Aegon meeting Jon

[chrisdaw]

I've only now contemplated a meeting between these two. It has some story merit I feel, though I'm not sure if it will occur. I'm hoping to provoke thoughts in replies that I haven't yet considered.

Aegon will become king or king in waiting, he will become a dragon rider, he will war against Dany, he will lose and die. He will generally want to be a good king and do the right thing.

Jon will come back, if he ever leaves, and NW or not he will take responsibility in the north for defeating the Others. That means at the very least writing to the South to warn of the threat and request help.

I can imagine a scenario in which Aegon receives Jon's pleas from the north, and rides his dragon there to see what the fuss is about. He could meet with Jon, learn of the enemy, but be rather powerless to directly help at that particular point in time due to his dragon being unwilling to cross the wall. It could end in something like Aegon assuring Jon of his help, that he will send supplies and an army, and come to help directly when the Others are at the wall. He just has to deal with the brewing dance of dragons in the south first.

Then Aegon loses to Dany, and dies, and with him is lost the promise of the south's help to the north.

[Eli Cross]

11 minutes ago, chrisdaw said:

I've only now contemplated a meeting between these two. It has some story merit I feel, though I'm not sure if it will occur. I'm hoping to provoke thoughts in replies that I haven't yet considered.

Aegon will become king or king in waiting, he will become a dragon rider, he will war against Dany, he will lose and die. He will generally want to be a good king and do the right thing.

Jon will come back, if he ever leaves, and NW or not he will take responsibility in the north for defeating the Others. That means at the very least writing to the South to warn of the threat and request help.

I can imagine a scenario in which Aegon receives Jon's pleas from the north, and rides his dragon there to see what the fuss is about. He could meet with Jon, learn of the enemy, but be rather powerless to directly help at that particular point in time due to his dragon being unwilling to cross the wall. It could end in something like Aegon assuring Jon of his help, that he will send supplies and an army, and come to help directly when the Others are at the wall. He just has to deal with the brewing dance of dragons in the south first.

Then Aegon loses to Dany, and dies, and with him is lost the promise of the south's help to the north.

I am sure the story will not happen that way.  I think it will go like this:

Aegon and his allies push the Lannisters out of King's Landing.  He receives a report that an army of wights are moving south after destroying all resistance on their path.  The army of ice.  The letter will come from the few survivors at the Night's Watch.  He will learn of the last lord commander who betrayed the men in black.  He will send army after army to head them off.  All will fail.  Finally, King Aegon VI in a desperate move, he will send a message to Queen Daenerys of Meereen, and ask for assistance.  The Queen and her dragons will arrive.  Aegon VI will demand his own dragon.  The Queen will agree to give him a chance.  King Aegon VI will fail to bond with the dragon and die in the attempt.  The population will have been reduced to a fraction of a fraction.  Queen Daenerys will ride the now enormous Drogon and destroy the wights at The Trident.  Meanwhile, the Starks will have all turned to direwolves by this time. 

[Curled Finger]

While I fully expect Aegon to take Kings Landing and perhaps crown himself king I am unsure what he will actually be king of.  The Riverlands and North are in shambles.  Who knows what horrors await the Vale and Reach once those power bases are toppled?  The Westerlands will be if they aren't already without leaders.  Would they rally for Cersei in the aftermath of her vacation of the throne?  Oh shudder to think.  The Iron Islands have declared their independence again with their king set on total destruction.  So that leaves Aegon king of the Stormlands, Crownlands and maybe Dorne.   Not hard to see Arianne & Doran being really upset if Aegon doesn't take a marriage alliance.   Oh yah, lots of potential disaster for King Aegon on more fronts than he may be able to handle.    

Was once that I thought Dany and her war machine would devastate Westeros, but the more I learn about Aegon and the Golden Company I'm not sure there will be a whole lot left for Dany to ruin when she finally arrives.   The GC is full of exiled nobles who want their former lands restored.   How will that go over with Westeros?  Aegon has elephants, not dragons and they should cause plenty of damage.  Given Dany declined Quentyn's offer of an army ready to help her take Westeros, why would she be any more predisposed to accept Aegon who took Westeros without her?   I can't see Dany giving Aegon a single thing if he even survives the instability that waits in the wake of his little conquest.   

So Jon sends a raven imploring Aegon for help.  What says that message wouldn't start out with "Yo, Bro, it's me, your long lost kin,   I know I couldn't come help out on your conquest but I was really busy being sorta dead then I had to reclaim my foster home instead of helping you.  How about you drop everything in your unstable lands and bring those elephants up this way to become wights?  It will be fun."  

I know I have a little tunnel vision in this scenario.   Just can't see these two characters intersecting.   

[Lord Varys]

2 hours ago, Curled Finger said:

While I fully expect Aegon to take Kings Landing and perhaps crown himself king I am unsure what he will actually be king of.  The Riverlands and North are in shambles.  Who knows what horrors await the Vale and Reach once those power bases are toppled?  The Westerlands will be if they aren't already without leaders.  Would they rally for Cersei in the aftermath of her vacation of the throne?  Oh shudder to think.  The Iron Islands have declared their independence again with their king set on total destruction.  So that leaves Aegon king of the Stormlands, Crownlands and maybe Dorne.   Not hard to see Arianne & Doran being really upset if Aegon doesn't take a marriage alliance.   Oh yah, lots of potential disaster for King Aegon on more fronts than he may be able to handle.    

He is a Targaryen. The North will be ignored by all, but the Vale and the Riverlands and those regions of the Reach who won't declare for Euron will fall in line.

The Westermen will resist him, of course, and possibly parts of the Reach as well, depending what the Tyrells are going to do when push comes to shove.

As for the question at hand - the new Grand Maester would most likely not even tell Aegon about a letter from this Jon Snow guy in which he claims he is his long lost/completely unknown half-brother. I mean, seriously, why should anyone give a shit?

News about the Others should be taken seriously eventually if many such letters arrive from multiple people, and if the Watch and the Northmen actually send envoys to KL telling their stories in person.

[Son of Man]

Aegon will help to fight the Others.  Any king or queen would.  He just won his kingdom and now these ice walkers want to take it away.  He will fight.  Those same reasons also tell me this.  He is not going to allow the north to leave his kingdom.  Aegon will be very suspicious of anybody, half-brother or not, raised by the Starks. 

[Bloodraven's Spider]

Really interesting topic. I think If Aegon takes KL without trashing the Faith and somehow keeps them align and under his control. He can easily let Dany into the fold, how these 2 interact with each other is the main thing. By all rights Aegon should be on the Throne, in true Targaryen tradition he should marry Dany and rule together. How they're chemistry will be will never know.

I don't think Aegon will ever live to meet Jon sadly. George is setting us up for another Dance of Dragons and sadly Aegon is legit and would have been a good king. Dany would be a kinslayer and we know how much George likes making our characters grey.

If Dany's party (with Tyrion/Jorah) and Aegons party mix in KL who is Grand Maester? Who ever they replace Pycelle with when they find out he was murdered. I think that replacement will eventually be Haldon Halfmaester. Aegon could dead at this point but Jon (he could still be dead at this point...) or who ever is LC will write to KL about the Others and Haldon having served at winterfell in his previous life (he's Walys Flowers) will have heard the tale and take it to be true as well as Tyrion hearing the tale from the old bear in the begging of our story. Aegon may sadly have been dragon food by the time this letter comes or when they head north

[chrisdaw]

11 minutes ago, Bloodraven's Spider said:

Really interesting topic. I think If Aegon takes KL without trashing the Faith and somehow keeps them align and under his control. He can easily let Dany into the fold, how these 2 interact with each other is the main thing. By all rights Aegon should be on the Throne, in true Targaryen tradition he should marry Dany and rule together. How they're chemistry will be will never know.

I don't think Aegon will ever live to meet Jon sadly. George is setting us up for another Dance of Dragons and sadly Aegon is legit and would have been a good king. Dany would be a kinslayer and we know how much George likes making our characters grey.

If Dany's party (with Tyrion/Jorah) and Aegons party mix in KL who is Grand Maester? Who ever they replace Pycelle with when they find out he was murdered. I think that replacement will eventually be Haldon Halfmaester. Aegon could dead at this point but Jon (he could still be dead at this point...) or who ever is LC will write to KL about the Others and Haldon having served at winterfell in his previous life (he's Walys Flowers) will have heard the tale and take it to be true as well as Tyrion hearing the tale from the old bear in the begging of our story. Aegon may sadly have been dragon food by the time this letter comes or when they head north

It isn't so much a question of timing I don't think as a question of if GRRM wants this meeting. All the ingredients he needs is for Aegon to have his dragon, something to call him to the north and for Jon to be back around.

[Curled Finger]

42 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

He is a Targaryen. The North will be ignored by all, but the Vale and the Riverlands and those regions of the Reach who won't declare for Euron will fall in line.

The Westermen will resist him, of course, and possibly parts of the Reach as well, depending what the Tyrells are going to do when push comes to shove.

As for the question at hand - the new Grand Maester would most likely not even tell Aegon about a letter from this Jon Snow guy in which he claims he is his long lost/completely unknown half-brother. I mean, seriously, why should anyone give a shit?

News about the Others should be taken seriously eventually if many such letters arrive from multiple people, and if the Watch and the Northmen actually send envoys to KL telling their stories in person.

You have a more optimistic outlook than I am currently experiencing, though as usual, your thoughts are likely closer to the outcome than my knee jerk reply.  I see Westeros as already pretty decimated.   Another round of fighting and taking won't make anything better.  Gads, I hadn't even taken Euron into consideration.  

The new Grand Maester?  The Citadel wanted to put a Tyrell in place previously.   How safe is the Citadel from Euron?  Who would be left?  

I was being sarcastic with the little letter monologue and doubt Jon would approach anyone with his parentage if he even becomes aware of it.   The point of that was simply to illustrate how useless the North and their concerns would be to this new king.  Aegon will have his hands full just keeping whatever parts of the pie he ends up with in line.  

[Lord Varys]

5 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

You have a more optimistic outlook than I am currently experiencing, though as usual, your thoughts are likely closer to the outcome than my knee jerk reply.  I see Westeros as already pretty decimated.   Another round of fighting and taking won't make anything better.  Gads, I hadn't even taken Euron into consideration.  

Oh, I just meant that Aegon doesn't have to conquer everything for the people to fall in line. Like, Rhaenyra and Aegon II also weren't trying to 'conquer everything' - they were just after the throne. And once they had it, things were (sort of) settled, and new uprisings started in part because of the mistakes they made while ruling.

Robert and Daemon Blackfyre also didn't (try to) conquer everything - they just intended to depose the ruling dynasty. Afterwards (they had good reason to believe) the people in the field would back down. Stannis believed the same thing, one imagines.

In that sense I think Aegon can consider himself the King of Westeros in a very real sense once he has the Iron Throne - aside from the regions where people explicitly side with/declare for rival pretenders, which might happen with Stannis in the North and with Euron in some regions of the Reach and eventually in the West if he and Cersei were to marry.

I'd agree, though, that the Reach and the Vale and Dorne aside Aegon is not likely going to translate that technical acceptance of his rule into great armies. He should have those 20,000 Dornishmen, the Golden Company, 5,000-10,000 Stormlanders, and then whoever is going to join him in force from the Riverlands and the Reach.

The Vale could also bring a lot of troops but they are a wildcard so far - although I think they are going to join with him.

5 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

The new Grand Maester?  The Citadel wanted to put a Tyrell in place previously.   How safe is the Citadel from Euron?  Who would be left?

Regardless who it will be - the point was just that whoever opens or arranges Aegon's mail is not going to bother him with some sort of letter from Jon Snow where this person tells a weird story about him being his half-brother. That would be creepy fan mail.

5 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

I was being sarcastic with the little letter monologue and doubt Jon would approach anyone with his parentage if he even becomes aware of it.   The point of that was simply to illustrate how useless the North and their concerns would be to this new king.  Aegon will have his hands full just keeping whatever parts of the pie he ends up with in line.  

Yeah, if there is going to be any interests in Northern affairs it will be to help them - if they believe the Others are a thing. But they won't send much help for wildlings stuff, nor bother fighting the Northmen if they stay in their home. The North isn't important enough to take the war to Stannis, especially not in winter - and most definitely not while Euron and Cersei are still out there, and the Riverlands are still in ruins, and the people likely starving.

Not to mention the empty treasury and all those debts. That will cripple Aegon's ability to wage new campaigns - or will cause a lot of problems if he insists waging them instead of buying food for his people.

[Curled Finger]

3 minutes ago, Lord Varys said:

Not to mention the empty treasury and all those debts. That will cripple Aegon's ability to wage new campaigns - or will cause a lot of problems if he insists waging them instead of buying food for his people.

If Aegon's smart, which remains to be seen, there is always Margaery provided he doesn't fall for Arianne. 

Always appreciate your expanded replies, bringing some calm to the masses.   

[The Young Maester]

I don’t think they’ll ever meet. But if/when Aegon takes the throne, he won’t have time to handle northern affairs even if he had a dragon he’d have his hands full trying to stabilise Westeros. Not to forget that for him to gain a dragon Dany most be in Westeros with her 3 dragons. So you have that other issue of Dany being a possible threat. So Aegon flying north is very unlikely. However an encounter between Dany and Jon is very likely.

[Rose of Red Lake]

Aegon throwing the whole game board over when he loses seems like foreshadowing of some kind, if not a character moment to show that he's not quite up to the task. It could also indicate his future as a sore loser if Dany comes to Westeros (Dany stealing Aegon's thunder, instead of the other way around). I dont really see him being a dragonrider though. I see his fate as the same as Quentyns. Jon being a dragon rider while being less of a Targaryen, while Aegon isn't a dragon rider but is more of a Targaryen, is a fascinating foil that I could see happening.