Jump to content

US Politics: Butter Not Guns


DMC

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Simon Steele said:

Here is a NYT article by Lara Bazelon (her and her sister Emily are both well-respected) about exactly why this is incorrect. It's not about her race, it's about what she did to people of color.

It's not that people "didn't bring facts" (so Ben Shapiro sounding), but that the facts are troubling. She is very similar to Klobuchar in this way. I don't care if people like her, she's been chosen, but to denigrate those critical of her as being duped or as other posters suggest being racist, is just a simple way to dismiss valid criticisms of her that will come up again.

I've read it. A few citations illustrating poor judgment, held up as what, she's not perfect so she's no good-- it's just more toxic purity bullshit that's becoming an increasingly odious, and honestly, kind of dehumanizing calling card of the far left. Be perfect or you suck. GTFO

In the article her truency initiative is cited as damning yet fails to mention not ONE SINGLE PARENT was actually put in jail. Or that it was for chronic offenders that missed like more than 80 days or some shit, and it was all about keeping kids in school. Because thats bad. Or no? The article doesn't even mention her back on track initiative, etc.

Generally, one sided reporting like that is considered a hit piece. But hey, don't take it from me. Take it from a defender that often found herself across from Harris.

Who to believe? 

Tough one.

That's what I meant about facts. Your facts aren't shit if they're selective.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Today was the Democratic primary in CT but no mail-in ballot ever arrived for my wife or I.  There’s only one polling station in our entire town today (population ~20k), so social distancing was a real concern.  If there was anything actually at stake still in the primary I would have been pissed.

Now I’m just worried about whether mail-in ballots will be available for November.  We completed our change-of-address forms several weeks ago and indicated that we wanted mail-in ballots.  But when my wife called today to ask why we hadn’t received any for the primary, she was told they had no record of us requesting them.  It was a very clear, particular box we checked on the forms. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Tywin et al. said:

Since we're talking religion, it's worth noting the irony that the ultra conservative religious right claims to worship a far left liberal hipster, who was a brown skinned Jew that kicked it with immigrants and said rich people don't go to heaven.

Sigh.

Also a refugee during his family's flight into Egypt. I often wonder how many Christians have actually read the Bible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Excellent choice for VP. I thought the Harris is a cop thing was BS. Most Governors in Washington state are former AG, it is a common springboard for high office. The current AG Ferguson is very left wing and you might be hearing from him someday. I wonder if he'll receive the same attacks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, JEORDHl said:

I've read it. A few citations illustrating poor judgment, held up as what, she's not perfect so she's no good-- it's just more toxic purity bullshit that's becoming an increasingly odious, and honestly, kind of dehumanizing calling card of the far left. Be perfect or you suck. GTFO

In the article her truency initiative is cited as damning yet fails to mention not ONE SINGLE PARENT was actually put in jail. Or that it was for chronic offenders that missed like more than 80 days or some shit, and it was all about keeping kids in school. Because thats bad. Or no? The article doesn't even mention her back on track initiative, etc.

Generally, one sided reporting like that is considered a hit piece. But hey, don't take it from me. Take it from a defender that often found herself across from Harris.

Who to believe? 

Tough one.

That's what I meant about facts. Your facts aren't shit if they're selective.

Ok. Lara Bazelon and her sister Emily are huge criminal reform advocates and considered top scholars in the field. But hit piece. Gotcha. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Simon Steele said:

Here is a NYT article by Lara Bazelon (her and her sister Emily are both well-respected) about exactly why this is incorrect. It's not about her race, it's about what she did to people of color.

It's not that people "didn't bring facts" (so Ben Shapiro sounding), but that the facts are troubling. She is very similar to Klobuchar in this way. I don't care if people like her, she's been chosen, but to denigrate those critical of her as being duped or as other posters suggest being racist, is just a simple way to dismiss valid criticisms of her that will come up again.

Really, the same as Klobuchar? The same one that shit all over progressive ideas? At minimum there is a huge stylistic difference. I do recall Harris taking large risks on healthcare during the nom fight though, which may have cost her.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Simon Steele said:

Ok. Lara Bazelon and her sister Emily are huge criminal reform advocates and considered top scholars in the field. But hit piece. Gotcha. 

That's your take away, Simon? 

You linked it, didn't you read it? If you did, did we read the same piece? It was mostly a tear down with little to no acknowledgment of the progressive positions Harris advocated and/or regressive that she stood against? If not a hit piece what kind of article would you call that then?

Grinchy Gossip? Scroogey Spin? 

You know how many times since Harris stood up for Pres, that I read people trashing on her about harsh pot sentencing [on this board] when they were only parroting something they heard

Niki Solis, a public defender from San Fran and a Chair of the Public Defenders' Office Racial Justice Committee is full of shit?

But your take away is your woke heroes couldn't possibly have muddied the water because they liked someone better for it?

Get lost. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What seems unlikely in These Times: no constant media blathers about the shooting that happened somewhere on Pennsylvania Ave. the other night ... the very few to downright scarce bits I've seen are all bits and don't even agree on what happened or where it happened.

This seems so unlike the media generally for a politician in connection with a gun event, one wonders what if anything happened at all -- other than some guy is dead, who is dead because supposedly judged a threat to ... a cop? ... a politician?  Who knows? We don't.  No name, no nothing.  Nothing at all.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, JEORDHl said:

That's your take away, Simon? 

You linked it, didn't you read it? If you did, did we read the same piece? It was mostly a tear down with little to no acknowledgment of the progressive positions Harris advocated and/or regressive that she stood against? If not a hit piece what kind of article would you call that then?

Grinchy Gossip? Scroogey Spin? 

You know how many times since Harris stood up for Pres, that I read people trashing on her about harsh pot sentencing [on this board] when they were only parroting something they heard

Niki Solis, a public defender from San Fran and a Chair of the Public Defenders' Office Racial Justice Committee is full of shit?

But your take away is your woke heroes couldn't possibly have muddied the water because they liked someone better for it?

Get lost. 

That's my take away. People are in prison, some for life. That's not a purity test. That's truly just fucked up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Simon Steele said:

That's my take away. People are in prison, some for life. That's not a purity test. That's truly just fucked up.

Good for you? I know statistics are generally made up on the spot so I won't speculate. Do you think you're a lone man out in the wild on that? Or maybe on some leftbro commune, while the rest of us are what, urban zoo bitches?

I've donated to anti-carceral orgs, and to bail funds. I'm probably not quite-as-left as you -yet- I have the objectivity to actually read some otherwise sourced material and make up my own fucking mind on who is who and what they're about. 

I seriously don't have the patience for this virtual signalling, yo. Like, I'm getting angry.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

College football season is circling the drain, and with it any hopes Trump had of a "rocketship" recovery. McConnell is already begging for stimulus talks to resume. The only question is how long it takes Trump to accept reality.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

41 minutes ago, Zorral said:

What seems unlikely in These Times: no constant media blathers about the shooting that happened somewhere on Pennsylvania Ave. the other night ... the very few to downright scarce bits I've seen are all bits and don't even agree on what happened or where it happened.

This seems so unlike the media generally for a politician in connection with a gun event, one wonders what if anything happened at all -- other than some guy is dead, who is dead because supposedly judged a threat to ... a cop? ... a politician?  Who knows? We don't.  No name, no nothing.  Nothing at all.

This article seems to have quite a few details.  Nobody appears dead.  

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2020/08/11/shooting-near-white-house-under-review-suspect-did-not-have-gun/3342734001/

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, DMC said:

Yeah I woulda been fine with Duckworth, but I think Harris' better.  Particularly to takeover in 4 years.  Also, if you're fine with Duckworth, I don't see not being fine with Harris in terms of lefty credentials.  Not like there's any discernible difference between the two in ideology.  Grisham..I dunno.  He needed someone exciting.  Not sure she excites many, even Hispanics.

Early predictions you're hearing here first: if all goes well and Harris is atop the ticket in 2024, Duckworth will be her running mate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Jaxom 1974 said:

Early predictions you're hearing here first: if all goes well and Harris is atop the ticket in 2024, Duckworth will be her running mate.

But what about the uneducated white male swing voters?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

ETA:  That HATE identity politics, btw!!!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

End of the day the Running mate pick is more for entertainment value. I don't imagine there is a single election where the running mate was the difference between winning and losing. Happy to be schooled on this assumption though.

I think Biden made a good choice going with Harris. If there is anyone on the left who is going to be pissy about Harris as running mate, they really need to stop looking at the current political system as the way to achieve real revolutionary social and economic change in the US. I don't think the US (or any other democracy in existence today) political system is capable of achieving any real fundamental change. It's a broken system that needs to be torn down and rebuilt on entirely new social justice principles.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

27 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

End of the day the Running mate pick is more for entertainment value. I don't imagine there is a single election where the running mate was the difference between winning and losing. Happy to be schooled on this assumption though.

I think Biden made a good choice going with Harris. If there is anyone on the left who is going to be pissy about Harris as running mate, they really need to stop looking at the current political system as the way to achieve real revolutionary social and economic change in the US. I don't think the US (or any other democracy in existence today) political system is capable of achieving any real fundamental change. It's a broken system that needs to be torn down and rebuilt on entirely new social justice principles.

That's the kind of revolutionary change I can get behind, but until enough people can be convinced to actually revolt and tear the thing down, then I don't get why I shouldn't be advocating for the people who will push for the next best thing.

ETA: In that vein, Omar won the primary in Minnesota's 5th.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, JEORDHl said:

Good for you? I know statistics are generally made up on the spot so I won't speculate. Do you think you're a lone man out in the wild on that? Or maybe on some leftbro commune, while the rest of us are what, urban zoo bitches?

I've donated to anti-carceral orgs, and to bail funds. I'm probably not quite-as-left as you -yet- I have the objectivity to actually read some otherwise sourced material and make up my own fucking mind on who is who and what they're about. 

I seriously don't have the patience for this virtual signalling, yo. Like, I'm getting angry.

I'm not sure what you're going on about. I provided you with factual things Harris was part of--what conclusions you derive are your business. But there is more than enough reason for people to legit be skeptical of her.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, The Anti-Targ said:

End of the day the Running mate pick is more for entertainment value. I don't imagine there is a single election where the running mate was the difference between winning and losing. Happy to be schooled on this assumption though.

I think Biden made a good choice going with Harris. If there is anyone on the left who is going to be pissy about Harris as running mate, they really need to stop looking at the current political system as the way to achieve real revolutionary social and economic change in the US. I don't think the US (or any other democracy in existence today) political system is capable of achieving any real fundamental change. It's a broken system that needs to be torn down and rebuilt on entirely new social justice principles.

@Fez mentioned a while back that he was a fan of gradual, incremental change within a democracy and I’m very much also within that camp. I think the idea of ‘tearing it down’ within a democratic system is for children who have recently been introduced to Rage Against the Machine.

There are mechanisms within the current system to improve the system.  It’s never going to be easy to do that, there has to be a fight over it. If there’s no fight then there’s no democracy because it really doesn’t matter what the subject is you’ll never get 100% of a human population sample to agree on anything.  I believe that justice will always ultimately win as long as we preserve the environment for that to happen. I think we’d all do well to be dubious of any person or movement that promises a complete solution tomorrow. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...