Watch, Watched, Watching: What Old Is New When There Is No New

[Zorral]

Billboards, like a lot of its viewers, really had no idea what it was saying, which was pretty darned, well.  

I've really enjoyed the three seasons of AmazonP's Original series, Red Oaks.  Great directing and use of period music, location, style and period costume (mid 1980'S ), lighting, ensemble of utterly charming actors playing characters who are not evil sobs, but nice, even if confused, no matter what their age might be. It was wonderful escape.  Now I am all sad because I've watched it all over these last 3 weeks.

And Perry Mason's almost over too.

 

[Nictarion]

I thought 3 Billboards was really good. I’m a bit biased though, as Frances McDormand is my favorite actress. Well deserved Oscars for her and Sam Rockwell, imo. Martin McDonagh Is another director I will watch anything by. 

I’m currently watching the documentary series I’ll be Gone in the Dark about the Golden State Killer on HBO. Similar subject matter to 3 Billboards, but on a much larger, and more disturbing scale. I can’t believe I wasn’t previously familiar with this case. 

[Veltigar]

Finally bit the bullet and watched Alien: Covenant which I skipped due to less than positive reviews back in the day. It wasn't as bad as I feared it was going to be and taken on its own terms it is an okay film. I would even say that it is more accomplished than Prometheus, but just like that first film, it can never quite earn its place within the wider Alien universe.

Just like its predecessor, Alien: Covenant is just such an unnecessary film. I was reading the IMDB trivia list on the film and in it they have this entry about Ridley Scott saying (and I paraphrase) "that he couldn't believe that none of the immediate Alien sequels asked the question why these creatures were created"

With Prometheus and Alien Covenant, Scott answers that question expertly. None of the immediate sequels took an interest in the why question, because no one ultimately cares. Everyone just wants to see horror and action in a sci-fi setting. Demystifying the monster is a terrible idea on that front if you ask me. 

It doesn't help that he did it in such a confused manner. The best elements of Alien: Covenant and Prometheus both involved retreads of the original film, but all the added mythology is just nonsense. Just a few little things that annoy me about his concept of the Alien universe:

Spoiler

1. I still don't understand the purpose of the Engineers or why they created humanity in the first place. Why put such a large emphasis on them in Prometheus and then not show us anything new in this film. Why were there so few of them? Why did they create us? (and the because "they can" is a monumentally lazy answer) and perhaps most important of all the triple question of Why did they send a warship to wipe us out, Why did they not send another volley after their first warship had gone missing and Why was David able to get so close to their main city without being challenged by an Engineer Space Force or Air defense or whatever?

2. The relation between David and Guy Pearce. Why does he hate Weyland so much that he wants to fucking destroy human civilization to get even? Perhaps that is something that carried over from the first film that I have forgotten about, but just the urge of creation and being on the receiving end of snide remarks from Weyland is a pretty dumb excuse

3. Poor David with all the knowledge and time in the world on his hand, does all that work to create an inferior version of the Neomorph? The white creatures might not have had acid blood and superstrength (+ their mouth was an anus), but the fast infection cycle seems much more effective than the whole xenomorph infection cycle

4. How did the Alien eggs get on the Nostromo? David was obviously flying away with the Covenant and not with some Engineer ship but somehow those eggs had to end up on that planet in time for the Nostromo to pick up on it

5. Why are Walter and David so ridiculously OP when compared to the other synthetics 

 The more I think about it, the dumber it gets, which is not a good position to be in as a film. I think it is ultimately my love of the property, the great acting and the space scenes that safe it for me.

Three other choices that greatly baffled me

Spoiler

1. The creature design (particularly the Neomorphs and the young Xenomorph) was horrendous. In a film that otherwise looks phenomenal, it is weird to drop the ball on the most important part. The adult xenomorph was better, but the way Cameron and Scott did it in the first two films with the Alien being more obscured and never seen below the knees is a much more intimidating way to shoot it.

2. The David twist. This was just dumb and it felt a little bit like the film was insulting my intelligence. As soon as he cuts his hair to look like Walter, you know he's evil and will be trying to take over Walter's place. The way he actually does it in the end, showing the struggle and then not showing the kill is also a dead give-away that David won and Walter lost.

3. The crew being so dumb. In Alien and Aliens you had an excuse. These were blue collar types, basically space truck drivers and space jarheads, but just as in Prometheus the crew in Covenant should have been made up of consummate professionals. Scientists, officers, engineers, professional astronauts, etc.

I can't believe no one is wearing a hazmat suit when exploring the foreign planet. Nor are there any qualms about trusting creepy androids. Nor do they isolate potentially infected people effectively. Nor do they ask Walter/David any questions about his fight. No one takes action to ensure that a full detailed report of the mission is send over to HQ and the list of mistakes goes on and on.  

I was initially thinking about giving it like a  7/10 but writing this down has made me realize I should adjust my score downwards.

[Derfel Cadarn]

Rewatching Antman - is it just me or are all the persons of colour used as comic relief? Even Falcon, an Avenger.

[Heartofice]

18 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Rewatching Antman - is it just me or are all the persons of colour used as comic relief? Even Falcon, an Avenger.

That really is just you. Everyone is comic relief in that movie.. it’s a comedy

[Derfel Cadarn]

7 minutes ago, Heartofice said:

That really is just you. Everyone is comic relief in that movie.. it’s a comedy

Not to the same extent. We have the three white people planning the heist mostly seriously, in contrast to Scott’s two friends (Pena and Harris) playing goofball stereotypes, almost as bad as thr minstrey transformer twins from Revenge of the Fallen.

[Heartofice]

10 minutes ago, Derfel Cadarn said:

Not to the same extent. We have the three white people planning the heist mostly seriously, in contrast to Scott’s two friends (Pena and Harris) playing goofball stereotypes, almost as bad as thr minstrey transformer twins from Revenge of the Fallen.

Did your miss out Scott’s other white friend who is part of that crew on purpose because it doesn’t fit?  Or that Falcon is not used as ‘comic relief’, but is simply given funny moments in the same way that other characters are, and is pretty consistent with how he is in other movies.

I could equally turn around and say that the Antman movies portray men as bumbling buffoons and women as the real heroes.

But, a bit like your point, that would be a silly thing to say wouldn’t it.

[RumHam]

3 hours ago, Veltigar said:

 

  Hide contents

1. I still don't understand the purpose of the Engineers or why they created humanity in the first place. Why put such a large emphasis on them in Prometheus and then not show us anything new in this film. Why were there so few of them? Why did they create us? (and the because "they can" is a monumentally lazy answer) and perhaps most important of all the triple question of Why did they send a warship to wipe us out, Why did they not send another volley after their first warship had gone missing and Why was David able to get so close to their main city without being challenged by an Engineer Space Force or Air defense or whatever?

 

 

 

The movies do a terrible job of explaining it but Scott and some of the other writers have explained some of these things in interviews. From memory:

The Engineer from the opening of Promethus who seeded earth with intelligent life did so against the wishes of his society (hence the title.) So the Engineer government decided to wipe humanity out, but around the same time their society basically collapsed. I think it was because of a goo leak but I'm not sure. Anyway the Engineers on the planet that David and Shaw go to were supposed to be refugees or the last survivors of their once proud race or something.

Also at one point they considered revealing that jesus was an engineer, and that it was only then after he stirred up humanity that they decided to eliminate us.

For what it's worth Scott is now talking about making a third prequel that would actually explain how the ship from Alien ended up crashed on LV-426. Which was all most of us wanted from Prometheus....

[Isis]

14 hours ago, Nictarion said:

I’m currently watching the documentary series I’ll be Gone in the Dark about the Golden State Killer on HBO. Similar subject matter to 3 Billboards, but on a much larger, and more disturbing scale. I can’t believe I wasn’t previously familiar with this case. 

Ah, yes, I meant to push that book up my TBR pile so that I could read it before watching the show. 

Watched Free Solo at the weekend. I am a sucker for anything to do with mountains tbh. My dad has been a climber for 50-odd years and I could basically stare at mountains and trees all day. That said, I don't know why it took me so long to get round to watching this. Maybe because watching the actual climb made my hands and feet sweat? They brought in an interesting angle - by having the guy who want to do something incredibly dangerous be having a try at being in a serious relationship with someone who kinda doesn't really want him to do something incredibly dangerous. There really is no right answer to that one. 

Right after this finished there was a documentary where the free climbing dude (Alex) went on this Euro odyssey adventure with Bear Grylls and just as they were about to step over the edge of a cliff (to climb down), he said 'OH, ARE YOU ABOUT TO FALL TO YOUR DEATH, BEAR GRYLLS, HAHAHAHAHA?' which was nice. 

[Isis]

8 hours ago, Veltigar said:

 

Three other choices that greatly baffled me

  Hide contents

I can't believe no one is wearing a hazmat suit when exploring the foreign planet. Nor are there any qualms about trusting creepy androids. Nor do they isolate potentially infected people effectively. Nor do they ask Walter/David any questions about his fight. No one takes action to ensure that a full detailed report of the mission is send over to HQ and the list of mistakes goes on and on.  

I was initially thinking about giving it like a  7/10 but writing this down has made me realize I should adjust my score downwards.

Yeah, really. I mean, REALLY really. I remember thinking at the time that there must be other (less lazy writing) ways for people to get infected - make mistakes, get distracted, or whatever. But the way they chose to have it happen in the film is so monumentally unlikely to happen BECAUSE IT'S NEEDLESSLY DANGEROUS. I just hated it after that.

[Goro]

I need a good show out there, either from outside the United States or from the United States (so it can be Russian, Chinese, Iranian, what have you).

I just can't find a good show that isn't set in the modern world or is a drama or something. I need something much more adventurous, you know? Something like Game of Thrones (though not with the same bad quality that it had since season 3). I need something that's a different genre than most TV shows or streaming serials out there. Could be fantasy, scifi, horror, etc. but I just need something that isn't, say, a crime drama or cop serial.

[RumHam]

8 minutes ago, Goro said:

I need a good show out there, either from outside the United States or from the United States (so it can be Russian, Chinese, Iranian, what have you).

I just can't find a good show that isn't set in the modern world or is a drama or something. I need something much more adventurous, you know? Something like Game of Thrones (though not with the same bad quality that it had since season 3). I need something that's a different genre than most TV shows or streaming serials out there. Could be fantasy, scifi, horror, etc. but I just need something that isn't, say, a crime drama or cop serial.

Mad Men, Devs, Six Feet Under, Deadwood, Succession, and Barry are all good. 

[Goro]

2 minutes ago, RumHam said:

Mad Men, Devs, Six Feet Under, Deadwood, Succession, and Barry are all good. 

Thanks! But is there anything a bit more... fantastical? Something that uses made-up elements that aren't derived from any sense of "realism?" I hope I'm able to explain myself.... I'm also looking for shows that came out in the last five years or are running now. More shows like The Mandalorian, for example.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

I hate to be overly harsh, but  Cursed really is complete trash.

[Cas Stark]

39 minutes ago, Goro said:

Thanks! But is there anything a bit more... fantastical? Something that uses made-up elements that aren't derived from any sense of "realism?" I hope I'm able to explain myself.... I'm also looking for shows that came out in the last five years or are running now. More shows like The Mandalorian, for example.

The Witcher is not 'good' but many have liked it anyway.  Westworld has been great to good for most of its 3 seasons, but it demands a lot of attention to detail.

[Goro]

38 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

The Witcher is not 'good' but many have liked it anyway.  Westworld has been great to good for most of its 3 seasons, but it demands a lot of attention to detail.

I wish I could've gotten into Westworld when I watched the first three episodes. I just couldn't. It's not for me. The extreme violence and nihilism is off-putting to me. It's interesting, but it's not really something I like. I'm sure it's good for other people, just not for me.

[Veltigar]

On 7/19/2020 at 4:14 PM, Tywin et al. said:

Same lead actress, who is a Margot Robbie doppelganger. They look as similar as Nicole Simpson and Megyn Kelly. 

Just saw the Babysitter it was fun all in all. Definitely not something anyone is missing out on, but probably the best of the three films I have seen the last three days.

The best part of the film are the 

Spoiler

way the usually cliche victims are the bad guys here

In particular, I'd like to give a shout-out to Andrew Bachelor, playing the stereotypical black guy character XD He was so much fun 

Spoiler

I feel like I lost a bit of interest in the film after he died.

 

2 hours ago, Isis said:

Yeah, really. I mean, REALLY really. I remember thinking at the time that there must be other (less lazy writing) ways for people to get infected - make mistakes, get distracted, or whatever. But the way they chose to have it happen in the film is so monumentally unlikely to happen BECAUSE IT'S NEEDLESSLY DANGEROUS. I just hated it after that.

They could just have 

Spoiler

David infect them. I think that would have been far more clever. Just have some renegade Neomorphs attack them (there must be some left-overs, unless they also kill each other) and they seek shelter in David's Necropolis.

They could then have turned David into this sort of Draculean character slowly poisoning his guest a bit like the recent BBC series "Claws of the Beast" did so well. As long as the storm lasted, David would have been free to play with them and then in the end they could realize that they have been infected all along when they return to the ship.

 

[Veltigar]

7 hours ago, RumHam said:

The movies do a terrible job of explaining it but Scott and some of the other writers have explained some of these things in interviews. From memory:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

The Engineer from the opening of Promethus who seeded earth with intelligent life did so against the wishes of his society (hence the title.) So the Engineer government decided to wipe humanity out, but around the same time their society basically collapsed. I think it was because of a goo leak but I'm not sure. Anyway the Engineers on the planet that David and Shaw go to were supposed to be refugees or the last survivors of their once proud race or something.

Also at one point they considered revealing that jesus was an engineer, and that it was only then after he stirred up humanity that they decided to eliminate us.

For what it's worth Scott is now talking about making a third prequel that would actually explain how the ship from Alien ended up crashed on LV-426. Which was all most of us wanted from Prometheus....

 

Yeah, that makes a bit of sense. Still unnecessarily convoluted, but if anything along those lines had actually been in the movies it would have been okay. 

[Corvinus85]

9 minutes ago, Veltigar said:

Yeah, that makes a bit of sense. Still unnecessarily convoluted, but if anything along those lines had actually been in the movies it would have been okay. 

What annoys me the most about the plot of both prequels is the lack of brains among all the "qualified" people. The crew of the Nostromo did a much better job with the tools and skills they had to attempt to solve their problem.

[Veltigar]

2 minutes ago, Corvinus85 said:

What annoys me the most about the plot of both prequels is the lack of brains among all the "qualified" people. The crew of the Nostromo did a much better job with the tools and skills they had to attempt to solve their problem.

Yeah agreed, @Isis and I also remarked on that earlier. I wonder how much of that is Ridley Scott's belief system filtering in through the narrative. The man has a habit of slagging experts and cosmopolitan city dwellers in exchange for propping up burly real men/women from the periphery in his filmography. 

Blade Runner, Gladiator, Kingdom of Heaven, Alien, Prometheus, Alien: Covenant, Exodus, etc. they all share that trait.