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Black sheep of Family


One-eyed Misbehavin

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I say Arya because she definitely feels the odd one out and this feeling of rejection is thick throughout her chapters. She questions whether she's a bastard as she looks different from her full sibs but looks like the other black sheep bastard brother. She resents how Sansa does everything perfectly except numbers and she's always compared to her. She's left-handed. She runs around messy all the time. Her insecurity is so extreme that she even questions whether Catelyn really wants her back.

This isn't the case so much to the reader. We know that Ned has been southernized by his time in the Vale. When Cat looks at the Mormont women who Arya resembles in personality, she wonders if she's been like Lynesse in not adapting and keeping her ways when she should have let some of them go. We see Lyanna and Brandon and their excess wolf's blood in Arya.

Basically Arya's only the black sheep* now because the Starks have drifted to being partly southernized. Otherwise, she'd have fit in great and not felt so misunderstood.

*Most of the main characters are black sheep one way or another if we want to look for it.

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On 8/8/2020 at 5:54 PM, Lord Lannister said:

I mainly was comparing her to her siblings. She doesn't seem to carry the Tully traits in appearance. Even on her Stark side she seems less about duty and honor and more about morality and feeling when acting.

Seems more like George has been inspired by the Ugly Duckling fairytale with Arya a Stark/swan standing out so much being surrounded by Tullys/ducks. She will eventually blossom and find her place. 

Ned isn't exactly the traditional Stark archetype either. He's been tempered by his Southern upbringing. 

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8 hours ago, Lollygag said:

I say Arya because she definitely feels the odd one out and this feeling of rejection is thick throughout her chapters. She questions whether she's a bastard as she looks different from her full sibs but looks like the other black sheep bastard brother. She resents how Sansa does everything perfectly except numbers and she's always compared to her. She's left-handed. She runs around messy all the time. Her insecurity is so extreme that she even questions whether Catelyn really wants her back.

This isn't the case so much to the reader. We know that Ned has been southernized by his time in the Vale. When Cat looks at the Mormont women who Arya resembles in personality, she wonders if she's been like Lynesse in not adapting and keeping her ways when she should have let some of them go. We see Lyanna and Brandon and their excess wolf's blood in Arya.

Basically Arya's only the black sheep* now because the Starks have drifted to being partly southernized. Otherwise, she'd have fit in great and not felt so misunderstood.

*Most of the main characters are black sheep one way or another if we want to look for it.

Um, I don't believe so.  Arya is the most Stark besides Jon Snow.  Arya, Jon, old Brandon, Lyanna, Theon Hungrywolf came out of the same mold.  The Stark which stands out is Sansa.  She's no better but she is not part of that wolf pack.  She doesn't have as much of their savage nature.  

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8 hours ago, Skahaz mo Kandaq said:

Um, I don't believe so.  Arya is the most Stark besides Jon Snow.  Arya, Jon, old Brandon, Lyanna, Theon Hungrywolf came out of the same mold.  The Stark which stands out is Sansa.  She's no better but she is not part of that wolf pack.  She doesn't have as much of their savage nature.  

So is that why there’s a theory somewhere that Littlefinger is Sansa’s father?

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18 hours ago, Skahaz mo Kandaq said:

Um, I don't believe so.  Arya is the most Stark besides Jon Snow.  Arya, Jon, old Brandon, Lyanna, Theon Hungrywolf came out of the same mold.  The Stark which stands out is Sansa.  She's no better but she is not part of that wolf pack.  She doesn't have as much of their savage nature.  

I think you misunderstood my post.

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On 8/11/2020 at 6:01 PM, Arthur Peres said:

Lancel maybe?

I think he is similar to his uncles tyg and gerion and his father as they lived in tywins shadow. Lancel lived in jamies.

But AFFC and ADWD lancel is a zealot which is certainly unique to lannisters

Nice choice

I think Tywins fathers qualities make him unique to the others we know of

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On 8/9/2020 at 3:47 AM, Hodor the Articulate said:

Roslin Frey, the only looker of the Frey clan.

No, that does not seem to be the case.

Well, she is a maid wedded, but the bedding's yet to come. No doubt she's as terrified as I was. Robb was seated between Alyx Frey and Fair Walda, two of the more nubile Frey maidens.

Fair Walda has a brother nicknamed 'the sweet' so their branch is probably decent looking.

Amerie is also seen as attractive, with her fair share of admirers despite her Frey chin.

She was a long-legged, full-breasted, strapping girl of some eight-and-ten years; a healthy wench to look at her, though her pinched, chinless face reminded Jaime of his late and unlamented cousin Cleos, who had always looked somewhat like a weasel.

 

The Freys probably seem worse because of the age of their Lord and heir. Most of their most notable members are older than the majority of other characters in the book. Walder's grandson Ryman is around the same age as Brynden Tully.

 

If the focus on House Lannister was not so much on Jamie and Cersei and their offspring but a still living Tytos (he's younger than Walder) Tywin, Kevan, Genna and Stafford we'd probably not view that House the same way.

 

 

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21 minutes ago, Curled Finger said:

But have you seen the fan art depictions of Euron?   Hubba hubba...

Euron reads as really hot in the books. I bet the blue lips even give him some kind of bad boy punk vibe. Then there's the crazy... Can't wait for TWOW.

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1 minute ago, Lollygag said:

Euron reads as really hot in the books. I bet the blue lips even give him some kind of bad boy punk vibe. Then there's the crazy... Can't wait for TWOW.

Agreed all the way around!

The fan art gives life to the characters that mere descriptions don't--at least in my estimation.   So pleased to find another who appreciates the sheer beauty of Euron! 

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  • 2 weeks later...
10 minutes ago, Skahaz mo Kandaq said:

Well hello there.  I have not heard this one in a long time.  It's not popular.  Know which alternate father is more intriguing?  Brandon fathering Jon. 

Maybe Bonifer Hasty as Rhaegar’s father. I brought that one up awhile back.

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Another Black Sheep for Targaryens: Aegon IV the Unworthy (at least for direct family). Contrast with his capable father Viserys II, Aemon the Dragonknight who was regarded as the best knight of his age, and the quiet, kindhearted Naerys. Then there’s his son Daeron II who was a capable monarch who managed to bring Dorne into the fold.

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