200 valyrian steel swords?

[frenin]

4 hours ago, dsjj251 said:

By that logic, we are only told of 3 of these swords being commissioned, so this argument goes both ways. 

You can make your bet, there is no reason to believe a sword has been purchased, when stolen in war is an easier option.

[Curled Finger]

4 hours ago, Stannis th3 Mannis said:

Well look at how Tywin get his sword; he gets it by defeating a family in war who owned one in the Starks. So that's never happened before? With there being 200 of them I find it very hard to belive and ok he said blades. I think it's safe to say the sword is the most popular blade but let's go your way and say only half of the 200 are swords, that's still means there should be 12 Vs sword in the west alone but the lannisters as well as the other 2 houses Tywin destroyed (the Reines and tarbecks) didnt own one. If they had Tywin would have got it. Theres just not any logical answer for both there being that many and the most powerful man from one of the most powerful houses to not be abel to get one before he finally does

There is no proof at all, only the name to go by, but it is thought by some that Red Rain belonged to House Reyne and the Lannisters had some circumvented way of acquiring Brightroar due to a curse on Lannister gold the Valyrians believed in. Red Rain was taken from a knight.  The Reynes and Ironborn fought many many battles.  It's not entirely unlikely that part of the bother the Lannisters went through to actually get Brightroar was in direct response to their nemesis having a weapon they could not.   It's not like Valyrians would sell to them.  Lannister gold is the only gold mentioned in the curse.   Can't see any problem anyone else would have???

[dsjj251]

42 minutes ago, frenin said:

You can make your bet, there is no reason to believe a sword has been purchased, when stolen in war is an easier option.

Again, by that logic, House Lannister could have just taken a sword from which ever house p/o'ed them, they didnt. 

[frenin]

1 hour ago, dsjj251 said:

Again, by that logic, House Lannister could have just taken a sword from which ever house p/o'ed them, they didnt. 

Likely because none of those houses had valyrian swords.

The Lannisters did with Ice, the Peakes did with Orphan Maker, the Greyjoys did with Nightfall. In fact the only Valyrian sword bought se know about is Brightroar, which was bought before the doom and even then was fuck you money.

[dsjj251]

2 minutes ago, frenin said:

Likely because none of those houses had valyrian swords.

The Lannisters did with Ice, the Peakes did with Orphan Maker, the Greyjoys did with Nightfall. In fact the only Valyrian sword bought se know about is Brightroar, which was bought before the doom and even then was fuck you money.

Again, we are never told that valyrian steel in and of itself is precious, only that it cant be made anymore. There is no reason to believe it was so expensive that others houses couldnt afford it when still being made.

[frenin]

6 hours ago, dsjj251 said:

Again, we are never told that valyrian steel in and of itself is precious, only that it cant be made anymore. There is no reason to believe it was so expensive that others houses couldnt afford it when still being made.

Brightroar was bought before the doom and before the Doom it was already expensive as hell.

 

The sword Brightroar came into the possession of the Lannister kings in the century before the Doom, and it is said that the weight of gold they paid for it would have been enough to raise an army. But it was lost little more than a century later, when Tommen II carried it with him when he sailed with his great fleet to ruined Valyria, with the intention of plundering the wealth and sorcery he was sure still remained. The fleet never returned, nor Tommen, nor Brightroar.

 

 

The only sword we know for a certainty that was bought was super expensive, there is little reason to assume, the rest of the swords were cheaper. If the swords were relatively cheap, every major house would have one or would have had one at some point but the only major houses we know that have one or at some point they had one are: Royces, Starks, Lannisters, Hightower,Tarly, Corbrays. Greyjoy, Harlaws and Targs.

That's a very small pool.

Stealing a sword in war is far cheaper, far logical and overall easier option than buying one and we have several instances of that happening, not everyone is like Ned and returns priceless heirlooms to its rightful owners.

So, if the Lannisters didn't have one is simply because they had bad luck.

 

Btw.

Valyrian steel was always costly, but it became considerably more so when there was no more Valyria, and the secret of its making were lost.

 

 

[TargBaitedStrawman]

With all the scheming and back stabbing in the seven kingdoms, I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of unnamed Valyrian steel blades in Westeros were daggers.

 

[Curled Finger]

On 6/7/2020 at 2:14 PM, Stannis th3 Mannis said:

Well look at how Tywin get his sword; he gets it by defeating a family in war who owned one in the Starks. So that's never happened before? With there being 200 of them I find it very hard to belive and ok he said blades. I think it's safe to say the sword is the most popular blade but let's go your way and say only half of the 200 are swords, that's still means there should be 12 Vs sword in the west alone but the lannisters as well as the other 2 houses Tywin destroyed (the Reines and tarbecks) didnt own one. If they had Tywin would have got it. Theres just not any logical answer for both there being that many and the most powerful man from one of the most powerful houses to not be abel to get one before he finally does

Perhaps that is precisely why a family would hide a sword.  Dawn hasn't been seen in nearly 20 years simply because there was no one to wield it.  I can see people being terrified of Tywin and hiding their treasures.  It might also be a delightful thing to have nothing except the one thing a powerful wealthy man can't have.  We know there are at least 3 impoverished houses who would not part with their Valyrian Steel swords.  (But we only think we can identify 2 impoverished house, and I'm only positive of one.)    

There are only 15 named Valyrian Steel swords in all of Westeros for all the time we've known Westeros, from AGoT to Fire and Blood.  There were specific and peculiar mentions of the swords and an arakh in F&B.  Obscure swords brought front and center.  I'm sure there are only 12 of them left in Westeros.  That's from the inventories.  And adds to the conclusion you are drawing.

[Curled Finger]

6 hours ago, Ser Salvo Summerhall said:

With all the scheming and back stabbing in the seven kingdoms, I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of unnamed Valyrian steel blades in Westeros were daggers.

 

Swords are the only weapons with names in this tale.  

[TargBaitedStrawman]

 

2 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

Swords are the only weapons with names in this tale.  

Some weapons have to be hidden, some could have just passed hands many times or some are just lost within Westeros. We haven't heard about many of them because they are considered lesser weapons or just contain less steel leaving them unnamed and not worthy of note. Swords are obviously more coveted.  I don't see too many noble houses brandishing daggers with pride, but that doesn't mean that there aren't a bunch floating around out there or hidden.

 

[Curled Finger]

10 minutes ago, Ser Salvo Summerhall said:

 

Some weapons have to be hidden, some could have just passed hands many times or some are just lost within Westeros. We haven't heard about many of them because they are considered lesser weapons or just contain less steel leaving them unnamed and not worthy of note. Swords are obviously more coveted.  I don't see too many noble houses brandishing daggers with pride, but that doesn't mean that there aren't a bunch floating around out there or hidden.

 

I may have misread your post or confused your meaning.  Blades, of course, could be daggers or any stabbing or bludgeoning or cutting type weapon.  The Celtigars have an ax.  My point was only that the swords are the only weapons with names.  Well, Dario does call his knives his ladies, but that's not really name.  

[TargBaitedStrawman]

45 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

I may have misread your post or confused your meaning.  Blades, of course, could be daggers or any stabbing or bludgeoning or cutting type weapon.  The Celtigars have an ax.  My point was only that the swords are the only weapons with names.  Well, Dario does call his knives his ladies, but that's not really name.  

That's alright, I perhaps should have specified more. I wasn't taking about the weapons having names, just that alot of the Valyrian steel blades may be daggers hidden away. Yes, we know of House Celtigar's Valyrian steel axe and they don't deify it or hold it any especially high regard other then it being Valyrian steel.

The sword Lamentation was lost during the storming of the dragon pit, it must have floated around Westeros awhile before being sold on some black market, maybe the Maesters run it to forge new links for their chains, but that may be too much tinfoil.

Dario's ladies are more precious to him than Valyrian steel.

[Curled Finger]

9 hours ago, Ser Salvo Summerhall said:

That's alright, I perhaps should have specified more. I wasn't taking about the weapons having names, just that alot of the Valyrian steel blades may be daggers hidden away. Yes, we know of House Celtigar's Valyrian steel axe and they don't deify it or hold it any especially high regard other then it being Valyrian steel.

The sword Lamentation was lost during the storming of the dragon pit, it must have floated around Westeros awhile before being sold on some black market, maybe the Maesters run it to forge new links for their chains, but that may be too much tinfoil.

Dario's ladies are more precious to him than Valyrian steel.

Yah Dario does like his ladies.  I will offer the likelihood that Lamentation is actually destroyed.  It is listed among the dead in the World Book.   If that's not a hint, I don't know what is.  

[TargBaitedStrawman]

On 9/19/2020 at 11:23 AM, Curled Finger said:

Yah Dario does like his ladies.  I will offer the likelihood that Lamentation is actually destroyed.  It is listed among the dead in the World Book.   If that's not a hint, I don't know what is.  

I can see some lords just being really paranoid about losing their swords, so they are collecting dust. Yea, that does make sense losing a valyrian steel sword is like losing a member of the family.