GRRRM rewriting after season 8?

[Ser Maverick]

Yeah, I'm guessing he saw the negative reaction to "Dany kinda forgetting about the Iron Fleet" and began furiously rewriting.

In all seriousness no. People put way too much stock in the show's content when it's pretty clear that the writers were just making it up as they went along. I have to imagine whatever plot points they got from him were portrayed severely out-of-context or just done so badly that there would be no reason for George to be influenced by the reaction to them.

[Rose of Red Lake]

Did it matter how many children Scarlett O'hara had? In both mediums Rhett leaves her and she's still a damn fool with "gumption"

 

[BlackLightning]

On 12/27/2020 at 6:58 PM, Rose of Red Lake said:

Did it matter how many children Scarlett O'hara had? In both mediums Rhett leaves her and she's still a damn fool with "gumption"

 

Actually yes it does matter.

The more children she has changes the way the audience perceives her. If she has, say, 5 children and still carries on like she has absolutely no common sense, then that paints a very different picture of the character than if she only had 1 child. If she has 5 children by different men, that also says something.

[Rose of Red Lake]

7 minutes ago, BlackLightning said:

Actually yes it does matter.

The more children she has changes the way the audience perceives her. If she has, say, 5 children and still carries on like she has absolutely no common sense, then that paints a very different picture of the character than if she only had 1 child. If she has 5 children by different men, that also says something.

I seriously doubt that. Had a kid with multiple husbands who died? Who cares. Audiences during that time were living that kind of life themselves and still do today. And the men fall all over her too, it's not just her. Scarlett loses her only kid in the movie and still has two in the books. Still, endings are the same, with Scarlett finally realizing that she didn't love Ashley but loves Rhett and Rhett leaving her at that moment, and then Tara blah blah blah god...this story is overrated.

[AegonTheWet]

I think DnD specifically came up with an ending that allowed for the majority of the main characters to return for a potential movie or special somewhere down the road. Like what netflix did with breaking bad. HBO made too much money from this to not try to keep some kind of potential reunion down the line.

[Lord of Blackhaven]

On 7/8/2020 at 11:07 PM, Amris said:

I am wondering something which I'll throw out to you guys: is one of the reasons why GRRM takes a lot longer than initially projected maybe that he has seen how badly seasons 7 and 8 misfired?

 

I'm inclined to think that this may be the case. Hopefully George has enough personal and professional pride to not want the awful fanfiction of Season 8 to stand as the final word on his epic story. I would like to think that he has spent the last 1.5 years rewriting massive amounts to try to take the story in a direction as far from the show as possible to avoid the stink of that turd of a final season.

Really though, he's probably written nothing. Clearly he has lost a lot of momentum (9.5 years between books and counting, really man?!). So much so that I would be surprised if he himself ever finished the series. It will be finished posthumously, if at all.

[Lady Winter Rose]

23 hours ago, Lord of Blackhaven said:

Hopefully George has enough personal and professional pride to not want the awful fanfiction of Season 8

If is fanfiction, why need to rewrite it then? Or let me rephrase it better, if showrunners made fanfiction, something that had nothing to do with books, what is Martin rewriting? "Fanfiction" or good source material? Oh, yes, George is immaculate and perfect, while showrunners made fanfiction. Then no need to rewrite it.

[Lady Winter Rose]

My take to situation is that Martin is struggling to finish it because he got tied up in knots and ambition. Ambition to have great branching story, knots due to branching story. During the years Dance was being written, he continued to call issue of writing it a Mereeneese knot.

It's also the fact that he might lost inspiration. Everybody have issue of lost inspirations.

I came to conclusion that if Martin wrote a page per day, he would conclude Winds already.

[Lord of Blackhaven]

21 hours ago, Lady Winter Rose said:

If is fanfiction, why need to rewrite it then? Or let me rephrase it better, if showrunners made fanfiction, something that had nothing to do with books, what is Martin rewriting? "Fanfiction" or good source material? Oh, yes, George is immaculate and perfect, while showrunners made fanfiction. Then no need to rewrite it.

As mentioned earlier in the thread, maybe Martin saw some of his ideas play out on screen and didn't like how they actually looked?

Maybe King Bran sounded good in his head, but when fleshed out on the show he saw it was weak, nonsensical and a huge anticlimax (to many people).

There's no doubt that his biggest problem is that he made the story too big. He was too ambitious. The complicated plot was by his own design. I love the story, but paring it down would have saved him a huge amount of trouble. Kudos to Martin for thinking big and creating an epic story, but maybe a story spread across two continents involving hundreds of characters with overlapping timelines and events was slightly too ambitious? It wouldn't surprise me if Martin himself has lamented not scaling back the story somewhat.

What do I know though. I just want to read the next book!

[Endymion I Targaryen]

I believe the rewrite will be more on DOS if ever he gets there. The basic ideas of the ending of the show are problably the same with the books so its negative reception will be a thing.

In Winds the problem is the overexpansion of the story which makes the need for a new book between Winds and Dream or a split of Winds in two books.

[Valandil]

The idea that he’s working on DOS rather than WOW is comical. Should we accept that he’s working on any ASOIAF novel?  It’s been ten years since the last book people, any statement he’s made on deadlines have been extremely inaccurate or worse. It’s sad, but obviously the poor guy just can’t do it. Enjoy what you like about the first 3, or 3.5 maybe and make alternative plans! And I don’t dislike GRRM. He’s written some great books. 

[Crixus]

Yeah, I mean I've finally arrived at the point where I've given up on ever getting WoW, let alone DoS. It's sad, but nothing to be done. He's clearly not incapable of finishing this. He had the opportunity to create an impressive legacy, but instead he'll likely be remembered as an extremely gifted author who couldn't finish his magnus opus, and instead gave a mediocre ending to his fans via another medium. 

 

 

[FluffyWillow]

On 7/9/2020 at 8:07 AM, Amris said:

I am wondering something which I'll throw out to you guys: is one of the reasons why GRRM takes a lot longer than initially projected maybe that he has seen how badly seasons 7 and 8 misfired?

I hope not. By how he talks about ASOIAF, the impression I get is that he has a lot of stories to tell, but the hard part is commiting some to the pages while letting go of too many "bad seeds". I don't envy him, really, it's a lot of pressure trying to finish something that you've made people wait for, for a long time.

I hope he doesn't change his plans on the story. As for the TV show spoiling the book  - you can't spoil a book, it's about the journey taking you to the inevitable ending. At least for me it is. And I know GRRM is more capable of good storytelling than the HBO showrunners.

[BranPan]

On 7/9/2020 at 8:07 AM, Amris said:

I am wondering something which I'll throw out to you guys: is one of the reasons why GRRM takes a lot longer than initially projected maybe that he has seen how badly seasons 7 and 8 misfired?

I think it's just the contracts with HBO. They knew their eight GOT season would hack the original story to peaces, so they may have made it part of the contract for the series (or a later follow-up-contract). Something like "another book of this novel series must not be relesed until 2023" maybe.

[Castellan]

It's possible the way the show's turned out affected him, but also his work is so incredibly detailed - the more you dig the more stuff you find - like the way a chapter echoes another chapter about another POV, all sorts of references and echoes, it seems like layers of enamelling. In rereading specific chapters long after my first read I notice how well written they are and that they tend to have a stand alone quality - as in serialised novels - so I'm not surprised it can take forever.

As someone who always hands things in late I don't see that much need for an explanation anyway.

Also the final season of the show is so bad I think he must have withheld quite a lot! The only explanation for the floundering nonsense is that they didn't have a clue and the money was in the bank already. Do we know he gave them all the main characters end points, by the way? I would like to know although it will really disturb me.

[The Bard of Banefort]

His recap of 2020, in which GRRM claimed that he had written hundreds of pages over the course of the year but still had hundreds more to go, makes me wonder if at some point in the not-too-distant past, George tossed the entire manuscript and started from scratch. I can't think of any other reason why he would still have hundreds of pages left, especially since he originally thought he could finish it in a few months back around 2015-16 (unless he's also been simultaneously writing D&E/F&B pt. 2, and was referring to that as well). I used to think that TWOW got derailed because George had become so invested in the shows, but now I've come to believe that the pressure has really gotten to him. George strikes me as something of a perfectionist, and I think he's too nervous to release TWOW out into the world for that reason.

[Mithras]

2 hours ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

His recap of 2020, in which GRRM claimed that he had written hundreds of pages over the course of the year but still had hundreds more to go, makes me wonder if at some point in the not-too-distant past, George tossed the entire manuscript and started from scratch. I can't think of any other reason why he would still have hundreds of pages left, especially since he originally thought he could finish it in a few months back around 2015-16 (unless he's also been simultaneously writing D&E/F&B pt. 2, and was referring to that as well).

I can think of a reason for why he still have hundreds of pages left: in the last decade, George spent many years not writing a single word of TWoW.

[The Bard of Banefort]

10 hours ago, Mithras said:

I can think of a reason for why he still have hundreds of pages left: in the last decade, George spent many years not writing a single word of TWoW.

I guess, but like I said, at one point he thought he would have it done in a few months. 

[The Winged Griffin]

6 minutes ago, The Bard of Banefort said:

I guess, but like I said, at one point he thought he would have it done in a few months. 

Not just at one point, but several times. Did he not say that there could be two ASOIAF-related books (F&B and TWOW) released in 2018?

He also said people could basically imprison him on an island if he didn't finish TWOW for Summer 2020.

At last, it seems like he's learned from his mistakes, and doesn't want to take the risk of giving any kind of hint at a release date anymore.

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

51 minutes ago, The Winged Griffin said:

Not just at one point, but several times. Did he not say that there could be two ASOIAF-related books (F&B and TWOW) released in 2018?

He also said people could basically imprison him on an island if he didn't finish TWOW for Summer 2020.

At last, it seems like he's learned from his mistakes, and doesn't want to take the risk of giving any kind of hint at a release date anymore.

Either way, the fact that he wants to write another D&E story before diving into ADOS is worrying to me. Didn't he say that he regretted going on a big promotional tour after finishing ADWD because he ended up losing all the momentum he had? I know it's not really the same thing, but still, he has been burned twice already.