The Hightowers

[Lady Rhodes]

Especially after reading Fire & Blood, it is obvious that House Hightower features prominently in Westerosi history. However, they have been noticeably absent in our current story.  I don't believe that they are just irrelevant, though, given the few scant mentions that we do have.  I think there is something going on, but what?

Here are a few tidbits that I have noticed, but I am wondering if anyone else has noticed/connected anything.

You can supposedly see the Wall from the top of the Hightower.

Lord Leyton and the Mad Maid have been locked at the top floor of the Hightower for 10 years, which is conspicuously around the length of the summer.

While is Vaes Torro, Jorah tells Dany of his marriage to Lynesse.  He said that he expected to be refused by Lord Leyton, but he accepted.

Now this is a big discrepancy.  Pate says that Lord Leyton had not left the Hightower in a decade, but Ser Jorah, who admits he was very drunk, asked for her hand after the Tourney of Lannisport, which was held after the Greyjoy rebellion.  I believe that was only 6 years prior to our current events.  So did Jorah not actually speak to Lord Leyton?  Did Lord Leyton leave the tower and if so, why?  Was there a purpose?  And why did Lord Leyton (or his proxy) permit this marriage?

Twyin offered Tyrion to Lord Leyton, but was refused.

Willas sent word to Lord Leyton to see to the defenses of Oldtown due to the Ironborn raids.

The biggest issue I have currently is the discrepancy with the tourney of Lannisport.  Especially since we have Jorah's admittance that he was very drunk on wine and glory, is it possible that it was not Leyton there, but someone that could still have offered permission for a marriage? 

 

 

[LordSeaSnake]

The Greyjoy Rebellion and tourney at Lannisport occurred in 289 AC, 11 years before Pate's comment in A Feast for Crows.

[Lady Rhodes]

3 minutes ago, LordSeaSnake said:

The Greyjoy Rebellion and tourney at Lannisport occurred in 289 AC, 11 years before Pate's comment in A Feast for Crows.

Ah, I just checked after I saw this reply. It was occurred six years after the rebellion, not six years from the rebellion to present day. so one question solved.

but why did lord Leyton consent to the marriage?

[Frey family reunion]

8 minutes ago, Lady Rhodes said:

Ah, I just checked after I saw this reply. It was occurred six years after the rebellion, not six years from the rebellion to present day. so one question solved.

but why did lord Leyton consent to the marriage?

My guess is Lyesse may have been, um, soiled goods.

[Lady Rhodes]

8 minutes ago, Frey family reunion said:

My guess is Lyesse may have been, um, soiled goods.

Could this be relevant elsewhere to the story?

[Frey family reunion]

3 minutes ago, Lady Rhodes said:

Could this be relevant elsewhere to the story?

It may be that Lynesse has an illegitimate child out there somewhere.

[Lady Rhodes]

1 minute ago, Frey family reunion said:

It may be that Lynesse has an illegitimate child out there somewhere.

Hmm. Ok.

any other thoughts regarding house Hightower and their activities?

[Alyn Oakenfist]

41 minutes ago, Frey family reunion said:

It may be that Lynesse has an illegitimate child out there somewhere.

Lynesse is Dany's mother confirmed

[Curled Finger]

I have been having a hankering for some Hightower talk so thankee very much @Lady Rhodes.  I see the burning timeline of J + L = disaster is solved, so let's get to some of those other good questions of yours.  Why would Lord Hightower acquiesce to Jorah Nobody Mormont for his sweet baby girl?  That soiled daughter thing @Frey family reunion offered up is not a bad idea at all given what we later learn of Lynesse's proclivities.  However, what if that's not the deal?  We all know how mysterious Here We Stand House Mormont is--we have so little information on these people.  But, we are the readers, not citizens of Westeros.  Let me clarify, I'm not saying the Mormonts are anything other than what we've seen, an old Northern House with strong ties to House Stark and a priceless VS magical sword.  I don't believe House Mormont is poor, but as we read, "modest", which could mean almost anything, but I choose to go with location and descriptions on this.   The Mormonts have something that would be attractive to a major power broker like the Hightowers.  Then we are told the Hightowers are magical thinking types as well as the major political force behind the Faith.  Could this bad love match have been a deeply misguided religious ingathering?   Sure, why not?  But we hear near nothing about all that Faith promoting in current day--NAY, we hear Lord Leyton and his eldest daughter are incommunicado researching magic. 

Now I am of a mind that the magic VS swords are named by the houses who initially obtained them.  In that we have no other information I feel safe in assuming some old bear named Longclaw and that the name means something very specific for that house.   Same goes for House Hightower's magical sword, Vigilance.   Vigilance was used to knight a Targaryan Prince, for crying out loud and that is all we hear of it.   We don't even know if it is still in the possession of the Hightowers, but I suspect it is.  Because it's a magic sword and magic seems to be their serious side hustle.  Odd for a religious family entrenched in the main faith of 6/7s of a nation.  

House Hightower was likely pushed aside following Robert's Rebellion for their allegiance to Rhaegar.  Despite their wealth and influence they were cast out of the mainstream...or they retreated. Either way, they are going for a much lower profile in the 7 Kingdoms.  It's pretty clear from Ally Mormont's conversations with Asha Greyjoy that there is some old magic at play on Bear Isle.  Mystery surrounding the likely magical origins of the Hightower itself abound.  I'm thinking ancient magical connection between these families along with all the other magical families we read about.  The Hightowers simply haven't been out front, but should never be far from our conversations about magic.   

Though I have nothing substantial to add to the conversation I do think it's time to start really looking at House Hightower.   Questions in this OP were a good place to start. 

[Vaith]

I think the Hightowers intentionally have a bit of mystery about them; Leyton is supposedly very reclusive and has tucked himself away with his mad daughter. I think we'll see more of them when Euron begins to take more of the Reach, and certainly in the next Sam chapters.

As for Lynesse: she's a fifth born daughter, so agreeing to a marriage to a mediocre-yet-not-terrible northern lord after he chivalrously won a tourney doesn't seem too much of a stretch. Especially if Leyton's oddball nature means he's not really concerned with the realpolitik of matchmaking. Besides, his eldest daughter is an old maid and his third-born daughter seemingly has a marriage to a complete nobody. (What is House Cupps, anyway?) So I don't think Lynesse is necessarily "soiled goods," she's been mentioned multiple times and there are no such rumours about her.

[frenin]

3 hours ago, Lady Rhodes said:

but why did lord Leyton consent to the marriage?

She was a 5th daughter and Jorah was at the time very well connected to the new rulers.  Ned and Eddard. sounds  like a win win.

[Eltharion21]

I wonder are there any theories /guesses that Mad Maid is Quaithe and she sends her visions through Glass Candle?

Isn't it also important supposed prophecy from Aegon I's time :

"If Oldtown took up arms against the Dragon, Oldtown would burn, and the Hightower and the Citadel and the Starry Sept would be cast down and destroyed.

[FictionIsntReal]

2 hours ago, frenin said:

She was a 5th daughter and Jorah was at the time very well connected to the new rulers.  Ned and Eddard. sounds  like a win win.

Both Ned AND Eddard? That's two Starks for the price of one I imagine Robert was very happy they were ruling (as co-kings, like Spartans) instead of him.

[Frey family reunion]

2 hours ago, Vaith said:

As for Lynesse: she's a fifth born daughter, so agreeing to a marriage to a mediocre-yet-not-terrible northern lord after he chivalrously won a tourney doesn't seem too much of a stretch

According to the appendix, she’s the sixth born daughter.  The fifth born, Alysanne married to Lord Arthur Ambrose. 

But really, the birth order of daughters isn’t really that big of a deal.  At least not as big a deal as the birth order of sons.  Especially when the daughter is attractive and from a rich family.  Mormont certainly felt like he hit the jackpot.

My guess is Leyton thanked his lucky stars that some rube Lord from up north took an interest in a daughter perhaps not realizing she had a bit of a history.

The fact that Lynesse goes from Mormont’s wife to a concubine of a sleazy foreigner just kind of underscores the fact that she might be a bit loose.

As for Leyla, yea she probably had an illegitimate bun in the oven too which is why they had to marry her off to what was probably a local knight.

[Vaith]

1 hour ago, Eltharion21 said:

I wonder are there any theories /guesses that Mad Maid is Quaithe and she sends her visions through Glass Candle?

Isn't it also important supposed prophecy from Aegon I's time :

"If Oldtown took up arms against the Dragon, Oldtown would burn, and the Hightower and the Citadel and the Starry Sept would be cast down and destroyed.

Well, the ADWD visions are one thing, but Dany physically met Quaithe in ACOK. Dany meets her as an emissary and the other characters don't react as if she is talking to thin air. Nor do they say, "who are you?" when she acts as a representative of Qarth.

We don't know how powerful the glass candles are, but it seems unlikely that her abilities are so intricate that she can project herself as a figure who is a notable figure in Qarth. Or that Malora is travelling back and forth between Oldtown and Qarth.

Occam's razor would mean Quaithe was actually in Qarth. And that she and Malora are not the same person.

[frenin]

12 minutes ago, FictionIsntReal said:

Both Ned AND Eddard? That's two Starks for the price of one I imagine Robert was very happy they were ruling (as co-kings, like Spartans) instead of him.

That's a manner of speaking...

[Vaith]

4 minutes ago, Frey family reunion said:

According to the appendix, she’s the sixth born daughter.  The fifth born, Alysanne married to Lord Arthur Ambrose. 

But really, the birth order of daughters isn’t really that big of a deal.  At least not as big a deal as the birth order of sons.  Especially when the daughter is attractive and from a rich family.  Mormont certainly felt like he hit the jackpot.

My guess is Leyton thanked his lucky stars that some rube Lord from up north took an interest in a daughter perhaps not realizing she had a bit of a history.

The fact that Lynesse goes from Mormont’s wife to a concubine of a sleazy foreigner just kind of underscores the fact that she might be a bit loose.

As for Leyla, yea she probably had an illegitimate bun in the oven too which is why they had to marry her off to what was probably a local knight.

The supposed "bit of a history" is not alluded to when either Jorah or Maege speak about her. It could just be as simple as is in the story; that he agreed to the marriage as Jorah's boon for the tourney and naming her Queen of Love & Beauty.

And as for Leyla: then why doesn't she have any children listed in the appendix? They'd be from another house, but Denyse Redwyne's son is listed under the Hightowers. Since we know absolutely nothing about the situation it seems that assuming multiple daughters were "soiled" would be a hasty conclusion. Jon Cupps could be some influential advisor to Lord Hightower which explains it; or perhaps it was simply a pure love match in the vein of Doran and Mellario that Leyton agreed to, in the case that he is not the most shrewd politician in Westeros.

[Curled Finger]

Leyla Hightower is not the first Hightower daughter unable to bear children.  Anyone remember poor Ceryse who got saddled with Maegor?  Lynesse doesn't seem to have born any children, either. 

Lynesse, as portrayed by both Maege and Jorah sounds like a spoiled brat.  Jorah was an idiot for taking her on regardless her beauty.  I don't get that Lynesse is a really stable or engaged citizen of Westeros.   She sounds like a party girl who doesn't want to work.  Unless concubine is a job title?  

[Curled Finger]

3 hours ago, Eltharion21 said:

I wonder are there any theories /guesses that Mad Maid is Quaithe and she sends her visions through Glass Candle?

Isn't it also important supposed prophecy from Aegon I's time :

"If Oldtown took up arms against the Dragon, Oldtown would burn, and the Hightower and the Citadel and the Starry Sept would be cast down and destroyed.

There are 4 glass candles at the Citadel and 1 in Qaarth.  Well, that's all we know of at any rate. (And I really want 1 at the Wall, but GRRM hasn't given that to me yet, dang it.)   Of course, with so many candles in a single place it is not impossible that the Hightowers would take 1 or some from the Citadel for their own purposes.  Particularly if those purposes were specific to magic.   But we don't know they did, that's the catch with the Mad Maid=Quaithe idea.   Maybe better to hold that one for more information since Quaithe is actually in a place we know has a candle.  It's weird.   

I think the quote you placed is less prophecy than fact.  It was clear that the Hightowers and Faith of the Seven had to swallow a lot of humble pie in their initial dealings with the Targaryans.   Any place resistant to the new world order according to Aegon would be at enormous risk of obliteration.  Dragons, you know.   

[Damon_Tor]

The Hightowers are the power behind both the Citadel and the Faith, so their control over the culture of Westeros is staggering, and they are almost certainly players in the Mythic game we the readers only get to see peripherally, and I'm inclined to think of them as the head of the First Men Resistance faction against the Children of the Forest , and so form the two poles of that mythic conflict. It's not surprising that the three Kingsguard present at the Tower of Joy were a Hightower, a Dayne and a Whent, three of the most important houses in that faction.

I believe Jorah's infatuation with Lynesse and his victory at the tournament were both owed to magical manipulation by the Hightowers. Leyton had some reason for wanting Lynesse on Bear Island at least temporarily so he engineered the situation via sorcery. As to why: Bear Island is one of the few places with relatively easy access to the North Beyond the Wall via the Frozen Shore. If the Hightowers/Citadel/Faith have agents beyond the wall (and they certainly do) then Bear Island makes sense as a point of contact for those agents, especially if one wants to cut the Night's Watch out for some reason.

Consider the rift we know exists within the Citadel surrounding magic: there are those who want magic suppressed and those who want to use it. It's possible that at one time messages from the Hightower agents beyond the Wall would pass through Castle Black or one of the other Castles on the Wall, but perhaps as the rift in the Citadel grew wider trust was stretched thin and Leyton wanted a more direct line. Maybe Lynesse had a fairly short mission, to set up agents on Bear Island who would handle correspondences from that point onward, and after it was done she was free to do what she wanted, which meant leaving Jorah. Or maybe she was supposed to stay longer and act as a go-between directly but she went rogue and abandoned her mission. Or maybe once she had accomplished her mission on Bear Island she was supposed to find her way to Essos, and she is still on mission for her family. Supporting this interpretation, Humfrey Hightower seems to have faith that she can and provide him with a fleet.