Possibility of political reform

[Miss_Saffron]

23 hours ago, Lord of Raventree Hall said:

I know this is simplistic, but considering I suspect there will be at least two more huge changes in power (first to Aegon, then to Daenerys) followed by a end of the world style battle against the Others that will lead to...just a lot of people dying, I can't help but think political reform is inevitable. I mean, how many of the great lords lines are even going to survive this?

I agree with the general gist of your post, but I do think the question of succession won't be definitely decided before the Others are dealt with. It's too neat of a plot progression. But yes, I do believe that after Others and the last stretch of succession war will be done with, the board will be pretty much wiped clean and the rules of the game of thrones would change significantly. Of the great houses, I think it's pretty much given that some of the Starks will survive. Other than that? Maybe Willas Tyrell or one of the Martells? Perhaps Edmure Tully. But North and Riverlands are already devastated and I think all the kingdoms would suffer significant destruction, so even those great houses that will remain would lose great deal of power.

[Rose of Red Lake]

I dont understand how the nobles can be put in check when the king is drawn from the same class as the nobles. And, sometimes, the nobles need to check the king, so it goes both ways. Realistically, their interests would just start to merge, like the power elite in the U.S., where both legislative and executive serve their interests as a class. You want a power structure that cannot be easily captured, so it serves the country as a whole. But, rather than seeking to solve this question I think GRRM is just going to fall back on the idea of non-hereditary rule, still by rule of a king, ending with the hope that a great person will come along to win power back for the people. Great man theory of history and all that (which is very problematic).

It's good enough for what it is, I mean we're not reading a political science dissertation. Baby steps. But anyone hoping the series to solve entrenched political problems like class power concentration, will be disappointed.

[Miss_Saffron]

On 6/29/2020 at 3:20 PM, Rose of Red Lake said:

I dont understand how the nobles can be put in check when the king is drawn from the same class as the nobles.

Some checks can be put in place, like a working judical system independent of the lords (there was a theory proposed in one of the threads that greenseers served that sort of function in the past). Heck, even breaking the feudal hierarchy of minor lords -> great lords could help with curtailing the ability to amass power by the great lords. Also, introducing equivalent of a Magdeburg law that gave some autonomy to the townspeople and villagers and in turn cut on the power of nobles. But of course, those 'fixes' don't guarantee the system would actualy work as intended. You've yourself pointed out that even modern democracy in which - in theory - everyone has a vote and each vote weights the same the power structure still skewers towards the wealthy. 

Therefore, I believe the only hope for a meaningful change is introducing Weirwood Communism in Westeros. The red leaves and sap are the clue. 

On 6/29/2020 at 3:20 PM, Rose of Red Lake said:

But, rather than seeking to solve this question I think GRRM is just going to fall back on the idea of non-hereditary rule, still by rule of a king, ending with the hope that a great person will come along to win power back for the people. Great man theory of history and all that (which is very problematic).

Pretty much. I think he might make a point of the personal qualities that this non-hereditary king has that made him actually qualified for the job and that the implication would be that future kings should be chosen based on similar qualities but yeah, this is simplistic and idealistic, because as you've said:

On 6/29/2020 at 3:20 PM, Rose of Red Lake said:

It's good enough for what it is, I mean we're not reading a political science dissertation.

 

[James Fenimore Cooper XXII]

Real world examples do not apply in the case of Planetos.  Civilization and development will move backwards instead of forward.  The existential threat of the long night will make it so that the survivors will be more concerned with finding food and shelter before they can worry about political reforms.  Social order will break down in most places.  It will be leaders like Daenerys Targaryen, Aegon ?, and so on who will have to start from scratch to get the process of rebuilding to begin. 

[nyser1]

I do not think there is anything to suggest that the people are ready or inclined to cause a massive transition to the form of government. Yes, seismic events are coming. However, all signs still point to status quo.