100 years to keep us from fighting each other. Send election observers too plz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fragile Bird Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Trump has ordered (must be him, right?) the protestors by the White House pushed out even further away from Lafayette Park. They've been pushed back past St. John's Church now by armed officers carrying shields. What's up, is there a dictator scheduled to come in? Is Trump afraid screaming protestors can be heard when he's on the phone? Is he planning on going to church on Sunday? What a gutless coward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martell Spy Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Will he go? A law professor fears a meltdown this November. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2020/6/3/21257133/trump-2020-election-meltdown-lawrence-douglas Quote Lawrence Douglas That’s correct. It’s the governor who is responsible under federal law to send the electoral certificate of the state to Congress. But that is not to say that the state legislature is barred from sending its own certificate to Congress. You might say, “Well, then, isn’t the governor’s certificate the proper certificate?” and the answer is that it’s up to Congress to make that determination. And if one House accepts the governor’s certificate and the other accepts the legislature’s certificate, then we’re in a stalemate. Sean Illing So your main worry is not that the election will be stolen so much as we’ll be left without a result? Lawrence Douglas Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 3 hours ago, Underfoot said: Divide the country based on where people say pop, soda, or coke. Pop and soda people can get along. Those coke mother fuckers though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 1 hour ago, sologdin said: hellfire nation argues that the US civil war is a deeply religious conflict, and that the grand army of the republic was one of the holiest armies that ever marched. the text is not bad--though it skips over the constitutional convention, which is a bit a blind spot. the curious thing about this text is that racism and anti-racism both burn with zeal. the abolitionists won their crusade and immediately launched another for temperance. the text may overstate the point, but it is worthy of one's attention. The point is well taken. However, the American Civil War, in my view, was politicial and racial much more than religious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrimTuesday Posted June 3, 2020 Share Posted June 3, 2020 Dang, Keith Ellison is not screwing around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jace, Extat Posted June 3, 2020 Author Share Posted June 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said: The point is well taken. However, the American Civil War, in my view, was politicial and racial much more than religious. I say reactionary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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